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More wings, the hard way?

Forum for hydrofoil builders.


opie
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Re: More wings, the hard way?

Postby opie » Wed Feb 14, 2018 2:00 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5tp4QXciK4&t=7s

This guy helped me break though the wall of frustration with fusion 360.

Once you understand a little you can follow the time line of someone else's wing design to see how they get the curves in different planes.

And there is a free way to get fusion 360, for hobbyists and students.

tahoedirk
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Re: More wings, the hard way?

Postby tahoedirk » Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:43 pm

Building will be obsolete soon enough.

computers are fascinating and cool and powerful and amazing and there is so much to learn. I feel funny about programing and printing being called building. In this new age it will be the norm. Probably already is for kites, boards and foils.

Our food is grown and raised by robots and computers, bad.

Our buildings are being designed and printed and engineered by our computers. Many tools operate on their own now.

School children carry phones with big batteries next to their hearts which are permanently linked to a internet full of controlled fake information.

I find it a bummer .The craftsman are disappearing.

In medicine, computers, Pharmaceutical and insurance companies call the shots, not the doctors or the patients

I got to breathe some sawdust and get it all over me the other day, It had been a while.

I love making artistic things with my hands, from scratch if possible. I have been a building contractor for 27 years and ,sadly, the art and creativity is nearly lost. Gorgeous
Chinese design tile is barely artistic anymore. t is made as cheap as possible in a factory across the world. Dot matrix, computer printed ceramic tile is common.

Of course, the obvious (good?) part is you can buy hydrofoils and lots of stuff for not much money nowadays

Remember hand written receipts and no message machines or calculators


I hope there will always be people who appreciate handmade goods , even if they cost more and are imperfect

Happy building

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Bille
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Re: More wings, the hard way?

Postby Bille » Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:53 pm

opie wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 2:00 pm
...

This guy helped me break though the wall of frustration with fusion 360.

...
And i thank Ya for finding that break in the wall, for me !! :thumb:
That first 20-min video , was over in what seamed like 3 ; tells me that my
interest was peaked , (Big-Time) !
opie wrote:
Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:29 am
I am printing a mast mold right now to see if I can make it work. 20 hours? I wish. My six mast mold prints are taking 36 hours each.

..
Would it be faster, if you stopped making self-supporting parts for the mold ?
Perhaps building it 1mm thick from where the high-point of the airfoil is ; then
glue it to a support structure, like 2X4 and ply.


Bille

opie
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Re: More wings, the hard way?

Postby opie » Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:58 pm

tahoedirk wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:43 pm
Building will be obsolete soon enough.

computers are fascinating and cool and powerful and amazing and there is so much to learn. I feel funny about programing and printing being called building. In this new age it will be the norm. Probably already is for kites, boards and foils.

Our food is grown and raised by robots and computers, bad.

Our buildings are being designed and printed and engineered by our computers. Many tools operate on their own now.

School children carry phones with big batteries next to their hearts which are permanently linked to a internet full of controlled fake information.

I find it a bummer .The craftsman are disappearing.

In medicine, computers, Pharmaceutical and insurance companies call the shots, not the doctors or the patients

I got to breathe some sawdust and get it all over me the other day, It had been a while.

I love making artistic things with my hands, from scratch if possible. I have been a building contractor for 27 years and ,sadly, the art and creativity is nearly lost. Gorgeous
Chinese design tile is barely artistic anymore. t is made as cheap as possible in a factory across the world. Dot matrix, computer printed ceramic tile is common.

Of course, the obvious (good?) part is you can buy hydrofoils and lots of stuff for not much money nowadays

Remember hand written receipts and no message machines or calculators


I hope there will always be people who appreciate handmade goods , even if they cost more and are imperfect

Happy building
I am hoping the 3d printer will encourage my 11 year old to make things. I think this technology and others are going to increase individuals creating things for themselves, a reactionary movement back away from buying everything in throw away form from factories.

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Re: More wings, the hard way?

Postby TomW » Fri Feb 16, 2018 1:56 am

Designing in Cad is an art form. I've been doing it 30 years, and work with Cad modellers that are craftsmen. Getting a cnc or 3d printer to do what you need and want to do is the same as using a handtool. Just different. And complicated.
I come from a background of craft and model making from t-square, and following technology to 5 axis cnc. 1975-2017. It still comes down to knowing your tools, materials and manipulation of the craft.
It's all one thing, but just a spectrum of tools.
It's a fantastic and amazing period we are living in, a revolutionary change happening.
There's room for sticking to the tried and true tools and combined with new methods.
Just use your creativity and make stuff.

