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New North Kitesurfing bar for 2017 (april fools I hope!)

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xenosd
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Re: New North Kitesurfing bar for 2017 (april fools I hope!)

Postby xenosd » Thu Aug 25, 2016 10:44 am

Some comments (north user):

*"Conversion from 4 to 5 lines": :thumb: (other brands use it already)
*"PU center lines": :thumb: (other brands use it already) I would like this too to have.
*"Configurable Y": :thumb:
*Cost: it is pretty high (as many north products), but I see that also Cabrinha, Naish and Airush (probably more) have raised their bar prices too much, as well. :roll: Is there something involved that we don't know? :roll:

The fact that you can own just one bar to use on different kites (4/5 line, low/high Y) is very nice.

To be honest, I already have 2 5-line bars and I will stick to those, as I see no significant reason to move on.
I also cannot understand why with clickbar it is easier to use the de(power), as the single handle seems very simple and easy to me. :-?
Lastly, what is more complicated is more likely to fail in some part. Hoping that this is not the case, as a malfunctioning bar is not something you want to experience, while you are out there. :nono:

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Re: New North Kitesurfing bar for 2017 (april fools I hope!)

Postby FabsPH » Thu Aug 25, 2016 11:23 am

Jerome Bonieux wrote:
FabsPH wrote:
Sure, sand will find its way in there, we never claimed that it was sealed.
The thing is that the mechanism is simple enough that it isn't sensitive to some sand entering.
If you do feel that it is getting a bit sticky, presumably because there is sand in there, open the rubber plug and sink you bar under water. You have good chances to clean what was causing the problem.
In case that is not enough, remove the two side bolts which allows you to inspect and clean anything that might be in there. I repeat myself once again, realistically you will only get to this point once every 20 sessions.
The whole point of using this mechanism rather than another one is because of its non sensitivity to sand and salt. The only way to convince you is to try it out. No point arguing over something you have never experienced.

I like the engineering and thinking behind it , but as you and I said, need to try it out.
We , as average users always try to make a bar as simple as possible, fiddle with cleats, pulleys, etc., would not imagine this. but if this is the way to go, I embrace it
remember the wind up bar from back in the day? hey...

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Re: New North Kitesurfing bar for 2017 (april fools I hope!)

Postby alexeyga » Thu Aug 25, 2016 1:49 pm

Lol, I just noticed that they got rid of the bar's width adjustment in favor of that mumbo-jumbo... Interesting thinking... If there was any...

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Re: New North Kitesurfing bar for 2017 (april fools I hope!)

Postby iriejohn » Thu Aug 25, 2016 5:15 pm

alexeyga wrote:Lol, I just noticed that they got rid of the bar's width adjustment in favor of that mumbo-jumbo... Interesting thinking... If there was any...
Just buy two of them of different lengths, any fule can see that's the solution. ;-)

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Re: New North Kitesurfing bar for 2017 (april fools I hope!)

Postby oobird » Fri Aug 26, 2016 6:20 pm

iriejohn wrote:I think I understood what was said by oobird.

And these videos are hilarious, talk about a victory of complexity over simplicity and elegance: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2393636 Image

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Re: New North Kitesurfing bar for 2017 (april fools I hope!)

Postby oobird » Fri Aug 26, 2016 6:26 pm

alamos_kiter wrote:
Teabageppo wrote:I don't get this fascination with the apparent need for unlimited throw...
Depends on kite and riding. You mentioned waves, and there are others. Throw is trim without fumbling buttons or cleats or trim straps: just push out or pull in. I use a long throw setup where I go from slack to full stall with bar movement only. I have a trimmer to adapt for different kites, stretch etc., to set a sweet spot. Trimmer use is once or twice per session, the rest is bar in, bar out.

I don't have CL or hook though. 12 inches more usable throw than the gimmick for a start :thumb:

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Re: New North Kitesurfing bar for 2017 (april fools I hope!)

