Contact   Imprint   Advertising   Guidelines

Issue with Naish Kite leading edge, manufacturing defect ?

forum for kitesurfers


Matteo V
Frequent Poster
Posts: 326
Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 3:42 pm
Kiting since: 2008
Local Beach: US, Iowa/Nebraska/Kansas/Utah/Oregon Coast
Favorite Beaches: Ft. Stevens, North coast of Oregon
Style: Just like school in summertime
Gear: Delta Kites and LF Kitefish QuadMod
Snowboard (Cambered and Rockered)
Foil kites on the snow
Brand Affiliation: NONE F--- the corporate world

Re: Issue with Naish Kite leading edge, manufacturing defect ?

Postby Matteo V » Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:32 pm

gilana wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 10:42 pm
all it needs is for a fold to be compressed for a weak spot to be created.
I could be taking your statement in the wrong way, but if you suggest a crease created by a fold is a potential weak spot,.......Not on any LE I have ever seen.

I even have a 2013 Best kahoona that I got off of Ikitesurf (before you had to sign up as a registered user) that was dragged across rocks on the LE and has cuts about 50% of the way through the leading edge. I flew and crashed it before I realized it was damaged (canopy was almost new and there were less than 10 sessions before I bought it). It never blew up.

That said, it is not what I would consider an ocean worthy kite.

If the OP is telling the truth, then it is a warranty issue. But no kite company will warrant this as they will all parrot the feedback on this thread you are getting - "its your fault.......even if it isn't".

Remember, warranty claims (like car warranties, or appliance warranties) are paid for by companies that make more money by denying your claim. I don't think there is any kite brand not operating under this premise.

So don't buy Naish anymore if they deny the claim. It is the only power that kiters have over the corporate kiteboarding machine. Maybe some kite brand will come along and realize that there are kiters out there actually looking for a brand with a warranty department that is not into denying every claim. And hopefully, in my lifetime, some kite company will come along and not care if they get defrauded on one or two kites, so long as they never deny a legitimate claim.

User avatar
gilana
Medium Poster
Posts: 96
Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 1:34 am
Kiting since: 2014
Local Beach: We live on our sailing yacht and at the moment we are in the San Blas Islands of Panama, and we sometimes have visiting guests to come spend a week of wind with us...

Laura and Mike
Favorite Beaches: Chameys in San Andres Isla Colombia
Yansaladup in Kuna Yala Panama
Style: Old School
Gear: Ozone Edge 9m V8
Ozone Edge 9m V9
Ozone Edge 10m V9
Caution Santa Cruz Redline 132 TT
Advance "JB-Weld Special" :) 140x40 TT
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: San Blas Panama
Contact:

Re: Issue with Naish Kite leading edge, manufacturing defect ?

Postby gilana » Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:24 pm

Matteo V wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:32 pm
gilana wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 10:42 pm
all it needs is for a fold to be compressed for a weak spot to be created.
....

So don't buy Naish anymore if they deny the claim. It is the only power that kiters have over the corporate kiteboarding machine. Maybe some kite brand will come along and realize that there are kiters out there actually looking for a brand with a warranty department that is not into denying every claim. And hopefully, in my lifetime, some kite company will come along and not care if they get defrauded on one or two kites, so long as they never deny a legitimate claim.
Matteo I could not agree with you more, but, I did not mean a fold, I meant a fold getting crushed in...

iriejohn
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 785
Joined: Fri Dec 18, 2015 11:04 pm
Kiting since: 0
Local Beach: West Sussex
Gear: this 'n that
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: South coast, UK

Re: Issue with Naish Kite leading edge, manufacturing defect ?

Postby iriejohn » Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:47 pm

Matteo V wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:32 pm
gilana wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 10:42 pm
all it needs is for a fold to be compressed for a weak spot to be created.
I could be taking your statement in the wrong way, but if you suggest a crease created by a fold is a potential weak spot,.......Not on any LE I have ever seen.

