Cabrinha Switchblade 2013 QR malfunction

[polarstorm]

.. it flipped on the other side completely so that I was not facing the struts any more and got a regular shape.
..
Cheers.

Was the kite sufficiently inflated, or perhaps losing air? Inversion might (likely will) change the neutralizing pattern of the QR1. I would suggest that it was not tested to do that, i.e. not supported.

[Laughingman]

Can't tell right now, sorry. Do you suggest that the bar might have stopped on the knot created by a line twist?

Yes if there was more then a few twists it could very well be that your safety line got stuck.
shit happens...

[IWB2]

Hi Janeko,

With hundreds of self rescues done (personally and with students) on the Cabrinha IDS system (2009-2013) I have to say the system is an awesome safety system which will depower the kite more than a single front line flagging system (on a 4 line kite) . With the IDS system you have to to be confident and fully understand the process. Meaning once you activate the QR1, you must push the bar out the full length (eg 15ft) so that back lines can become super slack and the kite flags off the two front bridles by either sitting leading edge down facing you or leading edge facing you but upside down (u position). Once that happens you can wrap the ids lines first on the bar, followed by the lines. The kite should not pull very much.
Where persons run into issues with the IDS system is that they fail to push the bar the full depower length, instead they rely on bar instantly sliding the full length automatically which it doesnt always do and can pull a lot in overpowered situations, and thus requires one to manually push the bar away by working up the ids line. If you are in shallow water walk up the ids line towards kite. The pull will be initially strong but as the bar is pushed the entire way the kite will flip leading edge down or in the u position, with a central pull from the lines which is very light.


The issue with the single front line flagging system for me is that once activated and the bar slides away the full length of the safety line, the kite is now pulling from one of the front bridles which allows the wind to still catch the canopy and create a much greater pull than the IDS system. This makes winding up the lines much more challenging. I tested the new 2015 flagging system in both moderate wind strength and super over powered wind strength and was shocked to find how much pull was still being generated and that the kite would buck and kick. The super over powered test for sure had me a bit uneasy as the kite once flagged out was still pulling like a raging bull. Winding the lines on the bar required a lot of effort which a person who was tired or not very strong could have possible issues with.. Had this been the IDS system being flagged out, i could of had a 10 year old wrap up the lines even in the super over powered conditions as the kite pulls very little.

I really do like the new 2015 Cabrinha bar, kite, lines, (switchblade) kite performance, new quick release etc etc..The kite flys amayzing,. however if i had my pick the IDS to save my ass in nuking conditions or the single front line system, i would always choose the IDS as the pull from the kite is far less which makes wrapping the lines on the bar far easier. There maybe persons who shrug this off as they never do a self rescue/self land, but for someone who kites alone, or wants the safest 4 line system, or a flagging system which pulls a lot less like on a 5 line system then the IDS system is the way to go. Hopefully Cabrinha can bring back the IDS system or a system which has the kite flag out where the pull is more central on the leading edge..

[dracop]

The above post is awesome. I fly and I strongly prefer single line flagging systems, but I learned in part on Cab Switchblades using IDS and his description of how to do it and the most common problem with it are accurate. The not pushing the bar out enough happens on single line systems sometimes as well.

QR is not foolproof though, I've QRed and had my kite doing death loops because the lines were so twisted farther up the tension was elsewhere. The kite had inverted and then spun around leading to a crazy situation. Inversions are just ugly. If the QR does not kill the kite's power and you are in an emergency, you may have to fall back to the final release - there is a reason it exists. Better to lose a used kite (since you used it) that has a depreciated value vs losing your life; its possible to buy another even if it takes some work/saving.