TomW
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Re: More wings, the hard way?

Postby TomW » Fri Feb 16, 2018 2:17 am

opie wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 2:00 pm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5tp4QXciK4&t=7s

This guy helped me break though the wall of frustration with fusion 360.

Once you understand a little you can follow the time line of someone else's wing design to see how they get the curves in different planes.

And there is a free way to get fusion 360, for hobbyists and students.
Where is this guy explaining how to draw free-form curves in multiple planes!? I can't find it. I know all this stuff about working on planes, I can't figure out how to do it like on more advanced Cad programs like Nx.

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downunder
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Re: More wings, the hard way?

Postby downunder » Fri Feb 16, 2018 3:02 am

opie wrote:
Thu Feb 15, 2018 12:58 pm
tahoedirk wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:43 pm
.
.

Building will be obsolete soon enough.
.
.
I am hoping the 3d printer will encourage my 11 year old to make things. I think this technology and others are going to increase individuals creating things for themselves, a reactionary movement back away from buying everything in throw away form from factories.

I don't think the 3d printers will add anything on a grand scale. It might be more rubbish, more stuff in a shops and nothing to buy - go to Japan (or many other), see it for yourself.

Some 5 years ago the talks were like 3d is a revolutionary thingy, the kids will make own toys. Nope. It did not happen. Actually produced more and more plastic and I would heavily tax them.
Simply because the average customers did not have the opportunity to make plastic before. And they do now. It's adding, everything is adding to the pollution. What we are making is a progression to a garbage on Global scale. We don't know what will happen but it won't be all flowers and honey. I feel sad for new generations, have no kids of my own.

There is a reason why I'm using Entropy epoxies and not much fiberglass at all (no graphics either, or topsheets). If not, it would not make sense - for me.

I almost got a wood lathe yesterday (God, I was 13yo when turned first wood). With lathe I could make ie a fuselage in 10 mins from wood. Wrap it in 20. Make a mast slot in 40, and wing slots in 20. All together about 1-2hrs. Actually, drilling for mast and wings is the complicated part coz have no proper tools.

Started using my sewing machine the other day...Made my first project - a long kite bag when struts are inflated and LE is not. And that will lead me to making my own kites...

Oh, btw, I was AutoCad instructor for like years :) However, I actually enjoyed heaps more drawing on a flat table, with a pen and rapidograph.

opie
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Re: More wings, the hard way?

Postby opie » Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:35 am

TomW wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 2:17 am

Where is this guy explaining how to draw free-form curves in multiple planes!? I can't find it. I know all this stuff about working on planes, I can't figure out how to do it like on more advanced Cad programs like Nx.
He doesn't. Check out the example wing design file this other guy put on his website and follow the timeline to see how he did it.
http://www.greypaddleboards.com/drawing ... usion-360/

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Bille
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Re: More wings, the hard way?

Postby Bille » Fri Feb 16, 2018 11:36 am

TomW wrote:
Fri Feb 16, 2018 1:56 am
Designing in Cad is an art form.
...
It still comes down to knowing your tools,
...
It's a fantastic and amazing period we are living in, a revolutionary change happening.
There's room for sticking to the tried and true tools and combined with new methods.
Just use your creativity and make stuff.
Awesome way to explain it ; just a different way , to achieve the same end !! :thumb:

I spent 10 hours, shaping this part , and another 20 or so making
the mold, then i had to buy the stuff to put in the mold, then actually fill the mold
to get the part ; if i could do that on a 3D printer , (i would).

Bille
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Kevin Brooker
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Re: More wings, the hard way?

Postby Kevin Brooker » Fri Feb 16, 2018 1:38 pm

If we are worried about creating garbage stop using composites. aside from the embedded waste from production the manufacturing process is very dependent upon consumables. As individuals we can reduce this but on a production scale the waste is enormous. Prototyping is hugely wasteful. Make a few molds for a few pieces and they go into the trash. Most prototypes end up as landfill material. Rather than bum out on kids using plastic ( our resins are just plastic regardless of the source) let's set an example of how to minimize our landfill impacts. Let's teach them about resource management. One of these inspired kids might find a workable solution. One good printed mold is a lot less resource intensive than laying up glass and finding out it didn't work. If the resin in the printed mold can be reused it is much more ecologically sound then a bad layer up mold. CAD and CNC are great tool and as previously pointed out are another way to do something. Kites are cut with CNC which is less wasteful, faster, and repeatable which cuts costs while upping profit margins for the manufacturing outfits.


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