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Riding Styles and best foils for curvy carving...

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joekitetime
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Riding Styles and best foils for curvy carving...

Postby joekitetime » Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:42 pm

Hi there loyal to the foil foilers!

I've been foiling about 3 months. Addicted. Just sold my ss hoverglide and dwarfcraft yesterday. Considering today what to buy next.

What interests me about foiling is pumping up super small kites and riding in foiling circles in the smallest place possible. I can jibe, want to work on tacks and toeside tacks and easy, fun, slow circles. Ideally, as soon as I am up and foiling I want to chance directions.

My questions are two:
Are there only "2" styles of foiling? I mean, racing and freeride and that's it?

And, can anyone recommend a sweet setup for the riding style I describe above? I'm drawn to microboards/skim boards. I also kind of like the idea of playing with different size masts (I have 15", 24", 30", 36") although most seem to stick with just one length.

Thanks so much.

Lastly, I live on the water and have a smaller boat that works ok for wakesurf. It would be nice to have a board setup that works for wakesurfing as well to work on tricks and to take others foiling.

Thanks!

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jumptheshark
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Re: Riding Styles and best foils for curvy carving...

Postby jumptheshark » Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:14 pm

Think Greg from Boardriding Maui ( one of the top circle riders ) was on the lift foils for a bit and is now on the Maui Fin Company foils. They looks sweet.

The Moses onda 633 seems to be the most widely spoken about wing on here.

I'm still content with the zeeko carver wing.

Pocket boards are great.

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Peter_Frank
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Re: Riding Styles and best foils for curvy carving...

Postby Peter_Frank » Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:02 pm

"My questions are two:
Are there only "2" styles of foiling? I mean, racing and freeride and that's it?"


This is a good question, and as we see loads of different "styles" in TT and waves, one would expect the same to be the case with hydrofoils.

After 5 years with foils, and looking at how everyone progress - I would say you have it narrowed down that there IS only these two styles, oddly but somewhat true.

Some like to race, full foil kite gear and top race setups, cool :thumb:

Some like to go fast, maybe not racing, but the same gear maybe second hand from the first group, and maybe doing some of the local competitions to have fun with others at the same not top level but they compete with similar friends.
Awesome :thumb:

Some like to ride freestyle or waves or jump, great :thumb:

Hey, isnt that 3 different styles, the last one?

Not really IMO, as freestyle and waves are same gear, and those liking that, sometimes take a bigger kite and maybe a faster wing maybe their normal wing, for jumping using straps.

At least this is what time has shown around here...

Some of the last group started with used racegear, and found out they rather wanted to carve around, so changed their gear fully into this.
The other way around is rarely or never seen, as those who want to race, start with race gear, so no "converts" this way - but on the other hand many who like to race here, also cool :D

Something in between?
No, never, apart from those using the first couple of foiling years to find out who they are :naughty:

MIght be very different at different locations around the world, but quite evident here that there are these two extremely different styles but not something in between :D

8) PF

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Re: Riding Styles and best foils for curvy carving...

Postby bigtone667 » Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:04 pm

I agree with Peter.... racing and everything else.

My personal journey was the LF Fish, Slingshot Hoverglide, Zeeko Carver, Zeeko Spitfire, Naish Surf Thrust, Fanatic Aero 1500 ........ basically I am interested in Carving and Wave riding. Bigger and Slower worked best for me.
My boards also got gradually smaller as my carving improved.

Welcome to the search for your preferred riding style. There is no right or wrong, just learning.

juandesooka
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Re: Riding Styles and best foils for curvy carving...

Postby juandesooka » Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:25 pm

Agree about race and everything else. I learned on original carafino, then when it was time to upgrade, there were few freeride options available at the time. Greg from BRM was one of the most highly visible free riders, so I asked him what he was using: Stringy (Jim Stringfellow) wings out of Oregon....simple flat G10 that turn nice and fast. So that's what I've been using.

In last month, I've come into some slingshot gear. Tried out hoverglide, nice and stable, a little slower turning maybe. The H4 wing is supposed to be for surf/sup, but I think may actually be more of a large kite wing. Slingshot rates it 3/10 on stability and 10/10 on turning ... it's got a pretty extreme gull wing shape that makes it want to turn more than go straight. Feels too unstable for sup, but I think it's going to be a fun kite option....early lift, so can use small kites, but also quite turney compared to other big wings. The H2 wing also good ... fast and somewhat more locked in feeling, not quite the lift of big surf/sup wings, but more than hoverglide. It'll be fun for longer drawn out carves at speed....if the H4 turns on a pivot, the H2 turns more like a roller coaster on a rail. At least that's initial impressions. Good times!

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Re: Riding Styles and best foils for curvy carving...