[ronnie]

Hi Janeko,

With hundreds of self rescues done (personally and with students) on the Cabrinha IDS system (2009-2013) I have to say the system is an awesome safety system which will depower the kite more than a single front line flagging system (on a 4 line kite) . With the IDS system you have to to be confident and fully understand the process. Meaning once you activate the QR1, you must push the bar out the full length (eg 15ft) so that back lines can become super slack and the kite flags off the two front bridles by either sitting leading edge down facing you or leading edge facing you but upside down (u position). Once that happens you can wrap the ids lines first on the bar, followed by the lines. The kite should not pull very much.
Where persons run into issues with the IDS system is that they fail to push the bar the full depower length, instead they rely on bar instantly sliding the full length automatically which it doesnt always do and can pull a lot in overpowered situations, and thus requires one to manually push the bar away by working up the ids line. If you are in shallow water walk up the ids line towards kite. The pull will be initially strong but as the bar is pushed the entire way the kite will flip leading edge down or in the u position, with a central pull from the lines which is very light.


The issue with the single front line flagging system for me is that once activated and the bar slides away the full length of the safety line, the kite is now pulling from one of the front bridles which allows the wind to still catch the canopy and create a much greater pull than the IDS system. This makes winding up the lines much more challenging. I tested the new 2015 flagging system in both moderate wind strength and super over powered wind strength and was shocked to find how much pull was still being generated and that the kite would buck and kick. The super over powered test for sure had me a bit uneasy as the kite once flagged out was still pulling like a raging bull. Winding the lines on the bar required a lot of effort which a person who was tired or not very strong could have possible issues with.. Had this been the IDS system being flagged out, i could of had a 10 year old wrap up the lines even in the super over powered conditions as the kite pulls very little.

I really do like the new 2015 Cabrinha bar, kite, lines, (switchblade) kite performance, new quick release etc etc..The kite flys amayzing,. however if i had my pick the IDS to save my ass in nuking conditions or the single front line system, i would always choose the IDS as the pull from the kite is far less which makes wrapping the lines on the bar far easier. There maybe persons who shrug this off as they never do a self rescue/self land, but for someone who kites alone, or wants the safest 4 line system, or a flagging system which pulls a lot less like on a 5 line system then the IDS system is the way to go. Hopefully Cabrinha can bring back the IDS system or a system which has the kite flag out where the pull is more central on the leading edge..

I found the IDS on my 09 Xbows was ideal for drift launching, which happens to suit the spots I use the most. So I have an easier and safer launch/land system many times, but I could get a bit less pull on flagout with a kite that flags out well on a single line if I ever had an emergency where that would make a difference. I think the IDS is too good a safety system to abandon completely - provided Cabrinha actually design the kite to make the IDS work properly. They seem to have also designed IDS kites which do not let the system work properly.
eg. at 2:55 in this


The 09 Xbow can yoyo up and down if in the U position when flagged out because the wind got too strong, and the pull is considerable and makes it difficult to wind the lines on. I have just wound the lines on and let it yoyo but I suspect I could get it to sit in the U position on the surface by letting out the IDS line slightly to put slight tension in the rear lines.

If I have the choice, I prefer to activate the IDS by setting the kite at 2 o'clock and quickly pulling down the centre lines. The kite will flip over into the parked position as it is drifting on the surface to the downwind position. Then it is very easy to wind the lines.

Basically like this, but by pulling the centre lines down 3 metres to the top of the red lines.

[IWB2]

The Cabrinha kites that used the IDS system ie Xbow, SB, Convert, Nomad etc all seemed to react slightly different when being flagged out. The Switchblades in almost all of my experiences (well over 100 times) worked flawlessly and had the kite leading edge down, facing the rider. IMO this results in a pull which is far less than if using a single front line (4 line kite) as the single front line will allow the kite to be slightly off center allowing more wind to grab the canopy.

The Xbow had a much higher percentage of being in the U position when being flagged out on the IDS system. While this is still a very neutral depowered position, it can result in more pull than if the kite is leading edge faced down, if the kite starts floating up and down. Again if you have a single front line flagging kite which is lying on its back but flagged off the one line, it will pull easily twice as much or more than a kite which is in the U position when using the IDS system. My recent experience on the new 2015 SB11m and being forced to flag the kite out as I was well beyond my limits and comfort level (nuking winds) had the kite start off being face down but slightly off center (as only being pulled on one front line). The kite then rolled on its back and would fly up and down and pull. Trust me when i say this was pulling like i was hauling in a tuna. Yes conditions were super powered for this size kite and should of been on a 9m. The fact of the matter is that had this been the IDS system, i could have flagged out the SB11m in even stronger winds and the kite would have been effortless to wind in as the pull from the kite would have been minimal.

