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Launching Foil Kites from deep water (with Sonic2)

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Re: Launching Foil Kites from deep water (with Sonic2)

Postby Kamikuza » Mon May 01, 2017 2:02 pm

Wow, well done!

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Horst Sergio
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Re: Launching Foil Kites from deep water (with Sonic2)

Postby Horst Sergio » Tue May 02, 2017 10:24 am

MacG wrote:
Mon May 01, 2017 12:56 am
... Question re: "On high wind conditions you may also attach your leash first of all to the chickenloop especially if you have a swivel in the leash".

If you are going to attach your leash to a partially unwound bar it sounds like things could get real fun if your launch goes FUBAR. What is the advantage of attaching early? ...
Hi,
as also joriws wrotes the bar was wind up in backstall position (and one benefit is if once attached it is impossible to produce a serious tangle, also if you let go of the bar for a moment during filling the kite).
But while unwinding in a perfect world the kite can't launch in this backstall position, which means you may attach your leash first of all, as on the end you might not have the time anymore or can forget about it... will come to that point later.

The true is especially when not winded up carefully before, during preparation, and if not being carefully when winding off, it may happen that one steering line may slip of one time more then the other lines. In this moment this side of the kite will be depowert and can launch and start to spin. If you are not sure about having the unwinding process 100% under control and to let go the kite is an option than: Not attaching the leash might be an option. But on the other hand if something goes wrong with the leash attached, there is also still the leash quick release and a leash with foam will help the released bar to float which can also be important.

The main reason to attach the leash first is that, if you have completely unwinded the bar in high wind condition it is very likely that you don't have the time anymore to attach it, especially as the kite pull starts to get strong and if you just hook in in this moment and there will be some problems you just can release completely and not put the kite in the safety.

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Re: Launching Foil Kites from deep water (with Sonic2)

Postby Starsky » Tue May 02, 2017 1:52 pm

This is totally awesome. Much respect for anyone who can do this reliably. Hydrofoils make all this feasible as its so much easier to do these things in light winds with no real waves.

I have had so many drift launches in high winds go south back in the day, but have somehow settled into quite reliable techniques with inflatables in light conditions.

I like drift launching strutless kites. They stick to the water well, drift slowly, launch reliably and most importantly are being drifted in under 15 knots. For above 15 knots I will be using a two tip strut 6m and short 17m lines.

A big improvement for me has been using a very clean bar set up. No line extensions, no trim strap, no chicken loop, no swivel. Just bare bones.

Unwinding lines is a last resort. I will most often just trail the lines cleanly into the water from land when feasible. If not, I will load the lines into a snug stuff sack in a manner that deploys them cleanly as the kite drifts. Both techniques have been working well, but again, I'm now drift launching in lower winds than I ever used to.

Site selection is another factor to consider. I have a spot that I drift launch only in pretty windy conditions. I can swim out to a wind line, drift the kite just inside the point in nice flat water and once the lines are out and clear, swim the kite out another 20 Ft into the higher winds. I have another spot where I can reliably stand while drifting the kite into a bit of a lee. I also look for clear exposed spots to place my foil so that I can swim freely while drift launching and simply go retrieve the foil with the kite in the air. Every spot is different, and there is a full skill set to develop if your going to become proficient at drifting.
Last edited by Starsky on Tue May 02, 2017 2:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Launching Foil Kites from deep water (with Sonic2)

Postby FLandOBX » Tue May 02, 2017 2:08 pm

Very impressive, Horst. I am a fan. :thumb:

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Re: Launching Foil Kites from deep water (with Sonic2)

Postby Horst Sergio » Tue Oct 24, 2017 11:43 am

Thanks,
but it is not so big deal just learn it step by step and become an real all terrain foil kiter :thumb:

To make it complete, here is a more than 10 year old video from a Speed 1 with Bubi on the bar allready doing the same thing:

phpBB [video]


I have done the same in 2006 with much lower experience than now.
And even with the Flysurfer Titan from 2003 this manouver shouldn't be a big deal.
Want to try it one day with my Psycho 1 from 2002 as I used it a few days ago and was surprised who well it behaved in a normal relaunch situation.

