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Pulsion 18m

For all foil kite riders


Regis-de-giens
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foil Ketos, Zone, OR mako, snowskis, kite-boat
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Re: Pulsion 18m

Postby Regis-de-giens » Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:41 am

Thanks .
Could you make a sketch of the point to measure ? I do not get which % You want. We need to Hurry-up because I sold the kite to go back to 15m2 .

But A15 would not have flow in this poor wind. Certain from my a9 experience and weight measurement . A s4 lotus and Aurora light would also be down the ground.

I think that AR is a bit higher in this size vs a18.

foilholio
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Re: Pulsion 18m

Postby foilholio » Sat Jul 07, 2018 7:47 am

No I meant in the way it turns and seems to behave, it is similar. I do think 18m ultralight A15 would fly close to that wind maybe .5 knot more. Yes AR looks slightly higher.

As to measurements. Look at the bottom left of this picture which is a airfoil cross section. There is a Blue line the cord and a Red line the thickness. I want you to measure them on the cell wall of the center cell. They are basically the longest points on 2 single axises. The % thing is just how airfoil thickness is usually notated, as a % of the cord length.

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kitexpert
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Re: Pulsion 18m

Postby kitexpert » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:32 pm

foilholio wrote: I want you to measure them on the cell wall of the center cell. They are basically the longest points on 2 single axises. The % thing is just how airfoil thickness is usually notated, as a % of the cord length.
Foilholio, you gonna play a kite designer? :lol: Actually very good question and especially so for Pulsion which airfoil thickness has been under some interest. A 15 airfoil thickness would be nice to know too - but I'd guess it is usual 18% (of the chord).

If airfoil is thinner than usual cell shape becomes worse and wing itself less rigid. Aerodynamically there is some advantages but also disadvantages with thin airfoils, structurally mostly disadvantages.
foilholio wrote: No I meant in the way it turns and seems to behave, it is similar.
All big foil kites are slow, similar in that respect for sure. Very light weight helps when is kite climbing up and for lulls but more important is that kiter knows how to fly it. If experienced kiter has to struggle to keep kite in the air it is quite sad wind for kiting. Questionable if it is reasonable to judge kites from that basis.

Regis-de-giens
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Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2014 2:58 pm
Kiting since: 2002
Local Beach: France: St Laurent du Var, Cannes, Almanarre
Style: 62 kg , light wind
Gear: Conceptair pulsion 15&12, Elf 11 &7, OR Flite 10m , Airush One 9&6, Rally 6&4.
foil Ketos, Zone, OR mako, snowskis, kite-boat
Brand Affiliation: None

Re: Pulsion 18m

Postby Regis-de-giens » Sat Jul 07, 2018 10:28 pm

Foilholio
Sorry I packed the kite for the buyer and forgot to measure :oops:
kitexpert wrote:
Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:32 pm
Questionable if it is reasonable to judge kites from that basis.
This depends on your objectives. If you are seeking for lowest end , this is obviously useful for two reasons :

- you can theoretically foil as soon as the kite is stable in air . So "static zenith flight" for on-shore winds and even "slightly worked flight" for side- or off-shore winds. It is the case for me with the Pulsion (15m not 18m for my weigth)

- and even if you prefer (or have to) get higher winds to ride (not my case and I should not be the only one) , you still have high risks to get wind drops or lulls during the ride. Then such a good behaviour as shown on the video allows you to come back to shore without putting the kite in the water, with or without recovery loops.

So IMO marginal wind flight ability allows you to either reduce your swimming risk and/or extend your ride range (depending on weight, objectives and skills).

kitexpert
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Re: Pulsion 18m

Postby kitexpert » Sun Jul 08, 2018 8:13 pm

Regis-de-giens wrote: So IMO marginal wind flight ability allows you to either reduce your swimming risk
I don't know, or is the opposite true :lol: If wind is very low there is a risk it will go near zero and it is game over no matter what kind of kite it is. Of course it has some interest to push the limits, but it is not for great majority of kiters, including hydrofoilers.

Personally I just don't want to push the envelope too much (if I do I prefer to do it on the snow/ice, then I can go to 4-6kn depending wind and surface quality, but it is quite lame). I just had decent foil day with a LEI, no white water or other kiters. No difficulties to keep kite in the air, I guess it was about 8-9kn. If it is lower than that there is something else to do.

You can as well measure 15m Pulsion, very probably it has same airfoil as 18m Pulsion.

PullStrings
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Re: Pulsion 18m

Postby PullStrings » Sun Jul 08, 2018 10:16 pm

kitexpert wrote:
Sun Jul 08, 2018 8:13 pm
I just had decent foil day with a LEI, no white water or other kiters.
No difficulties to keep kite in the air, I guess it was about 8-9kn.
:clap: It is so refreshing to read on KF some realistic wind speed numbers :cheers:

foilholio
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Re: Pulsion 18m

Postby foilholio » Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:07 am

kitexpert wrote: If wind is very low there is a risk it will go near zero and it is game over no matter what kind of kite it is
Nope no game over, only game over if wind never returns to relaunch or pilot is not skilled enough. The best approach for no wind is to land the kite TE down downwind ready for relaunch. Then kite really matters, one which doesn't take on water and can drain any it does. For this flysurfer is the market leader.
kitexpert wrote: I just had decent foil day with a LEI, no white water or other kiters. No difficulties to keep kite in the air, I guess it was about 8-9kn.
Of course you were on a LEI, your own design I am sure. 8-9knots is not a low wind, for this standard fabric foil kite can still drift with slack lines on waves, LEI only strutless can but not as well. The light wind flying range for the ultra light foil kites is really sub 3 knots. Not much traction is possible there. It really is about making 4 knots were good traction is possible better and kite doesn't fall in the water where sub 4knots relaunch is not possible.

14ToeSide
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Re: Pulsion 18m

Postby 14ToeSide » Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:28 am

Hey Pullo,

How about 2-4?

14

PullStrings
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Re: Pulsion 18m

Postby PullStrings » Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:57 am

foilholio wrote:
Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:07 am
kitexpert wrote: If wind is very low there is a risk it will go near zero and it is game over no matter what kind of kite it is
Nope no game over, only game over if wind never returns to relaunch or pilot is not skilled enough.
The best approach for no wind is to land the kite TE down downwind ready for relaunch.
Seen it ...very low wind goes suddenly to near zero with Flysurfer...kite falls out of control...balls up.. twists... hourglass...big mess...nightmare...headache
Even highly skilled pilot...1000 hours ram air lightwind experience

Foolholio
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foilholio
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Re: Pulsion 18m

Postby foilholio » Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:37 am

1000hours well that is foil beginner still, try 10000+ and you can start to lecture me on what can and cant be done with a foil kite.

Wind rarely goes to absolute 0. There is often signs wind is about to change which you can feel in the kite. With the correct position in no wind foils can still drift nicely to the water. You can correct a kite in the air by pulling on a line or lines. You can untangle a foil on the water. It is far from game over.


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