Postby Jyoder » Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:23 am

I read for real wave riding you want a foil that is slow with a lot of lift. However, a lot of slow lifty fools don’t turn as easy, right? A few seem to be reported to do both well, and i’ve Read that putting a tiny stabilizer behind a bigger front wing helps liven it up.

That said,
I only know my Stringy foil personally, and while it is from that earlier generation of pre-sup/surf foils, it works well for me for free-ride and I don’t see myself moving on until it breaks, which, seeing as how it’s indestructible, may be never. I’m doing flying foot switch and gybes but not tacks yet.

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Peter_Frank
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Re: Riding Styles and best foils for curvy carving...

Postby Peter_Frank » Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:15 pm

Jyoder wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:23 am
I read for real wave riding you want a foil that is slow with a lot of lift. However, a lot of slow lifty fools don’t turn as easy, right? A few seem to be reported to do both well, and i’ve Read that putting a tiny stabilizer behind a bigger front wing helps liven it up.

That said,
I only know my Stringy foil personally, and while it is from that earlier generation of pre-sup/surf foils, it works well for me for free-ride and I don’t see myself moving on until it breaks, which, seeing as how it’s indestructible, may be never. I’m doing flying foot switch and gybes but not tacks yet.

Well, the thing is, if you got a super low AR big wing it turns REALLY fast.

As the more speed you got, the slower you turn, and high AR wings turns slow too - so you got the best of both worlds having a low AR really big wing, if you want to turn as narrow as possible :thumb:

BUT, there is a but...

Somehow a bit smaller wing that can ride with less drag and more speed, can feel "better" and still carve really tight, as the wing itself can of course turn even faster, IF at the same speed, but as you can ride quite slow with "medium" sized wings 750-850 cm2, these behave extremely well in practically all conditions.

If you use the really big SUP wings with high span, they will turn slower, and not good for waveriding with a kite - I must say I dont know if it doesnt matter as much when you SUPFoil, but it could also be in order to make a low drag wing that can ride open ocean swells on a SUP, as if too low AR you will lose this.

Whether you wants loads of lift or not, is a personal thing IMO - I do both and like both, meaning around 800 cm2 for overall conditions in waves, and sometimes a 1200 cm2 wing, @78 kg.

Using smaller stabs works wonders for turning narrow too, you are correct.
And when over the initial learning, you dont need a big stab.

I really like that you dont have an urge to get new gear - as your current seems to work just dandy :naughty:
Many almost WANT to buy new gear, just to get something new ha haa, eventhough it might not be any better for them...

8) PF

student
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Re: Riding Styles and best foils for curvy carving...

Postby student » Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:45 am

Definitely what Frank says!

Are there only "2" styles of foiling?
Answer in the year 2018: Yes. Racing and Freeride.

And, can anyone recommend a sweet setup for the riding style I describe above?
I got the SS Ghostwhisper 91 (2019) under my feet and would not let it go. It was sooooo much fun! I decided to buy one. Were sold out. Waited for the next shipment and since end of september I did not use my racefoil...
I had an old Dwarfcraft 3'6 and those two fit just perfect (mounted at the very end of the track system). You can ride very very slow, easy to catch and ride waves (1m), you can also go fast (compared to other wings that size), do circles etc.. Never thought it would be so much fun. But maybe I'm still stoked from the last session. Anyway. That's what I would recommend.

I tried the Infinity 76 behind a boat. Just wanted to give that pumping madness a try. Works great. But would rather go for the 84 Infinity if your boat has a small wave. Not tested. Just a guess.

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Re: Riding Styles and best foils for curvy carving...

Postby stevez » Wed Oct 31, 2018 10:50 am

I'm not sure if there are 2 or 3 styles in 2018. I'm not sure if general free riding, mainly on flat water, counts as a separate style to wave riding on a sup / surf foil. If it's on bigger wings and smaller kites, I suppose they're pretty close. As for racing, that's a whole world apart, and a completely different quiver of pricey gear.
I spent a quite a while on a Stringy foil, which I really liked. Then after picking up a Gofoil and riding that in the waves, my whole outlook changed, and I can't go back to riding regular kitefoils in the waves. I'm now riding the kenalu foil. This may be best deal out there at the moment, less than $1000 for a carbon setup. I got both the 775 (1500cm2) and 580 (1050cm2) wings, with a 87cm mast (which is my ideal length). I also have the stock 66cm mast. I use the 775 for waves, and the 580 is a really nice freeride foil for flat water.

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jkrug
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Re: Riding Styles and best foils for curvy carving...

Postby jkrug » Wed Oct 31, 2018 12:06 pm

Peter_Frank wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:15 pm

Many almost WANT to buy new gear, just to get something new ha haa, even though it might not be any better for them...
so true. i kept thinking i needed (wanted?) different gear, but after trying several friends setups, i realized i am quite happy with my status quo. turns out the grass is not always greener over there.


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