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2 straps versus 3 straps

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naishdude
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2 straps versus 3 straps

Postby naishdude » Mon Oct 29, 2018 3:26 pm

Ok I have no fun with strapless on our wave with choppy waters so no discussing on that subject please.

I wonder why strapped kitesurfboards only have 2 straps, instead of a 3 strap option?

What would be the negative on 3 straps ?

thx Dude :cool2:

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purdyd
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Re: 2 straps versus 3 straps

Postby purdyd » Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:36 am

I like two because I have long feet. I also like being over the centerline.

I like three for really wide boards.

If you get used to three I might make it harder to rent boards or even buy them.

I’ve seen people rip either way.

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Flyboy
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Re: 2 straps versus 3 straps

Postby Flyboy » Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:19 am

naishdude wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 3:26 pm
Ok I have no fun with strapless on our wave with choppy waters so no discussing on that subject please.

I wonder why strapped kitesurfboards only have 2 straps, instead of a 3 strap option?

What would be the negative on 3 straps ?

thx Dude :cool2:
naishdude: I use a board with two front straps. It's a custom board that I came across by chance with inserts for two front straps, tried it & loved it. It's been discussed on this forum in the past. What I can tell you is that I think it's much more comfortable to use than one front strap - it pretty much stands to reason ergonomically. Better for cranking upwind as you are more out on the rail and better for jumping as being out towards the rail allows you to edge harder. When I am riding strapless, I need to have a more upright stance with more weight on my front front. Riding with angled front straps allows me lean back & out more while still controlling the front of the board with my toes- faster & more efficient riding - more like a windsurfing stance. This is not a plus when you're actually riding a wave, but in any session (side-on or onshore) you spend way more time riding upwind than you do actually on the wave.

I notice you have a Sector, which presumably you ride with 3 straps. My board is very small - 4'10" x 18". I remain puzzled why this set-up is not more used. My conclusion is that it is a hang-over from twin tips - people got used to the idea of two straps. Anyone coming from a windsurfing background will appreciate the logic of 3 straps.

.
purdyd wrote: I like two because I have long feet. I also like being over the centerline.

I like three for really wide boards.

If you get used to three I might make it harder to rent boards or even buy them.

I’ve seen people rip either way.
You're right: getting used to 3 straps makes it a major adjustment to rent a board & hard to find one to buy. Being over the centreline isn't an issue ... but that's because I don't have my rear foot in a strap which allows me to compensate with the weighting on the rear foot. I think this would be much harder with your back foot stuck in the rear strap.

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Re: 2 straps versus 3 straps

Postby fluidity » Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:25 am

I used to windsurf and the wider the board and/or the longer the fin, the more leverage you need to hold the edge. That's why light wind high volume boards have 4 straps.

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tautologies
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Re: 2 straps versus 3 straps

Postby tautologies » Wed Oct 31, 2018 6:14 pm

naishdude wrote:
Mon Oct 29, 2018 3:26 pm
Ok I have no fun with strapless on our wave with choppy waters so no discussing on that subject please.

I wonder why strapped kitesurfboards only have 2 straps, instead of a 3 strap option?

What would be the negative on 3 straps ?

thx Dude :cool2:
For super wide boards it makes sense to have three straps, but the surfboards these days are more narrow and made for waves more than just lightwind.

If you are having problems going strapless due to chop, I think you should definitely not go for a wider board. On narrow / short surfboards you do not want your front foot to be too far off center. When riding between waves generally your back foot will be out of the strap (unless you are lit out of your mind) so you'll move your weight forward on the board anyway to drive the board upwind. Once you hit the wave, you do not want your heels to dip in the water.

I keep my straps very loose and generally just use them in bigger and more aggressive surf so moving my foot to the desired position is easy enough.

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Flyboy
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Re: 2 straps versus 3 straps

Postby Flyboy » Thu Nov 01, 2018 1:42 am

Taut: I would be curious to know where exactly you place your front foot when you're riding with your inline straps? My guess is that just your toes are clinging onto the strap & your foot is more parallel with the rail (this is when you are not actually driving the board on the wave). That is how I ride upwind, both with my front straps & strapless. My board is 18" wide - my heel is never really clipping the water because it's parallel to the rail. It's certainly not in the water when I am turning on the wave. My board is unusual because it's so small & relatively flat rockered - I think an excellent design for small waves & choppy water, a bit like the old small directional boards which were around immediately before Twin tips took over. Peter Trow killing it on not so small waves:

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/xgzvn ... deo/xgzvna

naishdude
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Favorite Beaches: everywhere at the seaside, where it is allowed to kite
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Ozone reo V4 12 9 7 5
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Re: 2 straps versus 3 straps

Postby naishdude » Thu Nov 01, 2018 3:04 am

My sector is a 54 you could name it a kitesurf slalomboard...yes it works fine with 3 straps

My lightwind surfboard Airush Cypher 2015 has "only" = 5'8 20" it only has 1 strap at the front nothing at the end...although I really think this board would do well with 3 straps, once one gets used to it, the 5'5 is pretty narrow ( highwind) which has 2 straps whereby most of the times I only use the frontstrap...