I even have a 2013 Best kahoona that I got off of Ikitesurf (before you had to sign up as a registered user) that was dragged across rocks on the LE and has cuts about 50% of the way through the leading edge. I flew and crashed it before I realized it was damaged (canopy was almost new and there were less than 10 sessions before I bought it). It never blew up.

That said, it is not what I would consider an ocean worthy kite.

If the OP is telling the truth, then it is a warranty issue. But no kite company will warrant this as they will all parrot the feedback on this thread you are getting - "its your fault.......even if it isn't".

Remember, warranty claims (like car warranties, or appliance warranties) are paid for by companies that make more money by denying your claim. I don't think there is any kite brand not operating under this premise.

So don't buy Naish anymore if they deny the claim. It is the only power that kiters have over the corporate kiteboarding machine. Maybe some kite brand will come along and realize that there are kiters out there actually looking for a brand with a warranty department that is not into denying every claim. And hopefully, in my lifetime, some kite company will come along and not care if they get defrauded on one or two kites, so long as they never deny a legitimate claim.
You can not have read the previous posts in this thread otherwise you would not have made such a silly statement.

foilonfoil
Frequent Poster
Posts: 458
Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2015 8:31 am
Kiting since: 2013
Local Beach: Belmont Shore, CA / Hood River, OR
Favorite Beaches: Crissy Field, San Francisco, CA / Benicia, CA / Sail Bay, San Diego, CA / Hermosa Beach, CA
Style: Kitefoil
Gear: Current: Flysurfer Sonic 2's, Core Section V1's, MikesLab Foil, Camet Boards. Previous: AlpineFoil Carbon 5.0, Spotz Tuna/Shark, Banga
Brand Affiliation: None

Re: Issue with Naish Kite leading edge, manufacturing defect ?

Postby foilonfoil » Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:54 am

NorthernKitesAus wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:03 am
foilonfoil wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 1:25 am
Its a simple repair. Patch the leading edge, put a new bladder in and move on.
LOL

Are you for real? Must be joking, right?

It will need to be professionally repaired and you'd need to remove the two contact patches on either side and remove the stitching along the seems to be able to even get to the panel in a manner for it to be sewn back in place.
You can see the leading edge seam in the pics. Open it up and sew in a new panel. Probably can do it from the inside and a line of stitching along the tear so the only indication will be the stitching. Yes the contact patches need to be lifted but not all the way. This is not a big deal.

See you in Altona next month if you are around.

Matteo V
Frequent Poster
Posts: 326
Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 3:42 pm
Kiting since: 2008
Local Beach: US, Iowa/Nebraska/Kansas/Utah/Oregon Coast
Favorite Beaches: Ft. Stevens, North coast of Oregon
Style: Just like school in summertime
Gear: Delta Kites and LF Kitefish QuadMod
Snowboard (Cambered and Rockered)
Foil kites on the snow
Brand Affiliation: NONE F--- the corporate world

Re: Issue with Naish Kite leading edge, manufacturing defect ?

Postby Matteo V » Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:24 pm

iriejohn wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:47 pm




You can not have read the previous posts in this thread otherwise you would not have made such a silly statement.
I am assuming you are referring to my statement you put in bold "So don't buy Naish anymore if they deny the claim."

Would you continue to purchase Naish kites if you had problems with their customer service?? Or did you have another point? I am not sure I understand why anyone would continue to purchase from any company they had a bad experience with.

But more important is where it would lead us if you did continue to purchase from a company that you had a bad experience(s) with. If you were sold cheap junk that blew up on the beach, and then kept buying that cheap junk, there would be no incentive for kite companies to produce something that lasted a decent amount of time. Hold them responsible SO THEY TAKE RESPONSIBILITY.........ummmmmm, iriejohn......you don't keep voting for the same politicians, do you?

iriejohn
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 785
Joined: Fri Dec 18, 2015 11:04 pm
Kiting since: 0
Local Beach: West Sussex
Gear: this 'n that
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: South coast, UK

Re: Issue with Naish Kite leading edge, manufacturing defect ?

