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Looking for a 12 mt wave kite that turns fast, feels light and drifts. Exists?

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Dimitri M
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Re: Looking for a 12 mt wave kite that turns fast, feels light and drifts. Exists?

Postby Dimitri M » Mon Jan 29, 2018 2:29 pm

This is the Kiteboarding mag review on the SURF 12m kite. Now it is all up to you.

P.S. I do have two SURF 12 demos for sale for $400 kite only + shipping. If any one interested email me directly at: dimitri@epickites.com.
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CaptainCore
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Re: Looking for a 12 mt wave kite that turns fast, feels light and drifts. Exists?

Postby CaptainCore » Mon Jan 29, 2018 2:53 pm

Psst.. I could tell you.. but then I'd have to kill you... but there's something new coming from our favourite brand in early spring that might be of interest... :)

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Re: Looking for a 12 mt wave kite that turns fast, feels light and drifts. Exists?

Postby Laughingman » Mon Jan 29, 2018 3:39 pm

Jwoo wrote:
Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:04 pm
Laughingman wrote:
Fri Jan 26, 2018 9:27 pm
alfredo68 wrote:
Fri Jan 26, 2018 8:23 pm
Heard that Neo 12 its slow, sst 12 quite the same. Tried AR wave 12 and i m not impressed at all feels slow and flies slow comparing to my blade trigger 12 that turns in a dime. Should i not go into wave kites category for a 12 mt size?
Definitely try a 12m OR Flite. It is not called a "wave" kite but since it is so light when lines go slack it sorta flattens out and just kind of hangs there.. slowly drifting back till you turn away from it and the lines tighten.. very unique and I like riding waves with it.
I have both the Flite and Prodigy in a 12. I prefer the Prodigy for surf. I can always tell where the Prodigy is, it's predictable, turns reasonably fast, and has a good feel. For some reason I loose track of the Flite and sometimes find it where I don't want it. The Flite is awesome for free ride, but I don't really like it in the surf (compared to the Prodigy). Never tried the Roam though.
HAHA, I could say the same thing but swap the word Prodigy for Flite and Flite for Prodigy. I just ordered the new Roam but only a 6m so it will be awhile before I really have an opinion on it.

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Re: Looking for a 12 mt wave kite that turns fast, feels light and drifts. Exists?

Postby Burn45 » Fri Feb 02, 2018 3:26 pm

alfredo68 wrote:
Fri Jan 26, 2018 8:23 pm
Heard that Neo 12 its slow, sst 12 quite the same. Tried AR wave 12 and i m not impressed at all feels slow and flies slow comparing to my blade trigger 12 that turns in a dime. Should i not go into wave kites category for a 12 mt size?
Hi Alfredo, I'm 100 kg (220 pds) and my wave quiver is 5-7-9-11 2017 Neo. If you're looking for a 12m wave kite, it can sounds weird, but a 10m Neo (maybe the 11m) can do the job... and your turning speed would be solved. The Neo is really powerful for it's size. For example, my 11m Neo pulls like my 13m Evo (wich I sold). At 35-40 knots, I'm on my 5m on SB. This kite is amazing.

Wish you good wind :cheers:

Bruno

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Re: Looking for a 12 mt wave kite that turns fast, feels light and drifts. Exists?

Postby Peert » Sun Feb 04, 2018 3:10 pm

12m that turns fast feels lite and drifts?
Sounds like a struttless lite to me. Stormkitesurfing has a decently priced one.
something like 600€ new..

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Re: Looking for a 12 mt wave kite that turns fast, feels light and drifts. Exists?

Postby norcom » Sun Feb 04, 2018 3:55 pm

As I've mentioned in a similar thread a while ago, most of these replies are worthless. One HAS to compare the speed of a kite to another kite. In this case, a wave kite preferably against another wave kite. Only after that could there be a consensus on which kites are faster than others.

Just because one has flown a kite and thought it's speed was fast gives no relative comparison as to what they feel it's faster than. Three pages of "this kite's fast! try it!" are pointless when most people have money to buy only one and will probably buy online becuase we don't all live in areas where you can get a demo.

2015 Cabo 11m MUCH FASTER, lighter feeling, than 2015 SST 12m. The SST has MUCH better drift. I can make my SST 10m w/20m lines on a 23" bar fly as fast as the 11m Cabo on 27m lines and 23" bar. SST lacks in upwind compared to Cabo. The SST has more power in downloops compared to the Cabo and a much constant pull on the wave. SST has less depower than Cabo and get's quite heavy when overpowered.

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Re: Looking for a 12 mt wave kite that turns fast, feels light and drifts. Exists?

Postby Flyboy » Sun Feb 04, 2018 6:09 pm

norcom wrote:
Sun Feb 04, 2018 3:55 pm
As I've mentioned in a similar thread a while ago, most of these replies are worthless. One HAS to compare the speed of a kite to another kite. In this case, a wave kite preferably against another wave kite. Only after that could there be a consensus on which kites are faster than others.

Just because one has flown a kite and thought it's speed was fast gives no relative comparison as to what they feel it's faster than. Three pages of "this kite's fast! try it!" are pointless when most people have money to buy only one and will probably buy online becuase we don't all live in areas where you can get a demo.

