Cost Breakdown of Kite Package - Online Only vs Shop

[KitePaddleSurf]

First, I am going to state that I own a shop and sell the following package, but I wanted to get some numbers out for people to see and compare.

Why? I perceive there is a company out there that doesn't really care if there are local shops that can support their kiteboarding communities with lessons, local knowledge, beach access, and a central place for people to get to know each other. Un-named company has no plans of supporting magazines, or sites like this one with advertising, and as far as I know, doesn't intend to do anything but sell kites to customers direct.

It has been rumoured that a 10m with bar and lines costs around $950 delivered from this company.

This is a great price for a kite, and I can see that this would be attractive, especially to someone getting into the sport.

The LF Envy Package which as been available for 2 years now costs $1649 for a 9m complete with a board, harness, and a lesson. We have offered this for the past 2 years. How does that break out? http://www.kitepaddlesurf.com/Liquid-Fo ... ackage.htm

Where I can, I am using links to other sites besides mine to show market pricing to be as impartial as possible.

Our lessons cost $280 which is lower than average for jetski assisted certified and insured school. (http://www.kitepaddlesurf.com/Bellingha ... egoryId=-1)

A LF beginner board complete retails at $329 complete. (http://emeraldcoastkiteboarding.com/201 ... re=default)

A LF Harness cost $89 (http://emeraldcoastkiteboarding.com/200 ... re=default)

There is no shipping charge because the student actually comes into the shop and meets people, instructors, employees, etc.

So $1649 - 280(lesson) - $329(board) - Harness ($89) = $951 remaining for the kite with bar and lines.

When I did the math it baffled me that the price came out to be within a $1.

Is it worth a dollar for people to have a place to call their shop? A place to hang out, get advice, tips.... etc?

For a company to make claims they are going to change the industry.... by totally bypassing the physical shops..... wouldn't you think they would be more interested in offering lessons, supporting sites like KiteForum, and working on more than just selling kites cheap?

Also... here is a video of last year's 6m Envy in action in case people want to say that the Envy is "just a beginner kite"... It is a hugely versitile kite.... like most kites out on the market these days.

Ultimately, it comes down to what the consumer chooses. I hope the consumer chooses to support their shops that do more than just collect money in exchange for product without supporting the kiteboarding community.


Andy

[Mr_Weetabix]

Ultimately, it comes down to what the consumer chooses. I hope the consumer chooses to support their shops that do more than just collect money in exchange for product without supporting the kiteboarding community.

It's not just the consumer - the brands selling through shops need to come to the party, too. The deal you've used as an example looks great, but I suspect that most of us would be hard-pressed to find something similar in our local shops (and not involving a Liquid Force product).

The obvious way for manufacturers to help local shops is to cut wholesale prices - but any suggestion along these lines will probably draw a response that Cabrinha/Best/North/etc's margins are already low, and any cuts in prices would lead to cuts in R&D or quality.

The industry needs to get creative - better product support (particularly availability of spare parts) through shops, trade-in deals through shops and rewards for product loyalty will all work better if they are a joint effort between the store and the brand.

[StevethePirate]

Kitepaddlesurf

I live within 30mins from my closest store which in my opinion is not far, however I would never shop there and neither would any kiter’s I regularly kite with. The store is manned by the owner’s son who has no interest in customer service or the products he is selling. The store does not offer trade-ins and their stock is severely over priced. Lucky they sell wake gear or I am sure they would be closed by now. The store does not have qualified instructors and only offers a list of local instructors. (Most of which I would not recommend to my worst enemy).

So where do we get our kite gear? As my closest store is obviously useless.
Luckily we have a second store and although it is an hour away the staff are very helpful and they offer lessons out of there store. They don’t offer a free lesson with the purchase of gear like yourself and charge $300.00 for a lesson. They only stock 3 brands of kites: Best, Cabrinha and Slingshot. With the wind conditions around my area most people require at least a 12 metre kite, so you are looking at least $2000.00 for a new kite from one of these brands in this particular shop. The shop does offer trade-ins though making it easier on the wallet to upgrade to a new kite and for a beginner to pick up a cheaper second hand kite.

But what happens when a beginner has progressed passed the second hand kite he has trashed to the point where it is no longer worth trading in, but needs a new kite or two to help him progress or to add another size to his quiver.

Your opinion is that he should pay $2000.00 for a new kite because that way he is supporting the local shop, but the question is what is the local shop offering him? He no longer needs lessons (which he has paid for), he already has a board and harness. So what exactly does he get back from the expensive purchase? The answers is a lighter wallet and nothing else.

Now if we want a kite that isn’t a Cabrinha, Slingshot or Best we would need to purchase it off of the internet any way, so we would look around for the best value and if a company is offering a kite for half the price we would be silly as a customer not to look seriously especially in the current economic climate.

I can understand that as a Shop owner you are worried about protecting your assets but you are going about it the wrong way attacking a kite company who is trying to offer the consumer a better price. Maybe you should be attacking the other companies for making too much of a profit and making their kites to expensive to sell.

This could be a good thing for everyone as the other manufacturers may look at their own pricing structures and decide that to compete they will need to lower their prices which would make your job easier, as less people would be scared off by the cost of getting into the sport.

I just hope your negativity hasn’t hurt your own business, as you may have just alienated some of your own customers with your post.

[KitePaddleSurf]

Steve,

It sounds like you are mad at me, and I can't see why you would be.

I just re read my post and can't see where I have alienated anyone. I am just saying that there are opportunities to get solid product at less than a $2000 price tag from your local shop and gave one example.