Postby oobird » Fri Aug 26, 2016 6:27 pm

cor wrote:
oobird wrote:...so...bere they are, thiz a video that we can easily find in YouTube....luckyly, from my point of view, is of course an interesting "evolution", I think, and it is just my opinion, that is not going to work for beginners or fresh ntermediates or medium level. Sailing with my sails...woops! Sorry, kiting with my kites, it is an evidence that I need to retrim constantly, and I am not talking about 5/7 knots gusts, I am talking about spots with heavy winds in which gusts are more than 10/15 knots! At the opposite situation is working for sure for steady and termicals winds and breezes, and big sails, always hoping to do not find yourself not stucked in full power and the bar at the top, unable to manage the new system, with no repower at all. So, my opinion is that, kiting whit a bar set without the repower is quiet a suicide, could you imagine this stuff used in all the brand new ion clubs???ok , the bar is tested for many years, but it look really like the idea is stoled just for a matter of marketing, just to be always on the front line of....without even thinking that maybe was better to buy it, with complete upgrades, and not thinking that "oh! f*** that....we have all we need to do it better!"....yes, sure, but look, the guy who had this new /refreshed idea, is not stupid, and you should ask to your boss, or yourself, why at the end he didn't built yet! 'Cause he is a looser...no, because he care what is doing, a good idea and good stuf, are good when theare safe and usefull, not really when you just can think that you can sell it, because a professional rider is able to use it....i'like to see some of them carving on a bloody huge wave, with a bar without depower, like this one! And hear their opinion at the moment in wich the'll need full power, and at the same time, pull the bar, and twist the small extremity of, like with old cofee mixers....while at the same time, we should ask to ourselves, who tested it, because for sure and of course, they didn't gave this to any beginners, to test it....and is normal that is a kind of product which is oriented to experienced people, but there is no safety at all in this.
https://youtu.be/5sZz0Li4pI8
Wall of Text. Level 999.

No idea what you are talking about. What the hell is "repower"? If you are talking about "depower"; This bar has MORE depower stroke than normal bars and is therefore better in gusty conditions. Check your facts or explain in a more readable way what you mean.

And yes, they gave it also to schools with beginners when testing and they were doing fine, mostly because beginners are not biased by the clamcleat. But yes, it is actually meant for more experience riders.

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Re: New North Kitesurfing bar for 2017 (april fools I hope!)

