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Canard Foil

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ronnie
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Re: Canard Foil

Postby ronnie » Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:52 am

The Huindi Twinfoil could also be classed as a Canard foil, in that both wings seem to lift. This time the leading edge of the wings seem to face outwards and they compensate for the change of direction and angle of attack by sliding the fuselage through the end of the mast.



So still no sign of anyone using a combination of 2 actual Canard airfoil wings in a directional foil, where the centre of lift is stabilised as the angle of attack increases, by having the % of lift produced by the front and rear wings changing to compensate automatically. The Brunotti twinfoil is the only one which seems to have a slight leaning towards that.

tegirinenashi
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Re: Canard Foil

Postby tegirinenashi » Mon Jul 18, 2016 5:23 pm

Let be honest: the rear wing is just oversized stabilizer, so calling this "canard design" is a stretch. IMO Hawaiis 6-wing design is superior. After all, russians copied it in Su-35 :thumb:
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Denisesewa
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Re: Canard Foil

Postby Denisesewa » Mon Jul 18, 2016 5:36 pm

I'm all for innovation but honestly, who wants to stop, drop down in the water, coax the fuselage to slide to the other side and start again? whats the point in a bi-directional foil if you cant change direction without stopping?

ronnie
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Re: Canard Foil

Postby ronnie » Mon Jul 18, 2016 5:37 pm

tegirinenashi wrote:Let be honest: the rear wing is just oversized stabilizer, so calling this "canard design" is a stretch. IMO Hawaiis 6-wing design is superior. After all, russians copied it in Su-35 :thumb:
Image
The 'stabilising' seems to be done by sliding both wings toward the rear of the direction of travel. That moves the centre of lift aft.

ronnie
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Re: Canard Foil

Postby ronnie » Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:47 am


revhed
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Re: Canard Foil

Postby revhed » Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:59 am

Reliable rumours backed up by this video show that a canard design can and has been designed and made to fly well,
from the country that continues to lead the way as has done for years! :thumb:
Hopefully next summer we will have chance to test fly?
R H

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Horst Sergio
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Re: Canard Foil

Postby Horst Sergio » Thu Nov 17, 2016 12:06 pm

Yes interesting
Lets see if we will have the first serial-kite-canard-foil from France.

Never expected it will be a race foil but a wave foil makes sense in my eyes. The canard could have similar advantages as the mono
http://kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=19 ... 5&start=20

but less of its problems as low speed range. With a foil that is less sensible for ventilation, when riding too high you can also use a bit shorter struts (around 80 cm) which is maybe also not so bad for wave riding closer to the beach.

ronnie
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Re: Canard Foil

Postby ronnie » Thu Nov 17, 2016 1:08 pm

deleted.
Last edited by ronnie on Thu Nov 17, 2016 1:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ronnie
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Re: Canard Foil

Postby ronnie » Thu Nov 17, 2016 1:10 pm

Horst Sergio wrote:Yes interesting
Lets see if we will have the first serial-kite-canard-foil from France.

Never expected it will be a race foil but a wave foil makes sense in my eyes. The canard could have similar advantages as the mono
http://kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=19 ... 5&start=20

but less of its problems as low speed range. With a foil that is less sensible for ventilation, when riding too high you can also use a bit shorter struts (around 80 cm) which is maybe also not so bad for wave riding closer to the beach.
The canard could be expected to 'crash' in a nicer way, and to have reduced loading on the foil box.

How efficient it can become and how manouverable, will be interesting to see, but Nico seems very impressed with the manouverability already.

I expect designing a canard requires a lot of iterations to get to a solution. If they could do that on a computer, it would save a lot of time and money, but I guess they cant do much of that as yet.

I think the mono foil may even have more potential than the other designs, but it seems to me it would only work for kitefoiling and not windfoiling, as I think the rider would have to be able to alter the angle of attack of the wing by altering his weight distribution, and I can see how that could be done for kitefoiling. The disadvantage would be that it would require moving parts.

The canard design does have implications for twintip foiling, in that it confirms that you can have a rear positive lifting foil with the leading edge travelling forward.

ronnie
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Re: Canard Foil

Postby ronnie » Tue Dec 06, 2016 6:43 pm

ronnie wrote:
rynhardt wrote:Looks like they're opening up a whole new world of hurt.
Wipeouts must be epic! :o
They are saying that an advantage of their foil is that the wipeouts are less epic than with the usual foil configuration.

I would expect with the canard layout, that both foils provide positive lift. The key to success is that when you change the angle of attack, the total lift increases smoothly, and that the % of the total lift provided by the rear wing increases smoothly.

I'm pleased to see someone exploring the possibilities of the canard configuration, because if you can get it to work using efficient aerofoils, it could be serious competition for the existing designs.
Time to wrap this thread up I think.

Congratulations to Nico and the rest of the Zeeko R&D team for designing the first successful Canard hydrofoil design.
I'm sure it has taken a lot of very clever thinking and a lot of trialling, through a very complicated development process.

Great piece of design work!



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