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My first kitesurf board! Eps Foam okay ?

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TomW
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Re: My first kitesurf board! Eps Foam okay ?

Postby TomW » Sun Jul 22, 2018 7:57 pm

Dimitros,

You are not going to save money. Only do it if you think building is fun.
Read greenlight surfboard supply guide on line.
I build boards for fun and sell a few to locals to pay for my learning.
Have a Fb group called TW Surfboards. Ask to join. You can see my work and some steps.

Best way to get success is to buy a surfboard blank ( PU foam). Shape it, add fin boxes ( difficult step) glass it, coat/sand it, finish coat. Use epoxy.
Minimum material cost in Europe, if you don't have supply shop in your area is 300€.

Besides mastering the skills to shape, glass, add boxes, and finish work without sand-through, you have to have a shop, controlled temperature, safety equipment ( carbon filter mask etc), some tools and shaping stands. Minimum is sure-form, electric router, electric polisher ( rpm 1500-5000) with surfboard sanding pads. It's possible without some of this, but it's going to be really difficult.

So it's an investment in tools, space and time. You have to be in maker mindset.

I love it. Fantastic to make stuff and then use it.
After 10-20 boards you might get this:
2017-03-19 12.08.03-1.jpg
2017-03-19 12.07.14.jpg

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downunder
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Re: My first kitesurf board! Eps Foam okay ?

Postby downunder » Mon Jul 23, 2018 3:14 am

TomW wrote:
Sun Jul 22, 2018 7:57 pm
Dimitros,

You are not going to save money.
.
.
Actually, this is not completely true. Some ppl already have heaps of tools, and workshop, masks, etc.

The only cutting tool one might ever need is this:

http://www.toolsfromjapan.com/store/ind ... 16_318_503

It cuts carbon fiber sheet up to a few mm (tested), fiberglass no probs... But why is this important?

Because of the dust. Any electric saw will create unhealthy dust, but not this saw. It does not create ultra fine particles.

The foam. The mentioned FS Razor might have a foam as a core but it's fcken heavy board. I have the Razor btw. It's heavy exactly because of heaps of reinforcement. TT construction with a foam sucks big time.

Is you see here http://kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=107&t=2399912 "The weight of carbon + epoxy added significant weight to wood core (which was ~2kg), so the naked board is approx 4kg now "

I'm using max 300 grams of epoxy for everything. That's >3 times less, never broken a board by customers (and they are not light as myself I guess).

Hence why using a foam (ok, maybe for HF buoyancy), when adding more than a core weight by 1000%? The closed cell foam is extremely expensive, wood is cheap as chips.

I don't get it.

phuqit
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Re: My first kitesurf board! Eps Foam okay ?

Postby phuqit » Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:35 am

Hey, that's not fair ;) It was merely the first attempt, and I wouldn't even call it a failure - the board is pretty much the same weight as the production flysurfer board! Now, with careful reduction of thickness and material amount, I'm pretty sure I can do even better.

The reinforcement amount vs core thickness argument is moot, and can work either way, because there are boards in both approaches. In my case I have materials on hand, so I work with what's already there. This may be sub-optimal, but as I said - it's a learning process. Also, pricing of the materials isn't exactly an issue, IMHO. 200€ vs 300€ is really negligible, considering I already spent few weeks researching online, and my hourly rate is quite expensive. Buying an off-the-shelf board like spleene carbon door @ 1k€ would be actually cheaper than what I chose to do ;)

phuqit
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Re: My first kitesurf board! Eps Foam okay ?

Postby phuqit » Mon Jul 23, 2018 12:00 pm

Also, Downunder, please note, that we're building a bloody door, it's 170x50, 0.85sqm area. The boards you mentioned are probably something along the lines of 130x36, which is more like 0.45sqm, almost half!

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downunder
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Re: My first kitesurf board! Eps Foam okay ?

Postby downunder » Mon Jul 23, 2018 1:08 pm

:thumb:

Pls see my reply for the core thickness on the above thread.
The 155/50/1.5 cm Paul.plank is less than 2.5kg if remember well. Impossible to bend by hands. Hence, 100g FG bias on bottom and 200g UD on top will make it really stiff.

I have a FS Rad 4, almost same dimensions as my DIY, FS has closed cell as a core for half of the board, by length.
My full Paul. wood board is lighter. This means the same "door" board would be also lighter simply coz of less FG and epoxy:)

That said, for double the board size, >1kg epoxy would be needed with a CC foam.
Same in wood = 600 grams.

Plus FG/carbon.

Remember, the total cost for a TT DIY is $30-40. That's material cost with a FG for the shop quality hand made board. Some ppl are buying it coz of the wood grain, looks bloody fantastic.
Same production "hand" made board sells for €1000 or more.

The topsheet price 100m from the factory is €400. That's ~€10 per board. Cheap.

phuqit
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Re: My first kitesurf board! Eps Foam okay ?

Postby phuqit » Mon Jul 23, 2018 1:36 pm

Not trying to argue, since you can just slam me down with proper experience ;) just pointing out that both approaches are valid. I've seen plenty of paulownia+fg boards, I personally ride the flysplit2 now, and am quite happy with it. My personal preference is towards more and stronger reinforcement, rather than thicker core, albeit this makes tweaking the flex a lot more tricky. I also like thin edges a lot...

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downunder
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Re: My first kitesurf board! Eps Foam okay ?

Postby downunder » Mon Jul 23, 2018 2:24 pm

Of course, whatever floats your board man :)

I have no experience with a foam TT boards, hence biased. Also think the board is just that, like a skates or skateboard, does not make a better rider. Only more riding does ;)

TomW
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Re: My first kitesurf board! Eps Foam okay ?

Postby TomW » Mon Jul 23, 2018 2:28 pm

OP wants to make a kite surfboard for strapless riding.
Best way is to make it using PU surfboard blank. glassfiber and epoxy.
Granted a Alaia made out of solid wood would be good too, but i would call that a Kite Surfboard- I´d call that an Alaia. They are pretty special.

Good Luck OP. You an PM me if you want some help.

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downunder
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Re: My first kitesurf board! Eps Foam okay ?

Postby downunder » Mon Jul 23, 2018 2:46 pm

Well,

Whats the point of placing 2 pics of your latest build Tom?

The OP didn't ask for that either to be fair. I would not attempt building a surf board even tho I've built a complete HF...in my laundry, talking about the shop needed;)


Anyways, each to his own...
And an Alaia IS a LW board no matter what. Ultimate cruising/free riding board that will never break. Weight? 2.5-3kg

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Re: My first kitesurf board! Eps Foam okay ?

Postby Kaito » Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:38 pm

Option B; find a cheap used surfboard and add a couple layers of fiberglass on the deck.
If you find this difficult, or can't make it through the process, don't bother attempting a full-on build (^^;)

Good luck!
K.


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