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Alaia3- veneer composit

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zob
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Re: Alaia3- veneer composit

Postby zob » Wed Dec 16, 2015 11:33 am

Thanks guys!

Tom, it is easy for you to say with so much experience and beautifully made boards. :thumb:
Well, my boardbuilding journey started with bagging. With less professional setup and bag materials for sure. It was a strugle all the way. I had to use a press anyway to get "decent" results. The last thing I did was bonding prelaminated topsheets, and it was a disaster, a lot of pockets of trapped air. That's when I ditched the process.

The first board I did with plastic topsheet and pressing was also bad, but I simply reversed some steps, so I do not laminate the topsheets to the final core, but to a sheet of flat veneer instead.
With the new process, I can say the previous two alaias came out flawless and on the last one some whiteish FG fibres can be seen (I once bought 10 m of this FG which I decided to use now, than back to UD).

It did cross my mind it would be nice to have vacum bag when forcing bubbles and excess epoxy out with spatula, otherwise it all comes down to speed. Veneer tends to curl in one direction, plastic topsheet wants to roll back into a roll, so I have to be efficient and precise to press it ASAP. But I figured vacuming is not worth a hustle.

I was checking some production boards and noticed that they have more bubbles than my latest boards, they are just not so easy to spot since graphic sheet hides a lot.

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zob
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Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:43 pm
Kiting since: 2006
Local Beach: Grado Pineta (IT), Fossalon (IT)
Style: Freeride, strapless hooked-in
Gear: FS S3 19m2 DLX, S3 CE 12m2 DLX & S4 8m2 DLX
Homemade Surf & Snow Boards
MBS Pro90
Location: Iv.G.-Slovenia
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Re: Alaia3- veneer composit

Postby zob » Wed Dec 16, 2015 2:25 pm

As far as core goes, if I would say I have the construction finalised, I would be lying.

What I noticed is that 90° layer helps alot to hold the concave shape, which contributes to the stiffness (and of course grip, upwind,...)

45° or 30° layers improve torsional strength on the other hand reduces stiffness. I must keep attention which layer and in which phase to taper, otherwise I get assimetric flex (left:right) at tip and tail, although small difference, however noticable (at least for me :D ).

I already decided next time to go with middle

90°- 1,4 mm veneer
30°- 1,4 mm
-30°- 1,4 mm
90°- 1,4 mm
where a 2 mm 0° sheet will be replaced with 2 x 1,4 mm under 30°, so adding 0,8 of thickness and hopefully some torsional strength.
I am not saying this will be final :D

I think main change on my last build was implementing ash veneer to improve hardness of the core, because since finless I ride extreme shallows and hit a lot of rock (if there is just sand, I can find a rock :D )- I will post a photo of dented bottom. Of course material properties are different, thats why I went down with the thickness of the middle.

TPU: I used it, loved it, but couldn't source it anymore for like one year, so I went with p-tex topsheet. It is transparent, however matt, so carbon inlay and wood grain are not so clear as with TPU which had smooth, shiny surface. I can not comment on scratch resistance yet.
Sorry D.

As far as edge goes, I chose boat varnish because it is single component, and I made like 6 layers. It was scratch proof.
From what I see when sanding layers, epoxy soaks in like no more than 0,5 mm (excluding pores).
Like Downunder suggested, my intention with p-tex edges is to protect the board from impact damage (droping it, hitting stuff,...). I did have to revarnish the edge 4 times in one seasson + one bigger repair, when I hit the edge so hard it split a little.

It does not take much more work compared to varnishing and sanding. I made another smaller template to cut out core and one to make the edge. I made chamfers to one edge of veneer and rail and used hot glue along the groove to bond them.

@Downunder: we can sure meet somewhere in the middle, between LJ and ZG!? :D So approximately where I live. I am kidding, however wouldn't mind if you actually decide to visit me! We should definitely stay in contact through PM and see how it goes.

Cheers!

Edit: LOL, I spelled "would grain"
Last edited by zob on Wed Dec 16, 2015 8:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

windtzu
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Re: Alaia3- veneer composit

Postby windtzu » Wed Dec 16, 2015 3:57 pm

Nice job on the board. Impressive.

I picked up a Naish Alaia a month ago and been out on it few times. It's very different from my kite surfboards. The Alaia was a trip at low tide, riding hundreds of yards in just a few inches of water.

I'm still getting the hang of it, but I have to admit I'm not "feelin" it yet, the Alaia fun factor? Acquired taste? I still prefer the surfboard. Perhaps I just need more time on it.

