The problem with designing a ~16m kite (Infinity V2 and V3) for "light winds" is that the luff curve has to be very deep to "milk" as much low end as possible. This causes the kite to sit VERY deep in the window, leading to the problems "Laughingman" outlined, i.e. poor upwind ability, a tendency to yank the rider downwind, extremely poor top-end, and poor ability to absorb gusts.Laughingman wrote:1. (for me) it sat too far back in the window making edging up wind almost impossible unless you were on a light wind specific board
2. and if you were on a light wind board it was easy to lose speed control since edging against it was near impossible … but it still yanked me downwind because it sits so far back in the window.
Objective testing of previous versions of the "Infinity" showed it had inferior power to other kites in light winds: http://www.thekiteboarder.com/2011/05/e ... te-review/davesails7 wrote:I've been riding a 2011 18m Dyno for the last few months and have been really impressed. I've ridden it while others rode…Epic Infinity…, so can compare low end by how I was able to get on the water vs. the others. Who knows what actual wind speeds were up in the air at the kite. I think side by side comparison is much more helpful than endless videos of a kite riding alone on glassy water.
vs. Infinity: Dyno was stable in the air, never fell out of the sky for 4 hours of light wind riding. Two guys with Infinities were struggling to keep their kites in the air most of the time.
The Infinity V3 failed in 8 knots (see below). The V2 performing in 5k? Complete bullshit.Dimitri M wrote: I have video of the Infinity V2 in action from 5 to 10 knots real soon. Did I say 5 knots!!!! No way..... !
SupaEZ wrote: I would have written (Dimitri M) a check right there and then if his kite was better than mine...but it was not. I did get going earlier in the light wind that we had 7-9k max avg 8k. But he needed 7-11kn avg 9k.......which never happened.
Epic Infinity V3 Will LOSE Even More Low EndSupaEZ wrote:His kite needed more wind to get going.
I was 100 ft away from beach on a full plane in 8k. He was 10 ft away from the beach on a sub-plane working hard not to end up on beach also in 8k. Right before we crossed (dead onshore wind) … Made sure he saw me...i looked into the white of his eyes. Did a 6 ft air forward 1 1/2 transition with kite downloop to toeside and planed off on the other tack
For the short time we were both able to go out i did 5 type jumps/ transitions. Many with looping the kite effortlessly.
He was only able to get one 4ft air back roll transition and landed in an insufficient amount of water. He was then grounded.
End of story.
…the issue here is who is BS "ing" who here about LW performance.
I felt like i was riding against someone with a smaller size kite.....OOOPS i was !
It is IMPOSSIBLE to give a kite more high end without compromising low end. Hence, the Epic Infinity V3 will become even more INFERIOR in light winds.DimitriM wrote:…we are still working on perfecting the High end of the INFINITY v3.
Compared to the Core19m kite, the Epic Infinity V3 was noticeably INFERIOR; it certainly didn't have the "power of a 19m".Dimitri M wrote: Infinity V2 has the power of a 19 meter but turns like a 14 meter.
In response, the following was posted by a knowledgeable local:Dimitri M wrote:3 to 6 knots
Despite the claimed performance in "3-6k", quite clearly, the Epic Infinity cannot perform on a SUP until >10mph (9k).SupaEZ wrote: ... the Patrick Air Force Base windmeter reading (is) just a few miles upwind of Dimitri: Wind was SSW 200 degrees...that is why the ocean is so glassy...i should know i live here 30 years. He was out between 2 and 4 pm.... we see clearly that the wind was always more than........... 10 mph .......those are government's wind meters....very accurate...
Light Wind ShowdownUKSurf wrote:Why did Momi design an inferior kite for Blade? I honestly think this claiming your kites are superior to everyone else's will only backfire. If it is better at one thing then it will be worse at something else, most people appreciate that kite design these days is about finely balanced trade-offs NOT one kite being better than another.Dimitri M wrote:The difference from the INFINITY V2 vs the FAT LADY is that the INFINITY v2 turns faster and has better pop. But the power is piratically the same after testing them.
Now the INFINITY V3 is something different.
Kiteus Maximus wrote:Whatever dude. You created me. If you don't like me then stop creating me.
Of course, walking backwards with a kite is not a recognised way of testing its low-end, UNLESS you are making claims that it can fly in "2-4 knots". It would be EASY to test Epic's "2-4 knot" claim by putting up the Infinity in a school hall or similar & walking backwards at the standard walking velocity of 2.7 knots.Kite2Heaven wrote:PMU - you really are stupid if you are resorting to walking backwards with a kite !!! … Otherwise "ALL" wind readings are BULLSHIT just like yourself !!
It is not an entirely fair comparison I would agree. But what it does show is that the Infinity V3 and Oxygen do not go upwind in 7-8 knots, even with a professional rider using them. He is also using a light wind twin tip, not a regular board. It might well be that the Infinity performs very well as a light wind freestyle kite in the top end of a force 3 gusting into a force 4, but that is something very different than what is being claimed here.windsuks wrote:I own the previous model of that North board, it makes a huge difference in light winds. You simply can't compare that with a twin tip especially a board like the Oxygen made with tricks also in mind!
This is such a farce
You should not use scale on empty kite, kite companies give out empty or dry weight. What matters is how much kite has mass when it is full of air. If Dimitri says Airush has larger LE than Infinity it could contain more mass when pumped.UKSurf wrote: I will try the Airush Zero at the first opportunity dont worry . Having a high aspect ratio 17m with the weight of a 10m sounds very exciting.
Dimitri M wrote: Also you will see that the LE of the AIRUSH ZERO is twice as big as the LE of the INFINITY v2 kite. So it is not as light as you think.
No need to be so formal, please feel free to call me "Mr Pumpy".Kamikuza wrote:What does "perform" mean, Pump-a-chump?
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