I have even done a water backwards relaunched with an open cell Windtools Mosquito 1 from 1997 on handles these days, while sitting on a foilboard in maybe just 6 but in no case more than 7 knts of wind. :rollgrin:
( I know that for sure, as in 8 knots the 7,5 m² is fully over powered on the monofoil and no more ride able :wink: , see viewtopic.php?f=196&t=2393935&p=992788#p992788 )


Its just in kiters brains that foil kites don't relaunch well in water, but in fact you just have to allow them to start and they will rise them self. :D

Bernd (Mosquito 1 relauncher 8) )
Kitejunkie-1997-Windtools-Mosquito-Water-Relaunch.jpg

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Re: Launching Foil Kites from deep water (with Sonic2)

Postby Carlos_C » Tue Oct 24, 2017 12:36 pm

I think the secret for relaunch is patience.........if you can get the kite on it's trailing edge - even a waterlogged kite can launch.

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Re: Launching Foil Kites from deep water (with Sonic2)

Postby pmaggie » Wed Oct 25, 2017 9:00 am

Thanks Sergio, really useful!

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Horst Sergio
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Re: Launching Foil Kites from deep water (with Sonic2)

Postby Horst Sergio » Sat Oct 28, 2017 4:03 pm

pmaggie wrote:
Wed Oct 25, 2017 8:55 am
... Do I please have to oversheet with both the floaters when I feel it's falling down?
Means if the kite tends to fly out of the wind window and front stalls due to a wind shift a hard drop of wind force or a missed maneuver.

Hi Paolo,
copied this from the other topic viewtopic.php?f=197&t=2397811&p=993518#p993518
as question fist better here.

Normally it is enough to grab into one of both floaters, so oversheeting by about 20-40 cm by one side . Or to be more precise: In the first second it is more a fast strike with the edge of your hand, after you may grab above the floater.
Normally in the case with one floater, you can also over sheet with the other steering line while fully powering up and steering to the side with the hand left on the bar as seen on the picture.

In some extrem cases it can be needed to strike into the steering lines with both hands and to pull both hands with the steering lines as far behind your body, so pulling in the lines by about 1-2 m, but this is just necessary or makes sense if line tension is already totally lost and kite starts to be in free flight.

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Re: Launching Foil Kites from deep water (with Sonic2)

Postby br44 » Sun Oct 29, 2017 5:41 pm

Sergio, any comments on water temperature? Have you done these launches in cold water?

Also have you explored using a small boat anchor? If installed in advance (by swimming), I imagine that a small boat anchor with a floater would largely eliminate drifting downwind; which could be helpful when the launch spot is tight (trees etc) or the wind onshore.

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Re: Launching Foil Kites from deep water (with Sonic2)

Postby Horst Sergio » Mon Oct 30, 2017 5:02 pm

br44 wrote:
Sun Oct 29, 2017 5:41 pm
Sergio, any comments on water temperature? Have you done these launches in cold water?
Hi br44,
not sure if I understand the question right. Outdoor and water temperature is just about the right cloth, as my mother told me 8) . But in most of the pictures water was around 10°C, but doesn't change anything talking about relaunch for me.
br44 wrote:
Sun Oct 29, 2017 5:41 pm
Also have you explored using a small boat anchor? If installed in advance (by swimming), I imagine that a small boat anchor with a floater would largely eliminate drifting downwind; which could be helpful when the launch spot is tight (trees etc) or the wind onshore.
No, please never ever use any kind of anchor, not on the land and not on the water, it just can be extremly dangerous in many ways and benefit is close to zero. It is very bad and stupid :angryfire: that some firms sell anchors for land with their kites. I also have had a few bad experiences on land 15 years ago and a view years ago two brave guys drowened in a river in my home town, when they tried to ride in that river with board leashes which both "anchored" them self on a tree or something! :cry:

So don't even think about any anchor experiments, it may kill you before you understand the situation itself. :!:

If you have a just onshore spot, you just have to swim out a longer way, added effort is worth your live, for sure.


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