Postby iriejohn » Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:24 pm

Matteo V wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:24 pm
iriejohn wrote:
Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:47 pm

You can not have read the previous posts in this thread otherwise you would not have made such a silly statement.
I am assuming you are referring to my statement you put in bold "So don't buy Naish anymore if they deny the claim."

Would you continue to purchase Naish kites if you had problems with their customer service?? Or did you have another point? I am not sure I understand why anyone would continue to purchase from any company they had a bad experience with.

But more important is where it would lead us if you did continue to purchase from a company that you had a bad experience(s) with. If you were sold cheap junk that blew up on the beach, and then kept buying that cheap junk, there would be no incentive for kite companies to produce something that lasted a decent amount of time. Hold them responsible SO THEY TAKE RESPONSIBILITY.........ummmmmm, iriejohn......you don't keep voting for the same politicians, do you?
This is just from the first page - move your fingers slooowly under the highlighted words. Good luck.
ChickenD!ken wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 10:54 am
How old/new or how many sessions? Was there a max psi like 7 or 8 indicated, that the manufacturer specified? From the pictures it looks like a defect. I’ve never used Naish products but it looks like you should read through your warranty. A burst like that is what I’d expect out on the water from careless use, not at all something that should be possible simply pumping up the bladder.
Mitaka wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 12:14 pm
merkliorer wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:21 am
It seems the leading edge exploded during inflation.
With all my respect I do not thinks that it is possible to tear the leading edge like that during inflation.
And I am curious why do you write "It seems..." If it is during inflation, your friend should know that for sure. :D

More likely the reason is a high speed crash into some hard, sharp object on the ground.
iriejohn wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 12:53 pm

From the picture it looks like there's been a point loaded impact (to the left of centre?) which has weakened the leading edge enough for the bladder to blow out and thereafter tear the leading edge following slightly offset weave (weft?) lines towards each leading edge reinforcement patch.
Dwight wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 1:08 pm
It’s not a manufacturing defect when the rip is in the middle of a panel. You can see it’s not on the seam.

So it is from an undected nick in the material from something on land, that becomes a massive blowout when under pressure.
Mitaka wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 1:27 pm

The high pressure, needed to tear the leading edge like that can not be created with a hand kite pump (when slowly and gradually increasing the pressure up to a relatively low maximum value). It can only occur in the moment of a high speed crash into the ground, when we have sudden and massive pressure increase.
rogue_kiteboarder wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:12 pm
It was cut, I can see it in the photos. Not a warranty.
IMO Making a warranty claim for this damage would be thoroughly dishonest!!!

ChickenD!ken
Frequent Poster
Posts: 206
Joined: Mon Oct 30, 2017 1:43 am
Kiting since: 1916
Local Beach: It’s MY beach.
Favorite Beaches: Empty ones
Style: Sodomite Stance/Forbidden Footjob
Gear: Your mother aka “My Unholy Armada”
Brand Affiliation: Corporate espionage’s Inspector Clouseau

Re: Issue with Naish Kite leading edge, manufacturing defect ?

Postby ChickenD!ken » Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:27 pm

I was just taking the guy at his word but if you’d shown me just the picture I would have told you to take better care of your equipment and drop the warranty fight. A bit telling no more info was given..

jonysan
Medium Poster
Posts: 122
Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:11 pm
Kiting since: 1999
Local Beach: Saunton, Weston S Mare, Bournemouth
Favorite Beaches: La Morne Mauritius, anywhere warm
Style: Wave , hopefully smooth
Gear: Naish Pivots, F-One Mito 5.8,
Brand Affiliation: None

Re: Issue with Naish Kite leading edge, manufacturing defect ?

Postby jonysan » Tue Nov 21, 2017 10:48 pm

The fabric manufacturer produces miles and miles of that material, lots of kites are made, that don't go bang. then some leading edges rip open, have you noticed they tend to split in the area where the kite touches the ground when inflated.
I would have expected rip, splits where the seams are, along needle/sewing puncture lines.