2015 Cabo 11m MUCH FASTER, lighter feeling, than 2015 SST 12m. The SST has MUCH better drift. I can make my SST 10m w/20m lines on a 23" bar fly as fast as the 11m Cabo on 27m lines and 23" bar. SST lacks in upwind compared to Cabo. The SST has more power in downloops compared to the Cabo and a much constant pull on the wave. SST has less depower than Cabo and get's quite heavy when overpowered.
Your point is taken, however, beyond that it seems to me that the parameters in kite design are limited. There are only so many elements that can be tweaked one way or another. Tweaking in one direction will improve certain characteristics ... but at the expense of other characteristics. So ... how about defining what those characteristics are to start with?

Low end
High end
Bar pressure
Turning speed
Drift
Boost (for "freeriding")

Are there other ones that should be included?

I use Cabos. I would characterize them this way:

Poor low end
Good high end
Light bar pressure
Fast turning speed
Moderate drift
Poor boost.

I don't have much experience with other wave kites, but I suspect that other models will favour one characteristic over another. So Neos, for example, would have better low end, worse high end, heavier bar pressure, similar drift, slower turning speed & better boost.

norcom
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Re: Looking for a 12 mt wave kite that turns fast, feels light and drifts. Exists?

Postby norcom » Sun Feb 04, 2018 6:48 pm

Flyboy wrote:
Sun Feb 04, 2018 6:09 pm

Your point is taken, however, beyond that it seems to me that the parameters in kite design are limited. There are only so many elements that can be tweaked one way or another. Tweaking in one direction will improve certain characteristics ... but at the expense of other characteristics. So ... how about defining what those characteristics are to start with?

Low end
High end
Bar pressure
Turning speed
Drift
Boost (for "freeriding")

Are there other ones that should be included?

I use Cabos. I would characterize them this way:

Poor low end
Good high end
Light bar pressure
Fast turning speed
Moderate drift
Poor boost.

I don't have much experience with other wave kites, but I suspect that other models will favour one characteristic over another. So Neos, for example, would have better low end, worse high end, heavier bar pressure, similar drift, slower turning speed & better boost.
My point is that characteristics without a comparison are useless. You can get characteristics from most brands marketing pages but not a kite to kite comparison. One needs more than one data point to compare points but someone has to know both of the values.

You fly Cabos, GREAT! So do I. I have the 5,7,8,9,11m v3 Cabos. We have a set of data points to relate with. If you tell me that an Ozone Reo v4 is faster than the Cabo v3, I know what you consider "faster than Cabo". If you tell me the Cabo drifts better, the Reo has better low end, etc, I can relate. If two more people post the same, there are logical reasons for any Cabo user to understand what to expect. Same goes with any other aspect you mentioned, low/high end, pressure, drift, boost.

An earlier post mentioned Neos and SSTs both being slow. Because I own a 2016 12m and 10m SST's, I KNOW how slow they are. When someone mentioned that the Neos are also slow as they mentioned that they fly an SST, I have a reference point to compare to. I can and have made similar comparisons between Cabo/SST. Don't remember if the drift between Neo and SST was mentioned, would be interested.

When someone is to make an educated guess on what to buy sight unseen, they could read through every thread, find every comparison between kite to kite references and then make the best choice because the most number of kite to kite comparison data points summed up one kite as the fastest, lightest, driftiest, boostiest or whatever attribute they're looking for. Otherwise there's a bunch of fanbois, brands and the "this is my only kite and it's so awesome!" replies to try it.

Read through the last few pages, people are just throwing out kite brands/names. :lol: The OP is basically left with the choice to try any kite with no real data as to why. Most people never say what they've flown and why they think the kite they mention is better than something else.

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Re: Looking for a 12 mt wave kite that turns fast, feels light and drifts. Exists?

Postby Flyboy » Sun Feb 04, 2018 7:27 pm

norcom wrote:
Sun Feb 04, 2018 6:48 pm
My point is that characteristics without a comparison are useless.
I already acknowledged & agreed with your point. However ... people are then stuck with having to try multiple wave kites to make a useful comparison - not likely to happen - read the kitesurf mag reviews/advertising material - of limited usefulness because of commercial considerations - or read people's comments on kiteforum. What can be gleaned, by applying critical reasoning (!), is the relative characteristics of different kites. I'm pretty sure what you're saying about the relative attributes of the SST, Neo & Cabos is accurate, as I've heard other similar comments & it makes sense. Claims that Neos (for example) have great low end AND are really fast, I would be sceptical of.

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Re: Looking for a 12 mt wave kite that turns fast, feels light and drifts. Exists?

Postby Kitemanmuc » Sun Feb 04, 2018 10:48 pm

alfredo68 wrote:
Fri Jan 26, 2018 8:23 pm
Heard that Neo 12 its slow, sst 12 quite the same. Tried AR wave 12 and i m not impressed at all feels slow and flies slow comparing to my blade trigger 12 that turns in a dime. Should i not go into wave kites category for a 12 mt size?
Just tried the new Eleveight WS. Only comes up to size 11, but its unreal.


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