I wonder if the Naish version would benefit from just a little bit of nose rocker and some in the tail.

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zob
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Style: Freeride, strapless hooked-in
Gear: FS S3 19m2 DLX, S3 CE 12m2 DLX & S4 8m2 DLX
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Re: Alaia3- veneer composit

Postby zob » Wed Dec 16, 2015 10:35 pm

Uf, hard to comment since I don't know Naish's Alaia. I was not aware it is rockerless, but I bet it looses some fun factor due to this and some due to it's length. Did you get the square tailed, or the one with the cut out?

I definitely requires some time. I addvice people to have their heels on the rail and find their backfoot position (when you get the feeling of having 12" fins).

I just meassured mine. It has 3 cm front rocker (including 8 mm bevel ) and 9 mm tail rocker. Concave is also 8 mm.
It weighs 4,37 kg complete with pads.

Yeah, I am having my eyes open for anyone with Naish Alaia, to ask him/her for a spin, or infact any kind of Alaia. Waterlust inspired Alaia? Even better.

Although nice people from Waterlust.org shaired the outline.pdf and a nice instructional, I feel there can be infinite variations of this single design (very bright comment on hand shaped object :D).
Even, if they shared exact meassures of other features, everyone can make their own concave interpretation, its transition to the surface, its length, front and back rocker curves and heights, bevel, tail cut, center (concave) tail cut. And it also comes down to flex.

windtzu
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Re: Alaia3- veneer composit

Postby windtzu » Fri Dec 18, 2015 1:36 am

My Naish Alaia is the fish tail version. Having no nose scoop doesn't seem to affect it in chop, swell, small waves, it just knifes through everything. I'd be interested myself in trying the Waterlust version or someone's custom Alaia. First I'll learn to appreciate the Naish.

I read somewhere the Naish Alaia is suppose to have good light air performance. Well that's relative. Both my former North Skimfish and my Airush Cypher 5'6 both perform better in marginal conditions.

bigtone667
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Re: Alaia3- veneer composit

Postby bigtone667 » Fri Dec 18, 2015 4:17 am

windtzu wrote:My Naish Alaia is the fish tail version. Having no nose scoop doesn't seem to affect it in chop, swell, small waves, it just knifes through everything. I'd be interested myself in trying the Waterlust version or someone's custom Alaia. First I'll learn to appreciate the Naish.

I read somewhere the Naish Alaia is suppose to have good light air performance. Well that's relative. Both my former North Skimfish and my Airush Cypher 5'6 both perform better in marginal conditions.
I think the width of the North Skimfish (50cm) is a little more than the Naish Alaia (40cm), and that makes a big difference when planing in light wind.

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zob
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Posts: 454
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:43 pm
Kiting since: 2006
Local Beach: Grado Pineta (IT), Fossalon (IT)
Style: Freeride, strapless hooked-in
Gear: FS S3 19m2 DLX, S3 CE 12m2 DLX & S4 8m2 DLX
Homemade Surf & Snow Boards
MBS Pro90
Location: Iv.G.-Slovenia
Contact:

Re: Alaia3- veneer composit

Postby zob » Fri Dec 18, 2015 6:54 pm

Hi!

Here are some photos of Alaia3+'s bottom after one seasson.
I met a lot of rocks :D
Surface is heavily scratched, some places even dented (white FG appear), but this is no problem. Edge should be protected with more than just a coat of paint or epoxy.
On the other hand I just need to sand the edge just a tiny bit, recoat it and it's like new, keeping the trough Alaia spirit :D
Nothing really I can do to make the bottom a bit prettier. There are all these small shavings, and I don't know if I should shave them off or do they make the board quicker :lol: :rollgrin:

ciscokitesurfer
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Re: Alaia3- veneer composit

Postby ciscokitesurfer » Sat Dec 19, 2015 7:20 pm

hi

i didn't made this board but I love it

cheers
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User avatar
zob
Frequent Poster
Posts: 454
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:43 pm
Kiting since: 2006
Local Beach: Grado Pineta (IT), Fossalon (IT)
Style: Freeride, strapless hooked-in
Gear: FS S3 19m2 DLX, S3 CE 12m2 DLX & S4 8m2 DLX
Homemade Surf & Snow Boards
MBS Pro90
Location: Iv.G.-Slovenia
Contact:

Re: Alaia3- veneer composit

Postby zob » Tue Oct 04, 2016 11:25 am

Video update of my strapless progression with Alaia4Session.


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