Matteo V
Frequent Poster
Posts: 326
Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 3:42 pm
Kiting since: 2008
Local Beach: US, Iowa/Nebraska/Kansas/Utah/Oregon Coast
Favorite Beaches: Ft. Stevens, North coast of Oregon
Style: Just like school in summertime
Gear: Delta Kites and LF Kitefish QuadMod
Snowboard (Cambered and Rockered)
Foil kites on the snow
Brand Affiliation: NONE F--- the corporate world

Re: Issue with Naish Kite leading edge, manufacturing defect ?

Postby Matteo V » Wed Nov 22, 2017 2:35 am

iriejohn wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:24 pm
Yes, you did a good job of highlighting the posts of those who said it was not a warranty claim. Those posters were not there at the time the kite blew up. They are simply looking at a picture. They could be right, but they could be wrong. Miles of this fabric is produced, and HANDLED before put together into a leading edge for the kite. Very possible for the fabric to be damaged before, or while being assembled into a kite.

The likely explanation is in line with the consensus of most that there was a sharp object that cut the leading edge. Damn near impossible for a company to ever get a rider a replacement kite for this incident. If that did happen, I would buy Naish for supporting one of its riders instead of just doing what every other company does - giving it's riders the shaft.

And I am assuming you agree with my following statement since you did not refute it.....other than quoting it again???
Matteo V wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:24 pm

I am assuming you are referring to my statement you put in bold "So don't buy Naish anymore if they deny the claim."

Would you continue to purchase Naish kites if you had problems with their customer service?? Or did you have another point? I am not sure I understand why anyone would continue to purchase from any company they had a bad experience with.

But more important is where it would lead us if you did continue to purchase from a company that you had a bad experience(s) with. If you were sold cheap junk that blew up on the beach, and then kept buying that cheap junk, there would be no incentive for kite companies to produce something that lasted a decent amount of time. Hold them responsible SO THEY TAKE RESPONSIBILITY.........ummmmmm, iriejohn......you don't keep voting for the same politicians, do you?

iriejohn
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 785
Joined: Fri Dec 18, 2015 11:04 pm
Kiting since: 0
Local Beach: West Sussex
Gear: this 'n that
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: South coast, UK

Re: Issue with Naish Kite leading edge, manufacturing defect ?

Postby iriejohn » Wed Nov 22, 2017 7:38 am

iriejohn" wrote:IMO Making a warranty claim for this damage would be thoroughly dishonest!!!'
The above is from my post, can't be any plainer than that.
Matteo V wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 2:35 am
iriejohn wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:24 pm
Yes, you did a good job of highlighting the posts of those who said it was not a warranty claim. Those posters were not there at the time the kite blew up. They are simply looking at a picture. They could be right, but they could be wrong. Miles of this fabric is produced, and HANDLED before put together into a leading edge for the kite. Very possible for the fabric to be damaged before, or while being assembled into a kite.

The likely explanation is in line with the consensus of most that there was a sharp object that cut the leading edge. Damn near impossible for a company to ever get a rider a replacement kite for this incident. If that did happen, I would buy Naish for supporting one of its riders instead of just doing what every other company does - giving it's riders the shaft.

And I am assuming you agree with my following statement since you did not refute it.....other than quoting it again???
Matteo V wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:24 pm

I am assuming you are referring to my statement you put in bold "So don't buy Naish anymore if they deny the claim."

Would you continue to purchase Naish kites if you had problems with their customer service?? Or did you have another point? I am not sure I understand why anyone would continue to purchase from any company they had a bad experience with.

But more important is where it would lead us if you did continue to purchase from a company that you had a bad experience(s) with. If you were sold cheap junk that blew up on the beach, and then kept buying that cheap junk, there would be no incentive for kite companies to produce something that lasted a decent amount of time. Hold them responsible SO THEY TAKE RESPONSIBILITY.........ummmmmm, iriejohn......you don't keep voting for the same politicians, do you?


Return to “Kitesurfing”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], ChickenD!ken and 18 guests

cron