Kiting Through The Lineup

[RickI]

Not talking about a tight launch, small break area or anything like that. Something more like much of the coast of Florida, hundreds of yards, perhaps miles of similar conditions up and down the coast. Areas with ready choices in other words. If you can travel to a clearer wave spot by driving a bit further, why not do it?

If you have any choice at all, including tacking, it is best not to ride through the lineup. Some guys routinely do this, even jumping up wind and through the surfers. Real bad idea. If you're pushing it and sometimes even if you aren't you may well lose control particularly in waves. It is easy to downloop kites when this happens. Most people catch a board edge in the waves at sometime or other.

So what?

If your kite and lines go through surfers, someone could get hurt. Your kite can just be on the water, get caught by a breaking wave and be ripped through surfers downwind. Someone gets wrapped by a line, caught by the kite or even have line under several hundred pounds of wave force pulled into them, possible bad outcome. Someone might get cut, lose an ear, be pulled under, have lines go around their neck, etc., stranger things have happened, several times.

Try riding downwind of them. Or if you have to pass, make sure you're well upwind and not about to lose control. If you have any choice at all, including going someplace else, don't ride through them routinely. We don't plan bad accidents, using your head could help avoid one though. Very experienced guys are one thing but I see newer kiters with minimal control doing this fairly often. Regardless of experience, if you cause someone to be hurt, your time riding will count for little. None of us want bans, I think, nor causing someone injury, legal challenges, damage awards against us, etc..

Awareness and common sense should take care of things, as usual.

[tautologies]

completely agree. We have a standing un-official agreement about not going in breaks where there are surfers. They cannot move and aren't as agile as we are. For us it is a way to keep beaches open, and minimize the potential for conflict.

It is not too long ago a kiter got his LE blown by a rock from a fellow water user after not staying out for the break (kiter was out in the water swimming for his board, and his kite on the shore).

[abel]

.........
Awareness and common sense should take care of things, as usual.

Hey Rick,

How can nubees (not reading this or similar forums) buy some awareness and common sense?

As a matter of fact, this is a generic question that's bugging me not only in the Kitesurfing topic.

[RickI]

Good question, we're working on awareness in lots of posts including this one. I don't think common sense can necessarily be taught but I do believe it can be learned to a degree. Most people don't like pain, e.g. smashed leading edges or body parts for that matter, legal hassles, penalties or hefty judgments against. Hopefully more than a few are motivated by wanting to avoid messing other people up through dumb errors too. Think about all those cute teen surfer girls that are flocking to surfing, don't want to harm one of them, right?

So, there's ready motivation.

One approach is to stop, and ask yourself, what if? Go through some scenarios in your mind, there aren't that many related to this topic. Now, ask yourself, how to avoid "what if" talk to your saner kite buds too. Presto, you have the makings of good common sense in motion.

This post is for newbies to be sure who may never have thought about it. It is also for more experienced guys who may think it might not happen to them. If you haven't made an error or wiped out in the last five years you may have a point. If not, get in line, there are lots of us this applies to.

For those folks that don't follow forums, that falls on the leaders at the beaches out there. You've got an interest in this, i.e. access and avoiding hassles with surfers, etc.. Why not take it to the beaches?

[RichardM]

Not talking about a tight launch, small break area or anything like that. Something more like much of the coast of Florida, hundreds of yards, perhaps miles of similar conditions up and down the coast. Areas with ready choices in other words. If you can travel to a clearer wave spot by driving a bit further, why not do it?

If you have any choice at all, including tacking, it is best not to ride through the lineup. Some guys routinely do this, even jumping up wind and through the surfers. Real bad idea. If you're pushing it and sometimes even if you aren't you may well lose control particularly in waves. It is easy to downloop kites when this happens. Most people catch a board edge in the waves at sometime or other.

So what?

If your kite and lines go through surfers, someone could get hurt. Your kite can just be on the water, get caught by a breaking wave and be ripped through surfers downwind. Someone gets wrapped by a line, caught by the kite or even have line under several hundred pounds of wave force pulled into them, possible bad outcome. Someone might get cut, lose an ear, be pulled under, have lines go around their neck, etc., stranger things have happened, several times.

Try riding downwind of them. Or if you have to pass, make sure you're well upwind and not about to lose control. If you have any choice at all, including going someplace else, don't ride through them routinely. We don't plan bad accidents, using your head could help avoid one though. Very experienced guys are one thing but I see newer kiters with minimal control doing this fairly often. Regardless of experience, if you cause someone to be hurt, your time riding will count for little. None of us want bans, I think, nor causing someone injury, legal challenges, damage awards against us, etc..

Awareness and common sense should take care of things, as usual.

Sorry. But I don't think that the MAIN problem with going through the lineup is the possibility of an actual accident.