Postby oobird » Fri Aug 26, 2016 7:33 pm

...dell, it is clear that the the first matter is the level of the rider, and same for the kind of conditions, in which, he love and enjoy his ride. What I was trying to figure out is this: a gusty spot, in which whit "readeble gusts" on the water are pushing you instinctively, to repower your sail, because there will be more than +15 knots in the gust, this is sensed to make yo release the bar, and retrim the repower "just before the gust", if you don't to show how to smash your own face concrete waters, due to speed....I call this the "air grind and smash toe side face slamslash!", or so called "tangent"....it is clear, also that: while you go upwind, you should "repower" or run full power, but going downwind, you are sensed to repoweryour sail/kite, because the sum of your speed and the established wind, is too much power and speed, and it gonna turn in a "run for the hell's due to speed and a too big surface (of the twintip, NLR the surf), and absence of weight and displacement....for my skills, so sailing or kiting around 360°, that kind of system is not usefull, I don'like to just "go....and back...", and I care about navigation rules....then, to answer about waves....how many times, I should be sensed to touch and trim the repower, or that "handle", to set the bar and his power and distance from me, to avoid: to fall in the waters, and rolled by waves, because too much power or not too enough? The answer is, obviously, as many, as the "traditional system". And this, for me is the clue!just this....on that bar there is no depower! There is, instead a "back line trimming system", which it could be really usefull, in releasing the lines, but not this much useful if you have to "twist" to repower your sail kite. To be clear I am not talking about steadywinds or flat even choppy waters, and even extreme winds or spot conditions, is just about heavy gusts, which are giving the way to ask yourself if is better to rig 6 or 7....because if you need 4/4.5...."click me!!"....let this stuff in the bag....an error, just one stupid error....and you get sticker with the bar at the top, you arms are not enough longhers to get it properly, maintaining a steady stance, bacli es too shorters, and the "release button too high and far"....we all agree, I am sure, that at this point we already activated the safety release, so called chicken loop....but it looks, that not this much of people are this "faster"....then from this clue, for my opinion there is a "big lack" of safety. Even if it is stamped on the leading edge that, blablabla....it some thing like to read on the notice, of a bicycle, that you do not have to brake first with the "front brakes"....and this it is true, it is stamped....
Anyway, at the basics, is going upwind is less or more full power, and going downwind is less power than upwind, than at the same time, if you star to surf a huge way, if you are not able to retrim quickly your bar and backline tensions, your kite is remaining inside the the window, and probably, behind the wave, which the risk to see/have the lines digging in it...because there is no power enough.....OK you release the button, and repower but is too late any way, because you have to pull the bar near to you, and this gonna "brake" again the kite, and the still in the wave, manage a "power stroke", in the half of the window, because at the bottom there is a wave....(I hope i am clear and not making confusion....), and we are talking to surf a wave in downwind, not in "upwind"....and even just go, and back, and slam in the face a trick, from 5 meters far from the sand....for the rest is cool stuff, I can "maybe agree", but I feel that in a kind of way, the cycle is repeating, it works, sure, but there are too much "not in there or not like that", for my opinion....
The second point is the price, as everybody knows, now north and ion and mistral clubs are a unique brand, so now, and actually they will have huge resources for the research and developpement, it is a bit unfair, for my opinion to introduce a so complicate product, at a lower price, even for a marketing operation, because it gonna turn in a killing commando operations against all the brands, because they will probably in the time accuse a loss of budgets, customers....(think just to the amazing and huge quantity of second hand, and free used from the last year, since the moment, you are finding the last season kites and brand new sails, boards, wetsuirt, impact vests, surfs...just in next ion clubs????this is awful!!!!!for the market first, and the other brands....), and some body of course will come to buy the businesses who are going down, to refresh them, in this new direction....just because the matter is to sell, and the first one on The season calendar!!!!to close my point of view, I'll tell you this, about of all written here up, and being in a spot with some like 60(!) Kitesurf schools, and also about the amount of the deadly (unluckyly)accidents, due to the techniques applyed in teaching (not enough safety, self rescue, help each other, and coastal help,like boats or jetsky's, against the volume of business that this sport is representing, and want to afford....)the Spanish guy, simply answered: "...that's why, we have insurances....."....that's why I am thinking that my idea was stoled three years and a bit more ago, even finished....not even perfectionated...barely useful, but even like that, is representing a huge amount of value....and a position in the market, which starts to look more like a monopoly, instead just a market...
My simple opinion...sorry if English is understandeable for some....

oobird
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Original brand bars, 17"x20mt
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Re: New North Kitesurfing bar for 2017 (april fools I hope!)

Postby oobird » Fri Aug 26, 2016 7:53 pm

Other example, here in TARIFA, somebody told me that is more convenient to change an entire north bar with the previous model, than buy new lines for the later one....I didn'check it, but due to the amount of second hand that is produced, I think that check this news, is losted time...

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Re: New North Kitesurfing bar for 2017 (april fools I hope!)