I am sorry that you have had a bad experience at your most local shop. I think there is a lot of value offered by a network of shops around the country rather than having a centralized system in which kites become commodities, and the beach gets flooded by people who have no clue what is going on and kill themselves.

If/as kite become more inexpensive, to me it makes even more sense to have local establishments willing to help direct the masses... The problem is... if the local establishments are defacto written off as non-valuable...are not supported, just because people perceive that there are no options at their shops.... I am saying here are options...

Kitepaddlesurf

I l
I can understand that as a Shop owner you are worried about protecting your assets but you are going about it the wrong way attacking a kite company who is trying to offer the consumer a better price. Maybe you should be attacking the other companies for making too much of a profit and making their kites to expensive to sell.

This could be a good thing for everyone as the other manufacturers may look at their own pricing structures and decide to that compete they will need to lower their prices which would make your job easier, as less people would be scared off by the cost of getting into the sport.

I just hope your negativity hasn’t hurt your own business, as you may have just alienated some of your own customers with your post.

[StevethePirate]

Sorry if it came across as if I was mad at you, I was just trying to offer the perspective of a consumer and give a reason why for me it is a far better option to be able to by a kite at a cheaper price online.

And I definitely wouldn't suggest that shops and instructors are not needed, just that for some people their local shops are not giving them anything back in return and a better value kite is a better option for them, not everyone.

[Kamikuza]

Local establishments must be massively over-inflating their price if kites only cost $951 dollars! Last I looked online for my kites, I often saw them listed at $1,600 or more!

I'm sure shops don't mind you hanging out and getting tips - so long as you end up buying your gear from them. And I'll bet you it'll cost more than $951.

Closeout prices are all very well if you can get them, but they're not everyday prices are they? And if you get particular about your tastes in gear or insist on buying the latest kit, you won't be paying $300 for a board

The other problem is ... captive markets. Cost me $140 to get a board shipped here from the US and that's thanks to the hard work of the guy who sold it me - and probably still cheaper than buying it here. And I simply couldn't get the board I wanted. Or I'd pay a premium cos the gear that the store bought was when the dollar was strong so I'm paying for their stock that got hammered by the exchange rate

It's a nice idea, but I think in this day and age the business model has to adapt to the times. Surely you're better off asking - what do the customer riders actually want?*

Unless, of course, you're happy to grind out tons of beginners and flog them gear on a one-off basis ...

* For myself, I want to be able to demo gear without having to feel like I'm kicking tyres or any pressure to buy - I think manufacturers need to do more to support the local stores to get their kit in the shop without the owner having to hold a bunch of stock that's costing him money.

[Kamikuza]

I am just saying that there are opportunities to get solid product at less than a $2000 price tag from your local shop and gave one example.

Which defeats your own argument ...

[kitebig]

This is interesting, from what I see, the way kiteboarding is distributed today is the same as windsurfing years ago and main point before internet was arround. Mainly using the same shops and networks, the price of the gear is mainly adding the margins of the brand itself, then the country distributor, then the shop.
The end customer will pay 4 to 5 times the factory cost as a full retail price to the shop.

Before the internet, the guy in his surf shop was a central source of information in his area, he had the most valuable advice, he had easy contact with the magazines, the brands, the top riders, information would go through him and then spread on the local beach, he was like a local guru.

Today internet is around and the shop owner will probably not be the first guy you will go to for some advice, you will first check out your friends on the beach and on Facebook, you will google the gear you're looking at, check out the forums, maybe start a thread looking for some advice.

So one's you have done all that you finally go to your local shop ask for the product, there is some chance he will not have the product you have looked for, so he will recommend you something much better for you that he happens to have in stock, the shop holder will never recommend you to get specific gear just because he has too much stock or better margins, well in fact he does, that's his job.

So maybe you will say to the shop guy that finally you found a great deal with a new brand on the internet, he will then explain to you how dangerous this is for you, that you will have no after sale service, no spare parts, and help you fill guilty coming back to his shop if you need in the future some small item.

Well the fact is that in the case of warranty or need of spare parts the shop needs to refer to the distributor who has to refer to the brand, then to the factory, and the product has to be shipped the other way back costing a lot of money and time.

Where shipping directly the spare part from the factory and from a centralized stock to the customer is much faster and cheaper.

I think shops should open up to new brands just have a couple of test kites, and get shipped direct from Hong Kong, at good prices for their customers.

[KitePaddleSurf]

I am just saying that there are opportunities to get solid product at less than a $2000 price tag from your local shop and gave one example.

Which defeats your own argument ...

I am sorry, but I not following your logic on this one. (ie... I just can't understand what you are trying to say)

I am saying you can get some kites from some shops at a similar price to an online only shop that doesn't provide the local support. If pricing is equal or similar, I think you should give the local shop a shot.

[KitePaddleSurf]

This is interesting, from what I see, the way kiteboarding is distributed today is the same as windsurfing years ago and main point before internet was arround. Mainly using the same shops and networks, the price of the gear is mainly adding the margins of the brand itself, then the country distributor, then the shop.
The end customer will pay 4 to 5 times the factory cost as a full retail price to the shop.

Liquid Force is able to offer this kite as part of the package for a similar price to the online-only-direct-to-consumer kite company that doesn't offer local support or lessons. This is just one example, of where you can find great prices on kites in your local shop.

If real physical shop are to be valued, they will need to be supported. If ultimately it doesn't cost you any more money, why not support the physical shop that provides kiteboarding resources?