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Re: Best way to smooth the landing during a big air
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 10:50 am
by John-B
ice wrote:This is interesting to me.
I know to land softly on a jump you re-direct the kite forwards. You can continue and complete the downloop.
Can someone explain the science of this to me?
It seems so counter intuitive - why does redirecting the kite forward and toward the water, give you lift?
You want some forward speed when you land so you are on a plane seamlessly - think of an airplane landing and it is getting the angle and speed right?
If just trying to soften your landing then some kites you can sheet in to 'parchute' but you will plop down and sink before having to dive the kite and get going again.
Downloops are very easy, but maybe spend some time just looping your kite on a wide beach or in some shallow water to get a feel for how and where the power comes with your particular kite?
Re: Best way to smooth the landing during a big air
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 4:46 pm
by knotwindy
yea, you're right, at first thought is doesn't make sense but
the kite needs to move through the air to have pull or lift and
since it is almost always over your head hight even when down looping it slows your drop and
it adds forward speed as well to keep you from sinking as the board will plane a bit.
the difference is in how much vertical pull as opposed to how much forward pull but any is better than none and you can adjust the difference by when you pull the loop and how fast.
Re: Best way to smooth the landing during a big air
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 6:42 pm
by edt
kites are like airplanes. You never see a 747 stop above the airport to land and then tumble to the ground. Increase of horizontal speed of the wing generates lift on the kite surface, lift on the kite pulls you up. Just like an airplane you need speed to generate lift. Now it's possible when you redirect the kite for the landing to move the kite at the last second back behind you to stall your horizontal motion and your vertical motion so you land soft as a feather, this is equivalent to doing a "flare" on an airplane or paraglider. For kiteboarders though, we generally like to land hot because this leaves you riding and ready for your next trick so when we redirect we tend to leave the kite ahead of us so we both have more speed and less vertical motion.
Re: Best way to smooth the landing during a big air
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 3:13 am
by ice
knotwindy wrote:
the kite needs to move through the air to have pull or lift and
since it is almost always over your head hight even when down looping it slows your drop
This explanation makes the most sense to me.
Not sure about the airplane analogy. When a plane is diving toward the ground I don't think it is generating much lift. When you do a downloop the kite is diving toward the water when it gives me lift.
Re: Best way to smooth the landing during a big air
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 7:33 am
by Lanc
Toby wrote:e.g.:
jumping to the right:
kite is left of zenith before landing: downloop it (pull right hand)
kite is right of zenith before landing: kiteloop it (pull left hand)
If you are 8m high, and the kite is forward or in front, means to the right of the zenith, and you get forward speed and are about to crash hard, you send the kite backwards to a kiteloop, by pulling the bar left side. The kite will loop above you (helicopter loop), and bring you under the kite again for a smooth landing.
I really needed those once, when I was lit on a 14 sqm kite in gusts up to 35 knots. Well I jumped 14m high, but when the kite was forward, I would have broken everything in my body...but looping it backwards made me land as soft as can be.
Try it next time when you are about to get busted with a kite too far forward to land soft...and you will see what happens!
Thanks for this explanation Toby. I am comfortable with kiteloops in low jumps/transitions/slides but the heli loop has always puzzled me in the past. I could never quite figure out what and when todo to get that heli effect. I tried a few of them yesterday as per your description above and it works wonders to soften what would have usually been a rather fast and hard landing. Thank you guys for bringing up this subject.
Re: Best way to smooth the landing during a big air
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 8:56 am
by Toby
That sounds great
Re: Best way to smooth the landing during a big air
Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 12:16 am
by Westozzy
Agreed tried it yesterday. Always prone to downlooping more than forward looping. But it depends on the zenith reference point. Where the kite is in reference to the zenith is a great reference point, thanks Toby.
Thing is I'm on edges so doesn't matter where it is in reference to the zenith redirect the other way and you land softly. I'm just looping cause I can. Lol
Re: Best way to smooth the landing during a big air
Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:33 am
by ice
Westozzy wrote:. Always prone to downlooping more than forward looping.
What is the diff b/n downlooping and forward looping?
To me a downloop is looping the kite with your front hand, down toward the water, transition, kite turns 180, and you ride in the opposite direction.
A forward loop starts the same, but you complete a 360 with the kite such that you can continue riding in the same direction as inititally.
Re: Best way to smooth the landing during a big air
Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 2:02 am
by Toby
ice wrote:Westozzy wrote:. Always prone to downlooping more than forward looping.
What is the diff b/n downlooping and forward looping?
To me a downloop is looping the kite with your front hand, down toward the water, transition, kite turns 180, and you ride in the opposite direction.
A forward loop starts the same, but you complete a 360 with the kite such that you can continue riding in the same direction as inititally.
That is correct. Maxbe he meant a kiteloop (looping backwards)
Re: Best way to smooth the landing during a big air
Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 3:56 am
by JGTR
Down loop/Kite loop isn't really relevant when doing heli- loops. Kite is above my head, doesn't matter what way I loop it, only difference is if I down loop I usually do a transition (change direction) if I kiteloop I usually carry on in the same direction.
End of day at the apex of my jump I'm neither going left or right, I'm facing down wind with kite above me, I either loop left or right and will then land going in direction the kite exits the loop.
I appreciate the direction I was travelling will determine whether it is a down loop or kiteloop but doesn't really matter with heli loops.