Contact   Imprint   Advertising   Guidelines

Finally! X-Bow bar pressure is solved.

Forum for kitesurfers
User avatar
DrLightWind
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 1814
Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2002 1:00 am
Local Beach: Matheson Hammock Park Miami
Favorite Beaches: Crandon Beach, Hobbie Beach, Keys, St. Lucia, St. Marteen,
Style: Old School
Gear: Flysurfer15m and 21m Speed3 DLX
RealWind Mutant 148 X 40 and Directional 190 X 48, F-One TT 128 X35, Dereck Semi Directional 143 X 38 and 177 X 46.
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Miami @ 6" Flat Butter!
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Finally! X-Bow bar pressure is solved.

Postby DrLightWind » Tue Sep 20, 2005 6:59 am

I came up with this idea of "Smart Grip" concept over a month ago,
to eliminate the bar pressure of the X-Bow.
I offer it for everybody because I know it works and I tested with my friends.
I encourage to make your own.
All you need is a 1/8 to 5/16 (3-8mm) Rope Clutch from West Marine and
a Bicycle Stem to modify for a 1 inch bar until the mounting is available for any stock bar like the oval ones (X-Bows)
I modified a Windwing CC-Bar but any other bar can be used what is round for the above.
If a manufacturer wants to massproduce it I would expect them to contact me before they do it!
I have an establised priority date with alternative embodiments !

Features and Benefits:
1.- The unique feature of this Smart Grip activated by twisting the bar Clock Wise & Counter Clock Wise can be triggered on & off correspondingly.
2.- Provides multiple position locking while in precise control for powered riding.
3.- This Smart Grip has eliminated the feeling of bar pressure associated with sheeting in.
4.- Can be added on to any bar while maintains the original safety characteristics of the kite.
Image
12m X-Bow wit Smart Grip
Image
Illustration how it works by twisting the bar as a pivot point Clockwise & Counterclockwise
Image
Timah No Hand!
Image
Timah 1 hand
Image
Timah landing with the bar.
Image
Full bar view with Smart Grip
Image
Bar with normaly open stock mode
Image
Bar with locked position.
Image
Rope clutch mounted on bar 3-8mm (1/8 to 5/16)
Image
My 2nd Version for 1 hand riding. Almost finished, needs a boom grip.
Cheers

DrLightWind

User avatar
www.kite-surf.com
Frequent Poster
Posts: 346
Joined: Sun May 05, 2002 1:00 am
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0
Contact:

Postby www.kite-surf.com » Tue Sep 20, 2005 7:15 am

On picture 1: is that your house in the background??? :o

gdorfman
Medium Poster
Posts: 122
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 8:44 am
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Postby gdorfman » Tue Sep 20, 2005 7:38 am

Interesting. Thanks for posting. If I understand correctly you absolutely can’t depower unless you twist. I don’t know how easy that is in a hairy situation, but doesn’t seem ideal for really gusty conditions. Really depends on where you kite. This seems kind of like using a fixed harness, but with the ability to lock at any position.

Another approach similar to this I had thought about is to use one of the cam cleats from sailing—the two spring loaded jaws. I think it might be possible to get it to work either on a normal bar or a windwing style bar. What would be ideal is to have the cleat not touch the line on it’s normal sheeting path (not in the plane or whatever), but if you pushed down or up, it might lock on. The advantage would be that disengaging would be very easy, b/c it doesn’t necessarily want to be there. Potentially a cheaper/lighter solution but I haven’t figured it all out. I do worry about all these devices in the sand…. Also, can you twist hard enough one handed to turn on/off? The main benefit to bar locking/friction for me is one handed riding toeside.

