Contact   Imprint   Advertising   Guidelines

Kite design software

forum for kitesurfers


User avatar
sq225917
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 8775
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2002 1:00 am
Kiting since: 2000
Gear: 10 Nemi HP, 15m Flysurfer..
Brand Affiliation: none, formally BEST Marketing Director.

Postby sq225917 » Thu Sep 30, 2004 7:35 pm

dax, thats so not the case, rhino from mcneal associates was the first freeform nurbs surface modelling package to run on piss weak pc's with under powered processors and marginal ram. it integrated many higher end functions typically limited to much broader capability applications into a very compact app.

whilst not having the level of interface development so beloved of studio tools users, or the feature recognition and design integration functions of packages like catia and pro-e, its a great little tool for people looking to ma...........ah lets get back to talking kites you'll have me beeting on about the relative merits of fully programmable shading languages and photorealistic hardware renderers next.

User avatar
kitemaster
Frequent Poster
Posts: 377
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 1:00 am
Kiting since: 1999
Local Beach: Binnenschelde
Favorite Beaches: Brouwersdam
Style: having fun
Gear: Slingshot REV 9 + 13mtr
Airush protoy 135
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

Postby kitemaster » Thu Sep 30, 2004 8:08 pm

If you take a standard cad program and you want to change something you have to draw every element, so if you want to do small changes you have to edit the complete drawing and not only, as a example, change the aspect ratio.

Or not ?

User avatar
Dax
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2757
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 12:41 am
Kiting since: 0
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Portland, Oregon

Postby Dax » Thu Sep 30, 2004 9:25 pm

sq225917 wrote:dax, thats so not the case, rhino from mcneal associates was the first freeform nurbs surface modelling package to run on piss weak pc's with under powered processors and marginal ram. it integrated many higher end functions typically limited to much broader capability applications into a very compact app.

whilst not having the level of interface development so beloved of studio tools users, or the feature recognition and design integration functions of packages like catia and pro-e, its a great little tool for people looking to ma...........ah lets get back to talking kites you'll have me beeting on about the relative merits of fully programmable shading languages and photorealistic hardware renderers next.
:o

I like steak. :thumb:

ryansurf1
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 666
Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2004 2:21 am

Postby ryansurf1 » Thu Sep 30, 2004 9:40 pm

sq.....how the hell do you go from modeling software sales to kites? Ah, doesn't matter. Kites sound like more fun. I know as i spend a fair amount of time in front of the big boy ACAD package....the 3D aspect is time consuming, far from automated, and requires skilled operators.

I must say i am surprised that there is not add-ons that integrate aerodynamics...actually not surprised as the variables are many and the complexities greater....

I assumed that the big brands had propriatary packages that gave clues to performance, such as the abiltiy to change the AR, AOA, foil depth, camber, LE config. sections, strut size and number. So the CAD package is just a means of output to turn a 3D model into 2D info that can be cut and sewn...

That being said the design of the modern inflatable is more of an art based on solid science....with the use of some off the shelf CAD packages....

Reality is most kites are very similar.....

How many 'kite desginers', such as Don, Ken, and Eric are there?

User avatar
sq225917
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 8775
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2002 1:00 am
Kiting since: 2000
Gear: 10 Nemi HP, 15m Flysurfer..
Brand Affiliation: none, formally BEST Marketing Director.

Postby sq225917 » Thu Sep 30, 2004 10:06 pm

kitemaster: 'cad packages' is a broad term, industry guys would generally call something like rhino a nurbs modelling package. it using relational data to define the shapes of all objects in a system. so if you make a solid cylinder and then make the top thinner the side walls will taper automatically without any user intervention.

so it becomes piece of piss, to rough out a 3d kite shape and then start altering things like, curve, aspect, span length for any part of the design and have the software update all interconnecting bits automatically. a basic 2d cad package like autocad doesnt do this.


ryan: i was working for a graphics hardware technology company, we plugged into every cad package, http://www.art-render.com, (check out the speaker image in the gallery)sales and marketting in sales and marketting, you make a product, test it, get people involved in feedback, improve it and sell some more.

most big ass cad packages have 100's of plugin applications for them, you make a model export it into the wind tunnel plugin and bobs your uncle, data that bears little resemblence to the true complexity of the elastic system that is a lei kite...

some of the big guns are likely using variants of commercially available cad app's with specific plugins desinged to their needs, something like surfplan pretty much does it all.

User avatar
cglazier
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2331
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2002 1:00 am
Kiting since: 1999
Gear: Naish, North, Ozone, MikesLab, Taaroa
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Vancouver, Canada

Postby cglazier » Fri Oct 01, 2004 2:49 am

The dvd The Complete Guide to Kitesurfing (the one that has free clips posted each week on this forum) has an interview with Naish designer Don Montague that has several minutes of him demonstrating his kite design software. It looked pretty good. It definitely didn't look AutoCAD based to me.

:wink:
Chris Glazier

User avatar
kitemaster
Frequent Poster
Posts: 377
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 1:00 am
Kiting since: 1999
Local Beach: Binnenschelde
Favorite Beaches: Brouwersdam
Style: having fun
Gear: Slingshot REV 9 + 13mtr
Airush protoy 135
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

Postby kitemaster » Wed Oct 06, 2004 7:36 pm

Can somebody capture the part on kitedesign and post it.

10 years ago I was helping a windsurf sail designer with sail designing. He was making prototype sails for a couple of brands.

All the brands where advertising with autocad design. Well the guy didn't even had a computer or autocad :-)

Surfplan is the only kite design software package available, i think.

http://www.surfplan.com.au/sp/

User avatar
sq225917
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 8775
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2002 1:00 am
Kiting since: 2000
Gear: 10 Nemi HP, 15m Flysurfer..
Brand Affiliation: none, formally BEST Marketing Director.

Postby sq225917 » Wed Oct 06, 2004 9:03 pm

kitemaster you can design kites on any piece of 3d shit. however to test them, you need to have either, on-board or plugin, fluid dynamics, finite element analysis and net creation tools, or something similar.

surfplan is pretty universal as it has the tools, but last time i used it, 3 years back it was still primarilly geared up for solids, and kites arent solids, they are complex flexural systems.

User avatar
kitemaster
Frequent Poster
Posts: 377
Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 1:00 am
Kiting since: 1999
Local Beach: Binnenschelde
Favorite Beaches: Brouwersdam
Style: having fun
Gear: Slingshot REV 9 + 13mtr
Airush protoy 135
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

Postby kitemaster » Thu Oct 07, 2004 12:05 pm

The new version of surfplan looks good and by filling in some menu's you can design a new kite.

And for testing, since it;s a flexural system, you can't do that with a computer. The final test is alway's at the beach.

I remember a old gaastra video where they where driving with a truck in a dessert testing the loose leach of a surfing sail.

They where pussing it till the mast snapped.

User avatar
sq225917
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 8775
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2002 1:00 am
Kiting since: 2000
Gear: 10 Nemi HP, 15m Flysurfer..
Brand Affiliation: none, formally BEST Marketing Director.

Postby sq225917 » Thu Oct 07, 2004 2:45 pm

and by filling in some menus you can design a kite, that must be just like the famous "make animation not crap button" on 3dsmax a few seasons ago.


Return to “Kitesurfing”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: RadDrDuke and 11 guests

cron