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Question about safety release/ flagging a Cabrinha Switchbla

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kitezilla
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Re: Question about safety release/ flagging a Cabrinha Switc

Postby kitezilla » Tue May 04, 2010 3:24 pm

Luke Palin wrote:Earlier today I stupidly failed to come to shore as a weather front approached and consequently found myself hugely overpowered on a 12m Switchblade in 35-40 knot gusts. After realising that I wouldn’t be able to ‘ride it out’ I attached my leach to flagging ring (located on the left rear leader line). I then activated the release and the kite flagged on rear line and bar shot off towards kite. I then began pulling rear line hand over hand to get to bar/kite but as the wind was so strong the force of the flagged kite was too much for my hands to hold. I eventually activated the release on the leach thereby completely releasing the kite (thankfully I was on an empty beach and the kite blew away into sand dunes).

So, my question is; what is the safe way to retrieve the kite once it has been flagged? Is it normal for the bar to shoot off towards the kite? Someone mentioned that a ‘stopper ball’ would rectify this? If I had been able to get to the bar easily I would have been able to wind the rear leader line in on this, instead of using my hands.

Cheers,

Luke.

Each kite is different in its ability to be "flagged" onto one line. Some manufacturers recommend a rear line safety and some recommend a front line safety and some kites come with a fifth line, to be used as a safety. I was surprised to hear that you flagged the Switchblade onto a rear line. Is that the recommendation in the manual for that year Switchblade?

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Re: Question about safety release/ flagging a Cabrinha Switc

Postby Luke Palin » Tue May 04, 2010 5:03 pm

Yeah, I'd say that the rear line flag is my only real complaint about the SB3. It's pretty annoying having to flag on the rear line as it makes solo landings trickier than they need to be. I guess it's the build quality of the recent switchblades that is the main plus point for me. When I eventually fully released the kite yesterday as a last resort emergency it blew 300m across sand dunes, 2 wire fences and a marsh. It didn't sustain a single rip/ tear/ pinhole/ puncture. Perhaps a mixture of luck AND first class build materials. I've seen Best kites shredded to pieces in situations far far less than this (sorry to pick on Best!)

Cheers for all the advice people. I may buy a stopper ball to keep the bar from fully travelling to the kite once flagged. I'll look out for one.

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Re: Question about safety release/ flagging a Cabrinha Switc

Postby magnus_norway » Tue May 04, 2010 5:21 pm

Is flagging off the back line the only option on your current setup? Would think flagging off the front line might give less residual pull in the kite? You could try attaching one of the front lines to a ring, after it goes through its current attachment point (prob a ring also). This way you can create a leash attachment point on the front line and you can flag the kite off of this.

The result would be similar to the solution seen here:
http://www.seabreeze.com.au/gallery/gal ... 562502.jpg

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Re: Question about safety release/ flagging a Cabrinha Switc

Postby Luke Palin » Tue May 04, 2010 5:33 pm

There are mods that can be done, you're right. The bar setup with the front line flagging ring in the attachment is far better (this featured on the crossbow 1, 2 and 3 and the swithcblade 1- but not the 2 or 3!).

In the past others have had issues with this too...

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2335380

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Re: Question about safety release/ flagging a Cabrinha Switc

Postby IWB2 » Tue May 04, 2010 5:45 pm

Luke Palin,

Some Cabrinha 2008 and earlier kites came with front line flagging systems. If I was in your shoes, I would look at getting the conversion part from Cabrinha which was sold on the 2008 Convert or Revolver which allows for a front lines flagging system. This can be easily installed on the SB3 bar. Now all 2009 and 2010 Cabrinha kites come with IDS system which flags the kites out so that the pull (very little) is from the center of the leading edge which takes the flagging safety system to another level.

Remember though, regardless of your safety system, always come in early if you see a nasty squall/storm approaching. Good judgement goes a long way.!

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Re: Question about safety release/ flagging a Cabrinha Switc

Postby crash&burn » Wed May 05, 2010 1:39 pm

use the landing method i described and you will never have problems again,

no, need to modify or look for a manufactured solution just use your head

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Re: Question about safety release/ flagging a Cabrinha Switc

Postby kitezilla » Wed May 05, 2010 2:22 pm

IWB2 wrote:
IDS system which flags the kites out so that the pull (very little) is from the center of the leading edge which takes the flagging safety system to another level.

Remember though, regardless of your safety system, always come in early if you see a nasty squall/storm approaching. Good judgement goes a long way.!
I think that the "jury is still out" on the determination as to what level this new type of safety system takes us...whether it is a higher level or lower level of safety. At this point I would prefer to see this "two line substitute for a fifth line" system referred to as an extreme "depowering" of the kite rather than as to a "flagging" of the kite.

For the beginners reading this thread, you should be advised that the new equipment "advances" that we are seeing, are driven mainly by the demand for more convenience and higher performance...but not necessarily by a greater demand for "safety" in desperate situations where things go from bad to worse.


The last statement by IBW2 is very good advice.

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Re: Question about safety release/ flagging a Cabrinha Switc

Postby ronnie » Wed May 05, 2010 3:47 pm

kitezilla wrote:
IWB2 wrote:
IDS system which flags the kites out so that the pull (very little) is from the center of the leading edge which takes the flagging safety system to another level.

Remember though, regardless of your safety system, always come in early if you see a nasty squall/storm approaching. Good judgement goes a long way.!
I think that the "jury is still out" on the determination as to what level this new type of safety system takes us...whether it is a higher level or lower level of safety. At this point I would prefer to see this "two line substitute for a fifth line" system referred to as an extreme "depowering" of the kite rather than as to a "flagging" of the kite.

For the beginners reading this thread, you should be advised that the new equipment "advances" that we are seeing, are driven mainly by the demand for more convenience and higher performance...but not necessarily by a greater demand for "safety" in desperate situations where things go from bad to worse.


The last statement by IBW2 is very good advice.
Hi Kitezilla,
I bought the 2 IDS Xbows I have based on the safety more than anything, and I think the main reason it was developed was for the safety, so I think it is fair to quote it as another level of safety. You do have to do pre-flight checks, but that applies to almost any kite. The kite does not spin when put on IDS, it does deliver on the very high depower, and it's much safer to wind the lines on the bar during a packdown on the water. From a safety point of view, I'm a big fan of IDS type depower systems.

The bridle does seem to have to be longer, and that is one issue with it, because if the kite gets tumbled, the bridle can snag.

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Re: Question about safety release/ flagging a Cabrinha Switc

Postby magnus_norway » Wed May 05, 2010 4:03 pm

I agree with kitezilla. Whenever you are attached to the kite by more than one connection point, where the points are "far" away from each other, as the case is with IDS, I think it is wrong to call this "flagging". I believe there exist situations where a tumbling kite can power up as long as there are at least two separated attachment points.


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