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Looping Kite - Safety Discussion

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Toby
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Looping Kite - Safety Discussion

Postby Toby » Tue May 26, 2009 12:22 pm

see a looping kite in action...it can happen with every system!

We just need to be trained to act accordingly, that is key to survive!

Here some more info:

Two kiters got tangled, I don't know exactly how. And I don't know what happened exactly, but looks like the other kiter let go of his kite, he is swimming behind his kite.
I am the one riding with the green/white Vegas, I was watching the scene, to see if I can do anything, but there was so far nothing to do for me, since I saw the rider still being conscious, luckily.

The kite keeps looping, and I see the rider going under water...and I am getting scared and thinking what to do...when suddenly the harness flies away, and he gets on the surface again.
He opened his harness (waist harness) so the kite could fly away...there was nothing else he could do, since he tried to release his leash release, and it failed.

All worked out, he was fine, I dragged him back to the beach, and he run after his kite, which was still looping a long way downwind.

Pay attention at the end, that the ones wanting to secure the kites, first all keep concentrating on the gray kite (the not looping one) and taking the time to get to the looping one.
If you are in a position like this, make sure to get first to the looping kite to secure it asap.

No one got hurt, the rider just acted wise. Well done. But I always wonder, if this happens to me, what I could do? I ride a seat harness...

Thx to Jeremie Tronet for the footage who filmed it by coincidence and kept filming for others to see what can happen.

[kiteforumtv]http://www.kiteforum.tv/video/Looping_Kite.html[/kiteforumtv]

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Re: Looping Kite - Safety Discussion

Postby voodoospirit » Tue May 26, 2009 1:39 pm

i have a seat harness, i doubt my kites will be able to so the same things... but the only thing to be done if u have a seat harness, is to use the knife. not many other choices possible.

as a rescue rider, i d jump on the guy and use my knife on its suicide leash.

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Re: Looping Kite - Safety Discussion

Postby RickI » Tue May 26, 2009 2:39 pm

Glad things worked out and you were able to help Toby. What would you guess the wind speed was and the size of the SS kite? The guy wasn't being dragged that violently, very fortunately, still I bet it felt real violent. He was dragged for about 80 seconds, plenty long enough. The SS kiter had dropped his bar, correct? No wonder it didn't Emergency Depower, looks like the lines from one side of the kite to the other were made uneven by about 3 m. Sometimes that line is caught on the kiter making things harder to resolve. Short of cutting out, I am not sure what else might be done. We talked about this at some length following the loop fatalities in Texas and Egypt. What the kiter might do, kiters chasing the guy and support boats.

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Re: Looping Kite - Safety Discussion

Postby Toby » Tue May 26, 2009 2:53 pm

There was nothing I could do. I am still thinking what I would have done when he didn't release his harness.

Well, the SS kiter released his QR, but the bar got stuck (or does not slide further?).
I asked him, why he didn't use the leash QR...he said he couldn't...it got stuck.

We should discuss, what could be done.

voodoospirit: not sure if you could jump on him...remember, you also have a kite up in the air...

Jumping into the kite?

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Re: Looping Kite - Safety Discussion

Postby ronnie » Tue May 26, 2009 3:05 pm

Maybe kite to in front of but near the bar and release your kite. Swim to intercept the bar and grab an oshit handle? It may have looped too often for that to work.

The lesson from this is, have a leash you can release.
Last edited by ronnie on Tue May 26, 2009 3:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Looping Kite - Safety Discussion

Postby RickI » Tue May 26, 2009 3:09 pm

Bringing the guy in once he got free was about all you could do other than talking about prevention and response here for the next time. Again, what would you guess the wind speed and SS kite size were? There aren't many of these looping incidents on video.

Do you know what happened immediately after the tangle? Did the guys talk or did the one kiter just cast off his kite? Usually it is best if both kiters can coordinate what they are going to do before doing it, if conditions permit. If one kiter just sets his kite free without allowing the other kiter time to work things out can send two kites looping off at light speed with one out of control and endangered kiter attached. This is was what happened to poor Silke. Once your kite lines are rendered uneven by a tangle unless you can ditch by opening your leash QR or cut away the lot, the power will stay until you can make the lines equal again (unlikely while being dragged), something breaks or ? Did the guy check out his leash QR afterward, did it work at that time, what went wrong with it do you think?

In the case of the fatal looping in Texas the kiter was dragged for about a mile. The kite was eventually disabled by someone jumping into it from a waverunner. He suffered some cuts but he managed to stop the kite. Stopping a fast looping kite, I believe they loop faster and pull even harder than shown here at times can be real tricky and dangerous, for the kiter and folks chasing trying to help.

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Re: Looping Kite - Safety Discussion

Postby Toby » Tue May 26, 2009 3:20 pm

The lesson from this is, have a leash you can release.
are you sure your leash will work in any circumstances?

Nothing works 100%...

Not sure about the windspeed. I was on a 16. That day I had nice power, but it dropped as I remember correctly. I think around 18 knots.
And not sure about his kite size. Looks like an 11, but could also be a 9. Something between 9-12.

I don't know if they talked, but I guess so, or at least I hope so.

Yes, that was the Silke Gorldt situation, but she had two powered kites pulling her...and no space...

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Re: Looping Kite - Safety Discussion

Postby Antoine » Tue May 26, 2009 3:55 pm

Thanks for posting the video, I wish everyone could see it, to see how quickly shit can happen in kitesurfing.

Always be ready to release your kite and try to kite where you have room to release your kite without putting people downwind in danger.

This is a accident avoided by quick thinking on the part of the kiter and classic example of gear failure.

Be safe

Antoine

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Re: Looping Kite - Safety Discussion

Postby voodoospirit » Tue May 26, 2009 4:20 pm

yeah toby, but the differences with many peeps, is that i ride with PL kites, so i don t have to worry about it when i get on my suicide leash and i m busy to do something else, those kites r very good "rescue" kites.
already jumped on a guy who was dragged by his kite ( a rear line looped under his bar after a lull), i jumped on him to add my (little) weight , (the wind was around 16/20knots since i was good in my synergy 12), it was enough to slow him down so he could grab his QR (which worked), i had my harness knife in my hand already anyway....

the harder part was to catch him as i m an intermediate rider on the water, his kite was pulling not regulary but which brief huge pulls (when his kites was in the power window, was a C-kite)

the kite got rescued by another kiter , way more experienced than me.
Last edited by voodoospirit on Tue May 26, 2009 4:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Looping Kite - Safety Discussion

Postby toyletbowl » Tue May 26, 2009 4:23 pm

toby,

as i see it, since you had a kite in the air and 8 already lines floating around the rider in trouble, there were only a couple of things you could have done in this situation. another rider who is not 100% sure what do to can add more problems than solutions.

priority is the rider.

#1 - get close and ask if he/she is OK. If so...just stay close, but out of the way so you don't add a 3rd kite to the mix. hopefully they will sort it out.

#2 - if the rider is in danger of their lives, you may have had to ditch your kite and get in to help save the person from drowning if it came to that. cut lines...grab the out of control kite? anything to help.

tough situation...glad to see you help the guy out.

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