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failure of the QR while in death loop

Forum with lots of safety info - a must for newbees


Rhamil
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failure of the QR while in death loop

Postby Rhamil » Mon May 19, 2014 3:37 pm

crashed a jump on Friday and kite fell out of the sky and relaunched quickly into a death loop, after about 3 loops (split second) i pushed the qr on my rally 13' and it wouldn't release, I pushed as hard as i could and it wouldn't release, I am a 190 lb strong guy, the qr wouldn't give, my hands are cut from pushing it so hard. i was drowning at this point and somehow managed to pull the chicken loop off. The lines were so twisted that the kite didn't de-power at all while attached only to the leash, so i had to let the kite go completely never to be found again.

I have an email in to slingshot to see why my qr didnt work because it almost killed me! I am not sure if i had a faulty system or if it just didnt release bc of the extreme load, but none the less if i didnt get the chicken loop off i wouldn't be writing this!

ALWAYS CHECK SAFETY SYSTEMS AND MAKE SAFETY TOP PRIORITY, THIS INCIDENT HAPPENED IN LESS THAN A SECOND

NorCalNomad
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Re: failure of the qr while in death loop

Postby NorCalNomad » Mon May 19, 2014 6:32 pm

A properly designed quick release shouldn't fail under even under the the most extreme loads it could encounter, and with the bar fully sheeted in...

we
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Re: failure of the qr while in death loop

Postby we » Mon May 19, 2014 7:29 pm

I've never had an issue but I have seen first hand others having this issue. Instead of grabbing the release, they grab the metal piece on the CL side of the release and pull as hard as they can.

I would recommend practicing so that you can release without looking at it.

nesterg
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Re: failure of the qr while in death loop

Postby nesterg » Wed Jun 07, 2017 12:28 am

This happened to me too with a SS bar after a failed trick. When the lines wrap around the bar the bar is frozen in what ever position it is in. In your case it sounds like bar was fully powered which puts the bar right up against the safety release (qr)so there is no room to push the release away and therefore you can't release. Mine had just enough room to activate the release and that cleared the line wrap but I hear that doesn't always fix the wrap.
I think this could happen on most bars out there. Not just SS but
I'm looking for a new bar that is safer. Any suggestions?
The Cabrinha X1 has a stop on the center line preventing the bar from coming down all the way against the safety release and preventing release like what you experienced.
Good job getting out of that one. I think that would have killed most kiters.

NorCalNomad
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Re: failure of the qr while in death loop

Postby NorCalNomad » Wed Jun 07, 2017 12:54 am

Pretty sure the SS bar was one the last to switch over their chickenloop QR design to prevent this exact blatant problem. I'm the last person to usually lay blame on manufactures of product but, year after year they ignored updating this serious safety flaw in their design.

This version is dangerous for the reason of not being able to activate the QR when the bar is pulled/pressed against the QR.
Image

The new one is safer
Image

norcom
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Re: failure of the qr while in death loop

Postby norcom » Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:00 am

NorCalNomad wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2017 12:54 am
Pretty sure the SS bar was one the last to switch over their chickenloop QR design to prevent this exact blatant problem. I'm the last person to usually lay blame on manufactures of product but, year after year they ignored updating this serious safety flaw in their design.

This version is dangerous for the reason of not being able to activate the QR when the bar is pulled/pressed against the QR.
Image

The new one is safer
Image
Those are two completely different design bars. One with below the bar and one's above the bar trim. Both are still offered by Slingshot. I prefer the below the bar. I've only seen the new 2017 Naish bar with the below the bar trim and a swivel option.

It would be VERY hard to get the Slingshot bar and QR to tangle up and stay SO LOW that you can't release the QR because the bar's pressing on the QR. Slingshot is one of the BEST QR's I've used and I release more than anyone I know locally. Because fuck getting hurt.

My current favorite kites (Best Cabo) and the Best RP bars are much harder to release than the Slingshot bars (all below the bar). The few years old Cabrinha bars have a similar design and it's also pretty much impossible to have the bar get stuck that low, even if you wrap lines around it. All you need is barely half an inch to release.