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tautologies
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Re: 2 straps versus 3 straps

Postby tautologies » Thu Nov 01, 2018 6:10 pm

Flyboy wrote:
Thu Nov 01, 2018 1:42 am
Taut: I would be curious to know where exactly you place your front foot when you're riding with your inline straps? My guess is that just your toes are clinging onto the strap & your foot is more parallel with the rail (this is when you are not actually driving the board on the wave). That is how I ride upwind, both with my front straps & strapless. My board is 18" wide - my heel is never really clipping the water because it's parallel to the rail. It's certainly not in the water when I am turning on the wave. My board is unusual because it's so small & relatively flat rockered - I think an excellent design for small waves & choppy water, a bit like the old small directional boards which were around immediately before Twin tips took over. Peter Trow killing it on not so small waves:
Yeah you are right. It is not a very natural stance, but I keep the strap pretty open, and I don't feel like my toes are clinging at all, but I am used to riding strapless for the most part.

Wait your board is 18'' and you have dual strap setup? Yeah then maybe it does work. The only boards I've ever used with straps like that has been wide.

I mean I sometimes clip my heel even having an inline strap. I guess most times when I go with straps I ride pretty loaded up and that might be the reason?

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Flyboy
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Re: 2 straps versus 3 straps

Postby Flyboy » Fri Nov 02, 2018 5:00 am

tautologies wrote:
Thu Nov 01, 2018 6:10 pm
Flyboy wrote:
Thu Nov 01, 2018 1:42 am
Taut: I would be curious to know where exactly you place your front foot when you're riding with your inline straps? My guess is that just your toes are clinging onto the strap & your foot is more parallel with the rail (this is when you are not actually driving the board on the wave). That is how I ride upwind, both with my front straps & strapless. My board is 18" wide - my heel is never really clipping the water because it's parallel to the rail. It's certainly not in the water when I am turning on the wave. My board is unusual because it's so small & relatively flat rockered - I think an excellent design for small waves & choppy water, a bit like the old small directional boards which were around immediately before Twin tips took over. Peter Trow killing it on not so small waves:
Yeah you are right. It is not a very natural stance, but I keep the strap pretty open, and I don't feel like my toes are clinging at all, but I am used to riding strapless for the most part.

Wait your board is 18'' and you have dual strap setup? Yeah then maybe it does work. The only boards I've ever used with straps like that has been wide.

I mean I sometimes clip my heel even having an inline strap. I guess most times when I go with straps I ride pretty loaded up and that might be the reason?
Here's a video (I believe I posted it already a couple of years ago). Not very exciting, but shows my feet in great detail! The board is 18" wide, only 4'10" long, doesn't have much volume & has a relatively flat rocker line. My front foot is pretty much parallel to the axis of the board, so the heel is no closer to the water than it would be with a single inline strap. You may be dialled in on your inline strap because you're used to it & make it work, however, I'm inclined to think my riding position is more relaxed & natural. I'm now totally dialled in with my set-up - it is, in fact, the ONLY board I have used for the last 8 + years. What is interesting is the way I constantly make micro adjustments to the trim of the board by lifting up with my toes.

https://vimeo.com/199488450 (RIP Gord Downie)

When I ride strapless I have to weight my front foot much more. It's really a pretty different stance. This kind of board is (IMO) what the OP should be looking at: suited to choppy water & smaller onshore waves - it's the equivalent of a "wave-slalom" windsurfer. Doesn't work so well with bigger waves as it's too flat rockered & too fast. It planes up nicely in 11 or 12 knots with a 12m kite & works great in 30 kts. plus. A huge board, like a Sector is only going to give you a couple of knots at the low end & becomes a handful in anything much over 16 or 17 kts.

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tautologies
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Re: 2 straps versus 3 straps

Postby tautologies » Fri Nov 02, 2018 5:31 pm

Flyboy wrote:
Fri Nov 02, 2018 5:00 am

Here's a video (I believe I posted it already a couple of years ago). Not very exciting, but shows my feet in great detail! The board is 18" wide, only 4'10" long, doesn't have much volume & has a relatively flat rocker line. My front foot is pretty much parallel to the axis of the board, so the heel is no closer to the water than it would be with a single inline strap. You may be dialled in on your inline strap because you're used to it & make it work, however, I'm inclined to think my riding position is more relaxed & natural. I'm now totally dialled in with my set-up - it is, in fact, the ONLY board I have used for the last 8 + years. What is interesting is the way I constantly make micro adjustments to the trim of the board by lifting up with my toes.

https://vimeo.com/199488450 (RIP Gord Downie)

When I ride strapless I have to weight my front foot much more. It's really a pretty different stance. This kind of board is (IMO) what the OP should be looking at: suited to choppy water & smaller onshore waves - it's the equivalent of a "wave-slalom" windsurfer. Doesn't work so well with bigger waves as it's too flat rockered & too fast. It planes up nicely in 11 or 12 knots with a 12m kite & works great in 30 kts. plus. A huge board, like a Sector is only going to give you a couple of knots at the low end & becomes a handful in anything much over 16 or 17 kts.
So I get it and don't get it. I know my stance is generally very different from this so I think you might be right in that we simply have different stances and what we are used to. I guess that is one of the problems when we answer and do not consider multiple points of view. ;-)

But here is one final flogging on this topic:

My strap is set not for the riding in between waves, but for when I ride the wave. When you hit the lip the actual foot in the strap is almost pointing the opposite way with my toes pointing slightly backwads if I can slide the tail out. The board angle is pointing down the wave, while my front foot is bent and my backfoot stretched out. Riding between waves, my foot is barely in the strap, and the back foot completely out. A little note this is generally for bigger waves. Waves up to about head high I ride strapless.

Also this reminded me of one of the most classic boards out there Stretch's Peter Trow. Now I want that board too. Dammit.

Indeed RIP Gord. It looked like the kiter was riding in step with the music tapping his feet. Awesome. :D


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