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Kite choices for foiling in high winds ?

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plummet
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Re: Kite choices for foiling in high winds ?

Postby plummet » Sat Dec 23, 2017 11:26 pm

mikesids wrote:
Sat Dec 23, 2017 8:47 am
I have a 5m ........ Make sure you use your 5m on a shorter bar though ( not more than 45cm width) as it is crazy fast. Enjoy !
Nooooooooo !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Why dull down a kite by using a little bar? embrace the speed and use your standard bar width!. I roll 50cm bar down to my 4m uno!
PS I have an old 6m reo. (closer to the current 5m In power). It loves 50cm bar.

All you are doing by using small bars is limiting yourself. Just ride with your hands closer to the middle of the bar. Then when you are used to the turning speed you can delve more into looping and angry wasp Drexler style of kite flying.

The down side of using a fast little kite on a big bar is you get used to the turning performance real quick. When you go back to the 12 or 10m its like flying a beach whale.

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Peter_Frank
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Re: Kite choices for foiling in high winds ?

Postby Peter_Frank » Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:16 am

Agree with plummet here, use your normal bar for the smallest kites :rollgrin:

8) PF

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wingnut
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Re: Kite choices for foiling in high winds ?

Postby wingnut » Sun Dec 24, 2017 7:54 pm

on the fence on this. I love small kites, but I payed so much for that giant light air kite that it needs to appear in my mind as an Orca not a Blue. So if I use a small bar for my small kite the difference won't be so vast. lol. Also flying blind, or by feel only, is way better on an appropriate sized bar IMHO. ( you can still loop the crap out of it :)

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Re: Kite choices for foiling in high winds ?

Postby foilonfoil » Tue Dec 26, 2017 2:42 am

Core Sections are what I use in high winds. IMO, wave kites have good gust handling chacteristics. I use the same bar with 5/7/9/12M Sections - I will likely reduce my quiver to 6/9/12.

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Re: Kite choices for foiling in high winds ?

Postby neilhapgood » Tue Dec 26, 2017 12:59 pm

is it safe to say that you can be less fussy with a smaller kite in terms of design and condition? I am keen for a 5m but budget is tight so might just have to get whatever comes along

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jakemoore
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Re: Kite choices for foiling in high winds ?

Postby jakemoore » Tue Dec 26, 2017 4:29 pm

neilhapgood wrote: is it safe to say that you can be less fussy with a smaller kite in terms of design and condition? I am keen for a 5m but budget is tight so might just have to get whatever comes along
Its easier to get a kite to fly well, turn fast, relaunch and take a rider upwind and downwind in higher winds so in part this statement is true. Different characteristics become important in higher winds.

Think durability, ground handling and safety.

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wingnut
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Re: Kite choices for foiling in high winds ?

Postby wingnut » Tue Dec 26, 2017 7:09 pm

neilhapgood wrote:
Tue Dec 26, 2017 12:59 pm
is it safe to say that you can be less fussy with a smaller kite in terms of design and condition? I am keen for a 5m but budget is tight so might just have to get whatever comes along
Well, sort of, I think. I have flown some small older kites in stormy conditions and found that some performance kites just hammer the rider in gusts. You almost need a softer, wave kite that has a good amount of depower and drifts well so that it is more stable at the edge of the window.

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Peter_Frank
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Re: Kite choices for foiling in high winds ?

Postby Peter_Frank » Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:30 pm

neilhapgood wrote:
Tue Dec 26, 2017 12:59 pm
is it safe to say that you can be less fussy with a smaller kite in terms of design and condition? I am keen for a 5m but budget is tight so might just have to get whatever comes along

For hydrofoiling you are right, most 5s will work just great.

If it was for waveriding, I dont agree - it is REALLY difficult to find a good small kite that works (unless you just are a "park and ride")

Medium kitesizes (7-8 m2) are a no brainer to get "right", whereas the big ones are really difficult to design well, and often you have a much broader "type" of kite demands depending on who you are (jumping, surfing, racing etc), I think we all know that.

But for waveriding/waveboards good small kites (below 6 m2) are difficult to find, as very often they are scaled down medium kites, and this does IMO not work well :(

When riding DTL, a huge amount of depower is needed (compared to 7-8 m2 where it isnt an issue most often), because we ride in say 30 knots, so when flying across the window it will pull you off your board, or at least not give you a free path you can surf, but more locked.
Very very few small kites got this feature, have had a few and those of us riding waves mostly, have kept these and surfed them for years, repaired, and surfed till they eventually died...
So difficult to get this type nowadays unfortunately :roll:

Same brands are most likely offering small kites for TT riding (lighter riders) and lightweights or kids - where a scaled down kite in terms of power at least, works well because they are used in less wind, but not for waveriding, and not optimal for hydrofoiling either really.

The difficult part besides above which is very "style" specific, is to make a small kite that got a pleasant dynamic power/depower, instead of a supershort on/off on a very short distance.
Of course one gets used to the, no matter what, shorter sheeting distance, but if too short it is annoying in my experience, as they will race across the window less controllable - at least you gotta use time to get this dialed in and not always possible to get the same feel.

The issue with too much power is a lot worse on waveboards, as say we use a 5 in 20 knots on a hydrofoil, and on a waveboard a 5 maybe used in +30 knots, which is 250 % more power but at least a LOT more wind speed than you ride downwind DTL.

As very few brands today, if any, makes a "dog", you can use most of the small kites you can get your hands on, 4½ to 6 m2 (beware though, 4 m and smaller are tricky and NOT easy to find good ones..)
Relaunch is easy, they turn well, and years of design make them drift well too - only difficult parameters can be the amount of depower and to find one with a pleasant sheeting.
But they still works quite well for hydrofoiling though, even if missing some of this, is my experience.

So yes, I would say you can choose almost any small kite you can get your hands on Neil :thumb:

8) PF

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Re: Kite choices for foiling in high winds ?

Postby neilhapgood » Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:12 pm

Genius thanks Peter

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wingnut
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Re: Kite choices for foiling in high winds ?

Postby wingnut » Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:10 pm

So Peter, out of curiosity, what were the small kites that worked reasonably well in the past for you?


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