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Ebay dispute

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fair
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Ebay dispute

Postby fair » Sat Jul 28, 2018 2:13 pm

Hello,

I'd like to be fair in an ebay dispute with a buyer who bought my 2014 Cabrinha Switchblade but then discovered that the wingtips's black layer is delaminated:

Image

Image

I had included several photos of the kite, including some very close photos (for example pigtails, etc.) but the only picture that shows the wingtip's missing black layer is this:

Image

Frankly, I had not even noticed the issue. Even if I had I wouldn't consider it an issue but I would have put a close picture of it.

I like clarity and I like to be fair so I have a few questions:

1) What's the black layer purpose? Is it protecting the wing? Is it a problem if it's stripped? How did they get stripped in the first place without me even noticing? The kite is in great condition otherwise and it flies perfectly (I sold it due to switching to wave kites) but since the buyer is concerned, I'd like to be able to address the concern. Are we talking about cosmetics or core functionality? Or somewhere in between?

2) How can the issue be corrected/fixed? What would the cost? The kite got sold for $475 after some bidding. Should I do a partial refund? Buyer asked for $150 back based on this issue alone but that's like 1/3 of the price for what I'd consider a minor issue.

Feedback would be greatly appreciated!

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Re: Ebay dispute

Postby halloi » Sat Jul 28, 2018 3:30 pm

srsly?

that aint no dispute thats fraud.
full refund and stop selling stuff thats damaged without saying that it is.
youll thank me 10 years from now because dont evrr nevrr mess with mama karma. :nono:

Image


your call :baby:

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Re: Ebay dispute

Postby edt » Sat Jul 28, 2018 3:53 pm

Full refund and relist is my general principle. Not worth getting a negative reputation. I can't see your image but I assume you are talking about the protective layers of cloth or fake leather, it's there to prevent wear from when it drags on the ground. Normally if this wears out there are two causes 1) dragging it on the ground so much it wears through -- I don't think this is the case 2) UV radiation weakened the thread so it let loose. If 2) is the case then my assumption is the entire kite is about ready to fall apart because the rest of the kite's threads are also ready to go. I normally don't like doing partial refunds like this, because I like staying inside the ebay system, for instance what if you do a partial refund and then he asks for more later because of some other problem that comes up (say for instance the leading edge blows out). I would refund shipping too. In the relist make sure to show the problem.

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Re: Ebay dispute

Postby fair » Sat Jul 28, 2018 4:58 pm

Thanks edt, appreciate the answer

(I noticed the images looked broken but I was able to open the image URL in separate browser window, may be hard to do on a phone or tablet though.

Let me try links:

buyer images:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/lwlygnsaxflct ... 1.png?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/q3zg791171m2m ... 2.png?dl=0

one of seller images:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/dwf66zz98wr81 ... c.jpg?dl=0
)

Kite certainly hasn't been dragged. The way I ride, it rarely even touches the water, or sand for that matter (as my kite spot is grassy) . It's not (2) either because the threads are in place and in the pictures you can see the black material where the threads are. The material is only missing where there's no thread.

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Re: Ebay dispute

Postby pete32257 » Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:08 pm

A fair approach would be refund but buyer pays return shipping. The buyer is responsible for looking closely at seller pics. I agree with the karma thing, underpromise overdeliver.

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Re: Ebay dispute

Postby andylc » Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:23 pm

I wouldn’t personally buy that, plus it doesn’t appear that it is visible on your image. I would also suggest that this is very obvious age related wear that you should have noticed and mentioned. If the guy wants to keep it then you just have to agree on how much less it is worth. I would guess that with damage documented and photographed it would reduce value significantly.

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Re: Ebay dispute

Postby norcom » Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:26 pm

andylc wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:23 pm
I wouldn’t personally buy that, plus it doesn’t appear that it is visible on your image. I would also suggest that this is very obvious age related wear that you should have noticed and mentioned. If the guy wants to keep it then you just have to agree on how much less it is worth. I would guess that with damage documented and photographed it would reduce value significantly.
Completely agree with this. It was the sellers responsibility to show such damage, it's not a tiny pinhole you couldn't see. But it would also depend on the description of the time. I hate auctions that say "NEW (OTHER)" and then begin with "Only used three times". I don't even think you have a chance of getting the buyer to pay for the shipping charges to send it back. Learn to eBay.

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Re: Ebay dispute

Postby fair » Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:39 pm

No, I genuinely didn't see it, seriously. It was listed properly as used with full disclosures (used, model year, a picture with serial number, a picture with production date, etc) except for this detail which I genuinely overlooked.

I already offered both options to the buyer:

- a return
- a partial return with the amount that the buyer wanted ($150). I don't want to engage in negotiations at this point, also it's hard to establish the value.

Frankly, this is not about the money, but about principles, which is why I'm asking all of you here. I'd like to be fair and neither take advantage of others being naive nor allow others to take advantage of me being naive.

I like the rule of underpromise plus overdeliver though, thanks for the suggestion! And the note about karma :-)

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Re: Ebay dispute

Postby andylc » Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:43 pm

If you have replied both agreeing to the buyers request, and have offered a refund, and it was a genuine mistake, then all should be well. If you agree to the partial refund then you should ask for an assurance that the buyer will still leave positive feedback, since he has made a request and you have agreed to it.

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Re: Ebay dispute

Postby norcom » Sat Jul 28, 2018 6:57 pm

fair wrote:
Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:39 pm

Frankly, this is not about the money, but about principles, which is why I'm asking all of you here. I'd like to be fair and neither take advantage of others being naive nor allow others to take advantage of me being naive.
Whenever I list something on eBay I try to describe every litle scratch, imperfection, discoloration or anything that would upset me. I very rarely buy something used on eBay and whenever I do, I'm usually dissappointed. I include many pictures of every details and try to get the best quality photos with close ups. There's absolutely no reason everyone shouldn't be doing this nowaday. 15 years ago, sure, we all didn't have nice digital cameras with an internet connection that was able to load large images. I hate listing on eBay because it does take a lot of time to get it right.

eBay takes the buyers side 99% of the time now. Selling on eBay is not worth the hassle because of that. The more you mention and overmention every detail and imperfection the less likely a buyer will be able to rip on you for having something wrong. But also less likely your item will sell for as much as you'd want it to.


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