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Tuning help Sonic 11m

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mig27
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Re: Tuning help Sonic 11m

Postby mig27 » Sat Jul 02, 2016 1:07 pm

Mossy 757 wrote:The red side looks out of tune based on the last picture you posted. I won't claim to know how to correct the kite since I'm not an expert, but this video by Armin gives a good overview of how/what you're changing when you adjust your mixer.

phpBB [video]
Many thanks :thumb:

Before I saw this video the mixer test was a mystery to me.
This video is quite clear.
With some care this can be done by yourself.

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Re: Tuning help Sonic 11m

Postby davesails7 » Sat Jul 02, 2016 6:34 pm

I've got sonics 9, 11, and 15. Checking that the mixer is even is the first step, but I've had several times that the kites didn't fly right with the mixer correct. I think something must have stretched above the mixer. My two issues were kite pulling to one side and tips collapsing like you are seeing. I changed the mixer settings and determined how to solve these problems through trial and error.

Kite pulling to one side: Shorten the C mixer on the opposite side that it's pulling. If it's pulling to the right, shorten the C on the left side. 1 cm or so has always been enough to fix my problem when a kite was pulling to one side.

Tips collapsing: My 15m had one tip collapsing all the time, the other was collapsing occaisionally. I set the mixer back to equal, and the problem got worse. I tried a bunch of setting one light wind day on the beach, repeatedly changing settings. The setting that worked was shortening both b mixers by about 1 cm. That solved the problem on one side. The other side was still doing it occaisionally. Next, on the bad side, I put B back where it was and added a 1 or 1.5 cm pigtail to the A main on that side. Worked like a charm! for the pigtail, I cut a piece of q power line, doubled it over and tied an 8 knot.

Kites fly great now, but the mixer settings are all over the place. It was kind of a pain figuring this stuff out, but now that I know how to solve these two problems, it's really not problem.

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Re: Tuning help Sonic 11m

Postby Adventure Logs » Sat Jul 02, 2016 8:15 pm

davesails7 wrote:I've got sonics 9, 11, and 15. Checking that the mixer is even is the first step, but I've had several times that the kites didn't fly right with the mixer correct. I think something must have stretched above the mixer. My two issues were kite pulling to one side and tips collapsing like you are seeing. I changed the mixer settings and determined how to solve these problems through trial and error.

Kite pulling to one side: Shorten the C mixer on the opposite side that it's pulling. If it's pulling to the right, shorten the C on the left side. 1 cm or so has always been enough to fix my problem when a kite was pulling to one side.

Tips collapsing: My 15m had one tip collapsing all the time, the other was collapsing occaisionally. I set the mixer back to equal, and the problem got worse. I tried a bunch of setting one light wind day on the beach, repeatedly changing settings. The setting that worked was shortening both b mixers by about 1 cm. That solved the problem on one side. The other side was still doing it occaisionally. Next, on the bad side, I put B back where it was and added a 1 or 1.5 cm pigtail to the A main on that side. Worked like a charm! for the pigtail, I cut a piece of q power line, doubled it over and tied an 8 knot.

Kites fly great now, but the mixer settings are all over the place. It was kind of a pain figuring this stuff out, but now that I know how to solve these two problems, it's really not problem.
That's what I'm not looking forward to, having to figure it out on my own. I really don't have time to do all this trial and error BS before my motorcycle trip south which is the only reason I bought this kite. And I was greatly disappointed with my dealers response of "there has not been one bad sonic produced ever". This next week I'm going to try to figure it out but since I'll be on a lake with sketchy launches, it's not going to be fun.

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Re: Tuning help Sonic 11m

Postby davesails7 » Sat Jul 02, 2016 10:56 pm

Hopefully you wont have to spend time to figure it out. Sounds like same problem I had. I think if you shorten each B mixer by 1 cm or add 1 cm to the A main you will be set.

You don't need to be by water. An open field with 5-10 knots and someone to land the kite a few times should be all you need.