Ronnie - at point 2.55 seen in the 2009 IDS video, the SB kite only would ever take off at the initial stage of being flagged out if it did not go leading edge down. From there it would then take off in a depowered state and flip over onto the leading edge (dead down wind) and would be out cold resulting in the least amount of pull. I would not call this a flaw in the system but rather the flagging process was going though its process.

[IWB2]

Ronnie - Your 2nd video posted of the 2012 Cabrinha Switchblade being flagged out on the IDS line is a great example of how the Cabrinha kite reacts when being flagged out and the pull it generates which is very little. At around 1.00 to 1.03 , in the video that is the part where the kite briefly will take off again. In the video it did more or less just flopped over, but in some cases, the flop can be greater if the kite happened to be closer to the edge of the window when being flagged out on the IDS line (as kite in full flagged out mode will be dead down wind). Again this is not a flaw in the system but rather the kite doing exactly what it was designed to do and going through the stages of flagging out.

If a person holds their inflated kite in the u position on a windy while standing on the beach, they have full control of the kite. Now if that same person, works their way along the leading edge towards the wind tip, they will start to experience the kite "kicking and bucking" as they have move away from center. Holding just the very end of the wing tip will result in the kite producing the most amount of energy as it "kicks in bucks".
The pull point on the leading edge of the kite when the kite is flagged very much determines how much pull will be generated. Anyone who flew the 2008 Cabrinha Switchblade will remember that the the safety leash attached to the outside line. Once the kite was flagged out, it generated a lot of pull, as the kite was pulling at the furthest point from center. The kite would roll and kick in the wind, and would create a lot of pull when winding in the lines when doing a self rescue. A single front flagging line pulls away from the center of the kite and thus creates more energy than if it was from dead center like the IDS system, but not as much pulled as a single outside line flagging system. I think the IDS system was the closest form to having a 5th style safety system but with only 4 lines which results in the least amount of pull when the kite is flagged out.

[ronnie]

The Cabrinha kites that used the IDS system ie Xbow, SB, Convert, Nomad etc all seemed to react slightly different when being flagged out. The Switchblades in almost all of my experiences (well over 100 times) worked flawlessly and had the kite leading edge down, facing the rider. IMO this results in a pull which is far less than if using a single front line (4 line kite) as the single front line will allow the kite to be slightly off center allowing more wind to grab the canopy.

The Xbow had a much higher percentage of being in the U position when being flagged out on the IDS system. While this is still a very neutral depowered position, it can result in more pull than if the kite is leading edge faced down, if the kite starts floating up and down. Again if you have a single front line flagging kite which is lying on its back but flagged off the one line, it will pull easily twice as much or more than a kite which is in the U position when using the IDS system. My recent experience on the new 2015 SB11m and being forced to flag the kite out as I was well beyond my limits and comfort level (nuking winds) had the kite start off being face down but slightly off center (as only being pulled on one front line). The kite then rolled on its back and would fly up and down and pull. Trust me when i say this was pulling like i was hauling in a tuna. Yes conditions were super powered for this size kite and should of been on a 9m. The fact of the matter is that had this been the IDS system, i could have flagged out the SB11m in even stronger winds and the kite would have been effortless to wind in as the pull from the kite would have been minimal.

Ronnie - at point 2.55 seen in the 2009 IDS video, the SB kite only would ever take off at the initial stage of being flagged out if it did not go leading edge down. From there it would then take off in a depowered state and flip over onto the leading edge (dead down wind) and would be out cold resulting in the least amount of pull. I would not call this a flaw in the system but rather the flagging process was going though its process.

I like the IDS and bought a 2013 Switchblade and a 2013 Drifter because I would not be able to buy IDS kites any more after 2013.

What I don't like to see is the Nomad in that video not rolling onto its back without the kiter walking towards it. For me, the kite should be designed so that the IDS would drop it on its back without you having to help it.