Fatality in France

[Toby]

I remember back then in 2000 when I saw Robby first time at a beach setting up his kite...I offered to help (did my first kump that day). He refused and said he prefers to self launch...back then barely anyone knew what it is and how it works...so I fully understand.
Guess might be sometimes better nowadays too, since you really need to trust the person launching your kite...

[nothing2seehere]

Toby... from what i could make out on the French forum he launched facing the dune instead of facing the water

I did wonder if that was the case. I was at a French run resort recently and that was the direction they insisted we launch as well. I still don't quite follow the logic (other than you were standing in calf deep water) as it meant you had to fly your kite through the zenith just to get into deeper water.

[Peter_Frank]

P.S. that vid above is Lake Ontario. Yes, we need strong wind to get good waves there.

40 knots? No. Something over 25 knots is good. I would say 30 knots is just about perfect with a 5m kite. Over 35 knots it's too windy to ride waves wth any kind of control.

Very true, 25-30 knots is perfect for spots with wind created waves, as then you can ride with 6 or 5 or 4½ m2 kites in this range.

Less wind = not much wave action

More wind, more than 30 knots, apart from ruining the already choppy surface, will require even smaller kites, OR that you ride overpowered thus not able to surf freely anymore - out of the sweetspot is never fun on a waveboard

I have never seen anyone riding waves in 40 knots of wind, unless they had a smaller kite, and very very few got this.

But going for 25 to 30 knots of wind is very often the "norm" and desired by most likely the majority of waveriders.

Peter

[Matteo V]

40 knots? No. Something over 25 knots is good. I would say 30 knots is just about perfect with a 5m kite. Over 35 knots it's too windy to ride waves wth any kind of control.

Maybe I am a little OCD, but it seems like 99% of posters here are just fixated on this being a one varialble equation - only "wind speed". I kite lots of different locations, as do many other traveling kiters. At those different locations, different wind speeds do different things. Some are terrible light wind locations that only get steady once you hit 30knots. Some locations are better from 10-20knots. Every location has a sweet spot where the gusts/lulls seem to disappear almost all the time (not all the time), and the wind gets steady. Some locations are still good and "almost clean" wind for a long range above that. Some tip over that point and become un-kitable pure turbulence.

So while you can make Flyboy's statement about one single location, you cannot make that statement about every location.

And I know why this is. 90% or more of kiters have tunnel vision when it comes to kite size - and that is ok! But just admit that you have a preferred kite size, and when you go to a location with steady winds outside of that range, you can't seem to have a good time like the locals. Honestly, I do not know a single kiter (that I kite with) that kites in 17m winds (without a hydrofoil) down to 4m conditions like I do. It all works if the wind is steady with the right kite size - AND IF YOU HAVE THE SKILL - regardless of the wind speed.

And please don't take this as a challenge to go out and kite in 40knots of wind if you have never kited above 20knots. Steady or not, you will be taking a huge risk. Work up slowly to 25knots first (with the proper kite size). Then do 30 knots (consult with locals about conditions and make sure you have the proper kite size). Then go for 35knots if that works for others around your skill level at a spot known for it's clean and high winds. Do 40 knots only if you have had success at 35knots, feel comfortable and have a good time at that speed, and make damn sure you have the right sized kite - and know the kite model well - at this wind speed and above.

[iriejohn]

If I'm launching in sketchy conditions I always tell the person who's launching that (a) I might change my mind and that (b) I might want to immediately land the kite. Really not very complicated.

I am kind of sure you implied that in (a), but just to be sure: I will tell whoever is helping to only let go of the kite once they see an unambiguous sign by me (arm stretched out and thump up). Until two weeks ago I thought this was self-evident..

No, more than that, it means that I warn them that I might decide not to launch at all. Thumb up means I want to launch now, thumb down means I am not going to launch.
hth

[mgs]

That’s very sad news.
If the reported wind speed of 40 knots is correct that’s a Force 8 “gale” on the Beaufort scale.
The need for assessing “risk” is so important.

[Slappysan]

40 knots? No. Something over 25 knots is good. I would say 30 knots is just about perfect with a 5m kite. Over 35 knots it's too windy to ride waves wth any kind of control.