Postby Lokihel » Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:21 am

oobird wrote:...dell, it is clear that the the first matter is the level of the rider, and same for the kind of conditions, in which, he love and enjoy his ride. What I was trying to figure out is this: a gusty spot, in which whit "readeble gusts" on the water are pushing you instinctively, to repower your sail, because there will be more than +15 knots in the gust, this is sensed to make yo release the bar, and retrim the repower "just before the gust", if you don't to show how to smash your own face concrete waters, due to speed....I call this the "air grind and smash toe side face slamslash!", or so called "tangent"....it is clear, also that: while you go upwind, you should "repower" or run full power, but going downwind, you are sensed to repoweryour sail/kite, because the sum of your speed and the established wind, is too much power and speed, and it gonna turn in a "run for the hell's due to speed and a too big surface (of the twintip, NLR the surf), and absence of weight and displacement....for my skills, so sailing or kiting around 360°, that kind of system is not usefull, I don'like to just "go....and back...", and I care about navigation rules....then, to answer about waves....how many times, I should be sensed to touch and trim the repower, or that "handle", to set the bar and his power and distance from me, to avoid: to fall in the waters, and rolled by waves, because too much power or not too enough? The answer is, obviously, as many, as the "traditional system". And this, for me is the clue!just this....on that bar there is no depower! There is, instead a "back line trimming system", which it could be really usefull, in releasing the lines, but not this much useful if you have to "twist" to repower your sail kite. To be clear I am not talking about steadywinds or flat even choppy waters, and even extreme winds or spot conditions, is just about heavy gusts, which are giving the way to ask yourself if is better to rig 6 or 7....because if you need 4/4.5...."click me!!"....let this stuff in the bag....an error, just one stupid error....and you get sticker with the bar at the top, you arms are not enough longhers to get it properly, maintaining a steady stance, bacli es too shorters, and the "release button too high and far"....we all agree, I am sure, that at this point we already activated the safety release, so called chicken loop....but it looks, that not this much of people are this "faster"....then from this clue, for my opinion there is a "big lack" of safety. Even if it is stamped on the leading edge that, blablabla....it some thing like to read on the notice, of a bicycle, that you do not have to brake first with the "front brakes"....and this it is true, it is stamped....
Anyway, at the basics, is going upwind is less or more full power, and going downwind is less power than upwind, than at the same time, if you star to surf a huge way, if you are not able to retrim quickly your bar and backline tensions, your kite is remaining inside the the window, and probably, behind the wave, which the risk to see/have the lines digging in it...because there is no power enough.....OK you release the button, and repower but is too late any way, because you have to pull the bar near to you, and this gonna "brake" again the kite, and the still in the wave, manage a "power stroke", in the half of the window, because at the bottom there is a wave....(I hope i am clear and not making confusion....), and we are talking to surf a wave in downwind, not in "upwind"....and even just go, and back, and slam in the face a trick, from 5 meters far from the sand....for the rest is cool stuff, I can "maybe agree", but I feel that in a kind of way, the cycle is repeating, it works, sure, but there are too much "not in there or not like that", for my opinion....
The second point is the price, as everybody knows, now north and ion and mistral clubs are a unique brand, so now, and actually they will have huge resources for the research and developpement, it is a bit unfair, for my opinion to introduce a so complicate product, at a lower price, even for a marketing operation, because it gonna turn in a killing commando operations against all the brands, because they will probably in the time accuse a loss of budgets, customers....(think just to the amazing and huge quantity of second hand, and free used from the last year, since the moment, you are finding the last season kites and brand new sails, boards, wetsuirt, impact vests, surfs...just in next ion clubs????this is awful!!!!!for the market first, and the other brands....), and some body of course will come to buy the businesses who are going down, to refresh them, in this new direction....just because the matter is to sell, and the first one on The season calendar!!!!to close my point of view, I'll tell you this, about of all written here up, and being in a spot with some like 60(!) Kitesurf schools, and also about the amount of the deadly (unluckyly)accidents, due to the techniques applyed in teaching (not enough safety, self rescue, help each other, and coastal help,like boats or jetsky's, against the volume of business that this sport is representing, and want to afford....)the Spanish guy, simply answered: "...that's why, we have insurances....."....that's why I am thinking that my idea was stoled three years and a bit more ago, even finished....not even perfectionated...barely useful, but even like that, is representing a huge amount of value....and a position in the market, which starts to look more like a monopoly, instead just a market...
My simple opinion...sorry if English is understandeable for some....
I am sure that what you said is interesting, but I just can't read that giant block of writing.

Please write in paragraphs if you are going to say that much. Like this it is really too hard to read.


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