Foil kite vs. inflatable kite

[Kamikuza]

I was waiting for people to pass downwind of my so I could dive and start riding ... ZOOM down she goes, like a bloody Stuka

[FredBGG]

In wave riding, Hindenburg is when you turn towards the kite while on the wave, and it doesn't drift back fast enough, causing the lines to go slack, or for you to get under the kite... and the ktie falls out of the sky like a leaf from a tree. Your only hope of recovery is to turn away from the kite and try to take up the slack in the lines before it hits the water.

Wind shadows and funky wind at point breaks make things worse.

Foils will drift back from much bigger mistakes.

Here is an old video of mine that shows the Psycho 3 drifting back from oblivion
all by itself while my head was under water

I actually was not as close as it looks in the video.... compressed prespective by a long lense.

[njrider]

Great comments everyone (even the pumpkin). Based on your comments and reviews, I'm leaning towards the speed 3. Is this a good foil kite to start with?

[Dave_5280]

First of all when the inventers of the LEI came up with the idea they decided not to go into manufacturing themselves, but preferred to license the type of construction to whoever wanted to make it. The result was many brands hitting the market. Along with the many companies third party manufacturers also appeared. These companies mainly in China can get new companies up and running with a product in no time. That is why we see new brands popping up all the time.
This has also increased competition so these companies have been forced to spend a lot on marketing. However this has not led to much differentiation in the company’s products. There are not huge differences in kite designs. The vast majority are basically all making the same kite.

Fred - Sounds a lot like the IBM PC vs. Apple computer rivals...

[FredBGG]

First of all when the inventers of the LEI came up with the idea they decided not to go into manufacturing themselves, but preferred to license the type of construction to whoever wanted to make it. The result was many brands hitting the market. Along with the many companies third party manufacturers also appeared. These companies mainly in China can get new companies up and running with a product in no time. That is why we see new brands popping up all the time.
This has also increased competition so these companies have been forced to spend a lot on marketing. However this has not led to much differentiation in the company’s products. There are not huge differences in kite designs. The vast majority are basically all making the same kite.

Fred - Sounds a lot like the IBM PC vs. Apple computer rivals...

Kind of creepy isn't it.....

I fly mainly foils for fun and games, but use PCs as a pro Photographer.

[FredBGG]

Great comments everyone (even the pumpkin). Based on your comments and reviews, I'm leaning towards the speed 3. Is this a good foil kite to start with?

If you are after a low wind kite with great jumping and the float of a paraglider... yup.

I'll be getting mine this week so I'll be able to tell you more first hand.

I'll put it through the paces this week-end.

What sort of riding are you whanting to do with the speed.
Also what's your weight and windranges you want to ride in?

[mv]

Let me try and break it down for you by telling you why I ride foils. Also, please disregard anything said by PMU. He only posts ani-foil lies and nothing else on this forum so he does not carrry any weight.

I started on inflatable "C" kites back in the day. When the "bow" kites first came out I was thinking about getting one but my "C" kites had a 5th line and I really liked it for safety and relaunch. My friend who is an FS dealer told me about the FS Pulse which was getting ready to hit the market. It had the same type of depower as the bow kites, could be self launched and landed, and had a 5th line safety. After some research and contemplation I order a 13m. Up to this point I had 0 foil experience. The first day I got the kite I was completely blown away by how fast I could set the kite up. I have timed myself and I can get an FS kite from the bag and into the air in 3 minutes and 30 seconds.

Over the years I went from the original Pulse to Psycho 3 and a Speed 2 19m to the Pulse 2. In all I have owned 11 FS kites or different flavors.

Here are what I like about FS kites:

1. Easy set up and break down. I have yet to meet a LEI that can beat me onto the water. As I mentioned before I can get the kite in the air in 3:30.
2. The kites fly great. I have never had any issues and I ride in all sorts of wind conidtiond, light wind, sub 10 knots, high wind, over 35 knots, gusty wind, on-shore, side-shore, off-shore. The kites work for me in all conditions.
3. The kites take a beating and keep on ticking. I have not had a single LE defaltion or strut go out since I swtiched to foils I have crahsed my kites on the beach, in the water, on rocks, in bushed, and once in a tree. I have only had one kite get a tear and that was from a piece of wood with a nail in it on the beach. I was able to fix the kite, on the beach, with a needle and thread in under 5 mins and still launched and had a great session.
4. FS kites hold their vaule. I have sold 7 FS kites in order to buy new models. In each case I was very happy with the money I was able to get back.
5. FS kite pack down very small. I am able to fit 4 kites, 14m, 12m, 8m, and 6m, in a standard duffel bag and fits very nicely in my car.
6. FS kite relaunch so easy. FS kites to do not sink in impact with the water, as some had tried to say.
7. FS kites fly in much lighter wind than LEI kites due to the lack of extra weight from bladders etc. I have been on the water many times when the wind dies and all of the LEI kites fall out of the sky while I am able to keep my kite in the air without any problems.
8. FS does not release a new version of their kites every year. They work on one model at a time and do not release the kite until it is ready. Some may see this as a downside but I see it as an upside. The kites are always great, right out of the bag, and it helps keep the resale value up evern after 2 years or more.

Here is what I do not like about FS kites.

1. The kites are more expensive but not really that much more unless you are going for the top end Deluxe editions.
2. FS kites have to be tuned often. The kites can get out of tune, especially the larger sizes in higher winds after only a couple of sessions. A tuneup only takes about 10 minutes but is well worth the effort.
3. I do not like the FS bags, especially for the larger sizes.
4. FS will not make me a team rider and give me all of the free kites I want
5. ... I can not think of anything else.

FS kites are like the Mac to a Windows machine. Some people get it and some people do not. I have friends that have tried foils and switched back to LEI because they just do not understand the difference. Foil kites are not the same as LEI kites and will feel different. This is not bad, just the way it is. I am now so used to FS foils that I do not like the feal of LEI kites, and I have tried a lot.

In the end only you can make the choice. All of the posts, pro or con, do not mean a thing if you are not happy with what you have as your kit. I highly suggest that you get a test ride and learn how to maintain the kites from someone who knows how. FS kites are can be tuned to fly the way you want. If you fly a kite that is tuned for one type of rider and it does not match you riding style you might get turned off to the kite. Also the type of kite you try will have an impact. I fly the Pulse 2 as these kites work better in the waves which is what I like. I have tried the Psycho 4 but I do not like the feel of the kite as I am not a freestyle rider. I have not tried the Speed 3 yet, hopefully this week I will be able to get a ride.

As to why more people do not ride foils, that is a mystery to me. I had several friends that marvel at how quickly I can get on the water. They always make comments about how I can hit the water while they are still pumping and be 15 minutes into my session before they get their kite in the air. Or they mention about how quickly the kite relaunches or how fun it looks in the waves, but they are soo stuck in their mind set that foil kites do not work that they refuse to believe what they see with their own eyes and stick with LEI kites and that is okay. To each their own.

FS is not hurting for business. Each kite they release sells well, is usually sold out before it is even released via pre-orders, and keep putting out great kites. I do not think FS feels the need to be in the comps. as much as other kite coompanies due. Most FS kiters are die hard and will buy FS kites no matter what.

I hope you get a chance to give one a try.

BTW I would recommend the Pulse 2 for a biginner with foils not a Speed.

[voodoospirit]

despite it s a very good light wind kite, the speed²/3 is an aggressive kite, fast travelling, parked at the edge of the window, so u need to have a good knowledge in Kite handling.
it s nor a small aspect ratio kite like the LEi or PL/ pulse²-psycho4 kite.

it s a very efficient kite but need an efficient rider, despite the speed3 seems to be more stable and forgiving than the speed² in unstable winds (gusty winds)

multi-role foil: pulse² (cost is the same as the LEi in the regular fabric) ex: delta shape kite, waroo.
freestyle: psycho4 (cost close to the LEi in the regular fabric)
lightwind/race/hang time: speed3. ( give a rib or a leaver for the SA version )

[herculon]

@mv: nice story! i love foils too, started many years ago with an opencell foil (pkd buster II 3qm) on the beach. now i got a peter lynn scorpion for cheap, and though it sometimes is a bugger to launch, i still love the no-pump charm of foils.
mv, did you ever use peter lynn arcs? whats your opinion about them?

[voodoospirit]

wow, someone still use a scorpion...... the feedback made me make a U turn from that kite and screamm alllll the way back to my venom² then i bought a synergy and prolly go for a 2nd hand charger when i ll find one....