:roll:

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Re: failure of the QR while in death loop

Postby matth » Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:43 am

North also has an excellent release. I have always been an advocate of practicing hitting your release to create muscle memory. Also I have recently started to hit my release when I land my kite instead of unhooking DD and CL from hook in traditional fashion. I find its faster to just hit QR , builds MM , and keeps the system fresh from sand and corrosion. Give it a try it, works well. :wink: :D

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sabraxas
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Re: failure of the qr while in death loop

Postby sabraxas » Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:15 am

NorCalNomad wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2017 12:54 am

This version is dangerous for the reason of not being able to activate the QR when the bar is pulled/pressed against the QR.
Pardon my ignorance, but i cant figure it out a situation as you describe: Pulling the bar against the chicken loop and activating the QR at the same time.

The only situation that i can imagine is being unhooked and pressing the bar against the chicken loop. But you dont need to activate the QR in case of emergency, its enough to let the bar go.
Even if you trim the kite at maximum depower, letting the bar pressing the QR , you wont be able to fly the kite properly, and would be time to get out of the water and change to a smaller size.

NorCalNomad
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Re: failure of the qr while in death loop

Postby NorCalNomad » Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:57 am

Sabraxas and matth
Did you guys not read this post RIGHT ABOVE MINE?
nesterg wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2017 12:28 am
This happened to me too with a SS bar after a failed trick. When the lines wrap around the bar the bar is frozen in what ever position it is in. In your case it sounds like bar was fully powered which puts the bar right up against the safety release (qr)so there is no room to push the release away and therefore you can't release. Mine had just enough room to activate the release and that cleared the line wrap but I hear that doesn't always fix the wrap.
I think this could happen on most bars out there. Not just SS but
I'm looking for a new bar that is safer. Any suggestions?
The Cabrinha X1 has a stop on the center line preventing the bar from coming down all the way against the safety release and preventing release like what you experienced.
Good job getting out of that one. I think that would have killed most kiters.
Yeah I know they are different, but...
Having a safety release that doesn't release some situations is a shitty safety release. Naish figured out how to have below the bar and an actual safety release :thumb:

There is a reason just about ever safety release looks like a North Ironheart now. Yeah they (North) spins some marketing, but when other kite companies are copying or are even buying their competitor's product to sell themselves (BEST) there isn't too much to argue on.

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sabraxas
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Re: failure of the qr while in death loop

Postby sabraxas » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:38 am

NorCalNomad wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:57 am
Sabraxas and matth
Did you guys not read this post RIGHT ABOVE MINE?
nesterg wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2017 12:28 am
This happened to me too with a SS bar after a failed trick. When the lines wrap around the bar the bar is frozen in what ever position it is in. In your case IT SOUNDS LIKE bar was fully powered which puts the bar right up against the safety release (qr)so there is no room to push the release away and therefore you can't release. Mine had just enough room to activate the release and that cleared the line wrap but I hear that doesn't always fix the wrap.
I think this could happen on most bars out there. Not just SS but
Now i figure it out.

Yeap, i ve read that: "It sounds like" - "When the lines wrap around the bar the bar is frozen in what ever position it is in"

Well, when the lines are wrapped around the bar you could not even eject in a North Bar, or any other bar.



I ve had an Ocean Rodeo Rise, 2009. The kite leash was hooked in the strap of the trim rope and the clamcleat was below the bar.
Once ejected, the kite was totally depowered in suicide mode, the kite fell down in water and relaunched alone, and then fell down again and relaunched again, time after time, pulling you hard. The fact was that you were not able to break that loop, the trim rope was heavily bitten by the clamcleat and the bar was pulled against chicken loop, but this happened once ejected.
So, you were dragged hard if you couldnt set up again the bar in the right position. You had to pull very VERY hard the trim rope and get it out of the clamcleat to release the bar. If you couldnt do that, you had to totally release the kite.


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