I personally really like the concept of the windwing cc bar b/c there is no engage/disengage. It is all automatic. However, the issue with the friction approach is that it simply won’t work well on a kite with high bar pressure. If you have that, you need a ton of friction to hold the bar, but then it makes sheeting in and out really hard, and is generally not going to work well. However, if you have light pressure to begin with, you can add very little friction and get a good system. If there was a way to disengage or lower the friction on the fly—it would be the ideal solution

On my cc bar one day I didn’t have enough friction, so I twisted the lower swivel to wrap the line (this is generally a bad thing that people complain about)—but it gave me way more friction, and I could customize it on the water (adding or removing twists). Only problem is that it would come undone a lot, so it was a temporary thing, with me continually twisting it up. And the big problem is that the line wears on itself so much that it won’t last long enough. I destroyed my rope cover in 3-4 hrs! The next day I grabbed a big boom vang block from a laser sailboat with double pulleys, and added this to the existing pulleys of the WW bar, so the bar made a ton of turns. It was the ugliest thing ever, but worked perfectly for one nuclear day. I waited for it to seize up in every 40+kt gust, but it never did…

My current solution is to use a really thick line that barely fit through the windwing guide. It eased up with use and is pretty good now. Of course, this doesn’t have a disengage setting.

I’m hoping bars get a lot better. With high depower kites I think that the bar settings may end up being one of the main ways to customize the feel for the person and conditions. It’s also cool b/c its one of the only parts of kiting tech. that a simply guy in the shed can innovate on in 1 day. If I were a company with a bow kite, I’d consider having a contest for who could design the best bar system. And yes, simplicity is one of the criteria.

high123
Frequent Poster
Posts: 235
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 3:28 am
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Northern California
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Postby high123 » Tue Sep 20, 2005 8:04 am

I've used the PX Cam Cleat from http://www.spinlock.co.uk on a fast dinghy sailboat and they are awesome: A million times better than the old style cam cleats with the two spring loaded jaws. Even under heavy load it's very easy to release the rope. I don't see any problems using this cleat on a kite bar.

gdorfman
Medium Poster
Posts: 122
Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2004 8:44 am
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Postby gdorfman » Tue Sep 20, 2005 8:10 am


mc
Rare Poster
Posts: 50
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2005 8:59 am
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: >???
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

funny

Postby mc » Tue Sep 20, 2005 9:00 am

how funny is that, they bring out the best kite ever and joe and his mate have to adapt the bar, you would have thought the billion $ company that introduced the kite and bar would have thought of this prior to its massive hype realease, just shows you, stick with tried and tested brands, don't be the ginny pigs.

User avatar
ravenboardz
Medium Poster
Posts: 107
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2005 7:05 pm
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Muc
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Postby ravenboardz » Tue Sep 20, 2005 9:23 am

Brilliant....marvelous....I like it :lol: :lol: :lol: :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
I´m of to my local sailingshop
This realy meets the taste of german engeniering :roll:

User avatar
Wawando
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2440
Joined: Mon Sep 08, 2003 9:21 pm
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Portugal - Guincho; Rebel2012 5m, 9m & 2011 7m; Amundson 5'9&6'
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Postby Wawando » Tue Sep 20, 2005 10:04 am

Hi,

Why not use a microhook instead of this large and heavy gizmo?

I have been using tha Nova 9m and the best thing is the softness of ride that comes from having the bar free. A lock would only be used for very low end and to rest the arms, right?

Thanks.

User avatar
KiteKarl
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 542
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 4:25 am
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Stockton, California
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: funny

Postby KiteKarl » Tue Sep 20, 2005 10:47 am

mc wrote:how funny is that, they bring out the best kite ever and joe and his mate have to adapt the bar, you would have thought the billion $ company that introduced the kite and bar would have thought of this prior to its massive hype realease, just shows you, stick with tried and tested brands, don't be the ginny pigs.
I've got issues with my bow but it's a good design with room for improvement. It's called evolution. Mankind did't go from single celled amoeba to Einstein. This forum is a testament to kiters ingenuity. But then it's always easier to watch and bitch than create something. Thanks for your contribution Da Vinci... :roll:

User avatar
ravenboardz
Medium Poster
Posts: 107
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2005 7:05 pm
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Muc
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Postby ravenboardz » Tue Sep 20, 2005 10:48 am

@wawando:
But you can stop at any power- or depowerposition to relax...and its much easier than usíng the adjuster...I ride the Rap05 and the force on the bar when powering is quite havey...when releasing the bar, power is turned of completely...so you can´t unspin the lines...!!!
This way you can
I´ll change it to something more elegent and light for onehandgripp as well. The Cicle thingy ist too bulky...
I´ll come up with something.
But the idea and the cleat are neat :thumb:


Return to “Kitesurfing”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], Majestic-12 [Bot] and 122 guests