Hope it works out for you!

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Re: Tuning help Sonic 11m

Postby foilholio » Sun Jul 03, 2016 1:37 am

To fix a kite that won't fly straight you want to correct any asymmetry in the front lines and A and B. And if that doesn't work, you then alter the kite with pleats. When checking the bridles you want to do it in a full depowered mode, only securing the fronts mains together, things like uneven C pulley lines can cause the kite fly to one side even if the mixers are even.

General flying issues are best resolved with restretching the bridles. There is also the longer mixer test.


I need to confirm all this more, but B is more important than C for stability. I think it is possible to actually loosen C and increase stability and lift. I think you can transition from tension on B to tension on both C and Z at the same time and then achieve higher camber. The effect is like a wac or diablo line.

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Re: Tuning help Sonic 11m

Postby Adventure Logs » Sun Jul 03, 2016 2:24 pm

davesails7 wrote:Hopefully you wont have to spend time to figure it out. Sounds like same problem I had. I think if you shorten each B mixer by 1 cm or add 1 cm to the A main you will be set.

You don't need to be by water. An open field with 5-10 knots and someone to land the kite a few times should be all you need.

Hope it works out for you!
Which would be better, shorting B or extending A?

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Re: Tuning help Sonic 11m

Postby foilholio » Sun Jul 03, 2016 11:07 pm

they do much the same.

Lengthening A 1 is like reducing B in depower 1 and reducing in the profile B for 3/4 and C 1/2.


Take the advice shorten B 1cm and lengthen A 1cm. If you shortened B 1.75cm and C 0.5cm the profile would be the same, but B would be .25cm longer in depower. I doubt you will notice 0.25cm that much :-). But if you shortened Z 1cm you could correct for the 0.25cm at depower, but you would need to make the adjustments to B and C after you reset the mixer with the shorter Z. Not that that is how I think your kite should be fixed. Generally foils like Z being loosened more because it shrinks and also B and C being loosen more because they shrink and the pulley lines shrink, all limiting depower. The problem you get if you try loosening B and C without Z is the kite gets higher camber and becomes unstable. I would try restretching your bridles or the longmixer test, until you see how the bridles can shrink it can be a bit of a mystery why things aren't right. The Sonic may not shrink as other foils too because of it's thinner bridles.

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Re: Tuning help Sonic 11m

Postby Jzh_perth » Mon Jul 04, 2016 5:50 am

Hi Logsdon.

Lots of good information here but before you chance anything, make sure you are doing the mixer test correctly.

Kami's diagram is how I first learnt it, it's also easy to do with a friend if they can hold the primary flying lines for you. Once you have A and Z level ( which your buddy will help by tensioning the bridle, then bring B and C up to compare. It takes all of 10 seconds per side. The default setting is all knots equal, but the sonic is not very sensitive to the mixer - like if b or c is half a centimetre out, that wouldn't cause the behaviour you describe.

From a neutral / default setting, you can then shorten c -1.5cm and retest. Due to the pulley system B will automatically adjust by half as much.

Also check the overall length of the flying lines - perhaps use your 18 bar to compare, I find the Sonics ARE sensitive to unequal line lengths.

Finally if it's a new kite, remember after 10 hours of flying you need to lengthen the steering lines by 1 knot under the bar floats. This is accounts for the initial shrinkage and is mentioned in the Infinity Bar flyer included with your kite.

Maybe repost some pics of the mixer knots once you have tensioned it correctly. Good luck - I'm sure it can be easily fixed.

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Re: Tuning help Sonic 11m

Postby 14ToeSide » Mon Jul 04, 2016 6:05 am

Man! Having to worry and think about all this Mixer stuff is giving me a headache !!! I need a 55 Select!!

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Re: Tuning help Sonic 11m

Postby foilholio » Mon Jul 04, 2016 8:55 am

Ahahaha, Pullstrings you shouldn't be so obvious.


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