People are talking like the wind is steady and doesn't ramp up and down during a session. When people say the wind was 40 knots they usually mean the gusts, as if the average was 40 knots that would mean it was alternating between 30 to 50 knots. Even at places like Rooster Rock, Oregon, where you can get a steady 60 knot day, at that level a steady 60 knots is still bouncing between 50 and 70 knots. Here is a typical 40 knot Rooster graph, and again, this is about the steadiest 40 knots you'll find:

Rooster.png (33.58 KiB) Viewed 855 times

For me I like to list wind in AVEgGUST, example 25g35 knots.

I find the quality of the waves is more dependent on the gusts than the average wind speed. 25g30 will yield much smaller waves than 25g40 will.

In the 20-35 knot range I'm on my 6.5m
In the 30-50 knot range I'm on my 4.5m

Always on a surfboard, always geared towards surfing the waves.

[Matteo V]

People are talking like the wind is steady and doesn't ramp up and down during a session. When people say the wind was 40 knots they usually mean the gusts, as if the average was 40 knots that would mean it was alternating between 30 to 50 knots. Even at places like Rooster Rock, Oregon, where you can get a steady 60 knot day, at that level a steady 60 knots is still bouncing between 50 and 70 knots. Here is a typical 40 knot Rooster graph, and again, this is about the steadiest 40 knots you'll find:
Rooster.png

For me I like to list wind in AVEgGUST, example 25g35 knots.

And that even happens at low wind speeds at certain locations. My home lake for the spring/fall season is worthless for lightwind hydrofoilling because of the 0-12mph winds (over a 2minute period, not just the day). Couple the 0mph lull with a shift in direction when the wind does come back, and you have a mess where you only have a chance to relaunch, then no wind to get moving. - Hell, for me, would be that - plenty of wind to launch, then no wind to ride.

Other locations with obvious upwind obstructions are notorious for being junk over 30 knots (or so relative to the upwind obstruction). Other places like some spots in the Columbia river Gorge can take just a 5° wind shift and throw nasty turbulence at you at any wind speed. Then the whole rotor thing where certain lower wind speeds are more likely to throw that rotor.

Again, it is not just about the wind speed.

[JakeFarley]

Very sad to hear of this tragedy. Hopefully some will read this thread and take to heart the risks involved in high winds.

In the rooster graph it appears that the wind speed would go from 30-50 knots. WOW, I do not know how anyone could ride in those conditions. Remember that the force of the wind is exponential to the wind speed. How do you see the gusts coming in the surf? In flat water you can see the gusts pretty easily. I've ridden where the gusts were 10 knots (25-35 knots) and it was not fun getting yanked, especially when you did not see a gust coming such as in a transition. In those conditions you have to be super alert all the time. Just one lapse in concentration is all it could take. You have to time your jumps/transitions so that you do not get pulled off edge or fall like a rock in a lull. Give me a steady wind with 2-4 knots variation and I'm good.

Also, about two weeks ago a kiter in this area was launching with the wind onshore at a spot along a causeway (very little margin for error) and was test jumping on the very narrow beach. Well, a gust caught him and he was dragged. He then released his kite into the nearby power lines frying it. The bar and lines were in the roadway and got run over by a car. Trashed his kit, but he walked away with only some bruises. Could have been worse. There is very little room for error at this particular location.

Bad stuff can happen very, very fast.

[Peter_Frank]

Very sad... Condolences.

Short version is, most of us like to ride in high winds 25-35 knots average, either because you can jump higher on a TT, and loop wilder with more acceleration, everything gets more exciting of course.
Or bigger waves forming, and simply necessary to be able to ride with "optimal" wavekitesizes 5 to 7 m2

Just a fact, but means there is a much higher risk

So what we can do, is to learn from the fatalities or close ones, so we are kept aware that eventhough it seems easy when everything goes right, it can be fatal when it goes wrong.

Whether you launch hooked or unhooked, and how, is not the issue here - as we can discuss this over and over and never agree what is the best and safest for all.

But we can learn to be aware about updraft or gust risks, to mentally be prepared ALWAYS, if something goes wrong both when launching and landing and passing obstackles, as these are the major life threatening situations I would say.

Peter