The MAIN problem is that surfers and other water users undoubtedly resent having to constantly WORRY about collisions with kiters and/or having kiters steal their waves. It is their PERCEPTION of danger which is important and it's likely that many perceive danger when they see a kiter approaching, REGARDLESS of whether the kiter thinks there is any actual danger.

It may only take a FEW complaints from these PRIMARY recreational resource users to convince authorities that it is better to ELIMINATE the comparatively few SECONDARY recreational resource users (kiters). In short, if surfers/swimmers complain, kiters are likely to be BANNED.

Richard M.
Malibu Kitesurfing - since 2002
(310) - 430 - KITE (5483)
http://www.MalibuKitesurfing.NET
kfRichard@MalibuKitesurfing.NET

[RickI]

True, many of the access battles fought over the years have dealt with perception perhaps more than reality.

There's a problem with our perception though. Many kiters don't see any problem with running through surfers like a skier racing through gates down a mountain. The never think about what might happen or conclude if they bother too, it will never happen to them. Nor do they consider what has already happened in past incidents. How do you describe something potentially harmful, without describing it?

Surfers for the most part, "can" be laid back people with notable exceptions on record. They may not like kiters running through the lineup but they may largely deal with it. Some may not ignore it and will take steps on their own but they seem to be in the minority for now.

Why don't we own up to the obvious and avoid presenting the risk in the first place? Lets use all that mobility to grab some great rides and not put others, and our access, at risk.

Stay out of the lineup, grab some rides away from the surfers if at all possible. If you have to pass, do it at a reasonable distance, ideally well away downwind. If a surfer is catching a wave or already on one, stay well away from him. If your kite goes into the water with surfers downwind of you there well could be problems.

[BWD]

Tip: learn to surf without a kite before you take kites in surf.
Learn the ground rules, make some friends. duh.
Enjoy surfing while you are at it.
Makes you a better rider all around
Kinda like Carl said

only you don't have to be enemies....

[MonkeyAir]

Greenskeeper Spangler is a wealth of wisdom.
"I'd say play, the hard stuff is not going to come for a while." unfortunately can't be used as the hard stuff is here. In the local area, if you actually do surf and kitesurf in waves, there are always going to be some surfers. It comes down to giving them as much space as possible, slowing whenever forced to go by them and of course to stay down wind or far upwind if possible. Don't get greedy at a point break and snag every good outside set wave because you can. No boosting over surfers "even if they ask you to" Happens all the time by the way however the lifeguard or ranger on the beach does not know that is a bud of yours and his kids out there surfing, etc.
Many of our best spots for wavesailing which were also phenom A list surf spots have been shut down to kitsurfing do to a few knuckleheads not observing the above basic suggestions. Learn to surf is key here. If you have spent your life surfing like many of us have, you won't tear some grom surfers head off for cursing at you for even being in the water anywhere near them though they are catching no waves. It comes down to the fact that his gal or friends are on the beach and they are watching you ripping waves, jumping etc. as it is more fun to watch than him sitting there in blown out crap surf, with another forty guys like bumps on a log, getting one wave every 15 minutes. The human ego makes us do really stupid things.

.. Love surfing but the reality of a constantly growing surf population and limited spots to surf, combined with inconsistent local surf is not going to make the natives less restless. We still have a lot of kitesurfers who don't come from a surf background who think they should have equal rights to all waves as surfers.. It's the same guys who SUP into a crowded point break, oblivious to the the danger their board is to others and the time it takes for anyone in the pack to get a single wave. Narcism is an ugly condition. This leads to them badmouthing lifeguards calling them out for improper behavior in the water and more pressure for the guards to shut it down. There are of course those who just don't wave sail and have no clue. Rules for wavesailors should be shaped by wavesailors or at least have the interest of keeping wave spots open to kitesurfing in mind as well as the publics safety.

It got to be such a bummer seeing people showing bad attitude, pushing, snarling and fighting over waves in the lineup with no kites present, while in the lifeguard tower and surfing, that we came up with Happyinsurf.com to remind people about how nice it is to have a grump free wave zone. That lead to Happyinsnow for the slopes, as the same sort of crazy mentality can show itself there as well. Not like surfers/kiters/SUP's' paddlers etc are working in a factory for a few cents and hour. We are lucky to be out on the ocean regardless of how we get there so lets all smile and cooperate. NO GRUMPS
MonkeyAir.com
Malibu's original kitesurfing lesson and equipment source.

[Nico]

Don't do it !
Simple
Stay clear of surfers/bathers/....
Help other users, rescue people in need, ...... .
you will gain respect and secure access.
Nico

[RickI]

Works for me Nico. Had good wind over the weekend down here. How did it go, kiters stay out of the lineup? Hope so.

I worked the Caddy Shack course, Rolling Hills, when I was 16. Out front as a car hop. That was a couple of years before the movie. Wish I had kept my eye out for the gophers, clever buggers. As I recall there was nothing in real life that much resembled the movie there, too bad!