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Looking for advice on first quiver

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Mossy 757
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Re: Looking for advice on first quiver

Postby Mossy 757 » Tue Jan 08, 2019 3:19 pm

apparantlee wrote:
Mon Jan 07, 2019 10:11 pm
Great, thanks for the quick responses!

Mossy I was just about to post that as I've been sessioning a trainer kite since November i was considering buying the gear before the lesson as a way of pre-familiarising myself... I had a nagging feeling akin to your advice though!
I should say that i'm definitely not looking to break the bank on whichever first kite I get, more the opposite, but would you say that the risk would be decreased if I intended to only fly it on two feet on the land until after the lesson?..
My trainer kite was a huge advantage in me getting good, I was a life-long snowboarder and sailor, and fairly competent surfer but kiting totally evaded me until I started using the trainer kite, especially in low wind.

I don't recommend flying a 4 line power kite on the beach as a way of learning, it's actually fairly dangerous until you truly have the hang of things because if you accidentally power up the kite or fail to pull the safety in time, you're going to hit sand/grass/rock instead of water. It's fairly easy to make a mistake with the control bar and end up lofting yourself a bit, and I wouldn't want to try to navigate that experience over something hard. I don't know any competent kite schools that teach students with large power kites on the land, they almost always do the first power kite lessons on the water for this reason alone.

I'd also strongly recommend that when you do take lessons you talk to the shop about potentially buying some of their used gear. I did this for my first kit, I took lessons and then bought the 1-season-old gear they were selling because schools usually refresh their equipment annually or semi-annually. In this case, you're definitely looking at gear that's been ridden hard by students, but you should also have the opportunity to inflate it, make sure it holds air, inspect it for damage, and really understand exactly why you're buying what you're buying instead of purchasing equipment site-unseen; the same cannot be said for purchasing used gear online! I have purchased a couple of kites without doing what I now consider proper "diligence" before hand and in both cases ended up selling the kites for a loss in order to end up on the right equipment. Some of this is inevitable as the sport has some of the 'shrewdest' marketing people on Earth, but nowadays I try to really understand user feedback before pulling the trigger on a large purchase. Buying good entry-level gear that you've taken lessons on from a reputable school is a good way to conduct this diligence when entering the sport, and again, it'll help you avoid buying the wrong size because you should be able to try out the gear before making a purchase. For a beginner, I think it makes sense to buy a large-ish size kite and then get a couple different boards (low-wind board, high-wind board, surfboard perhaps) as that will increase the range of your 1 kite but with a lower overall investment. A lot of people buy 1 board and then grab 2 or 3 kites and I don't think that gives you the same learning curve as you're going to have to transition between kite behavior early on while you're still building muscle memory. Perhaps you could say the same about changing boards, but most boards cost 25% of what a new kite costs. Potatoe, Po-tah-toe.

grigorib
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Re: Looking for advice on first quiver

Postby grigorib » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:38 pm

iriejohn wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:22 am
grigorib wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 6:08 am
iriejohn wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:52 am
I kite near Portsmouth, same sort of conditions.
...
So 6-13 and 13-25 MPH? Waves? Currents?
6/8/10/12m for 15-35 knots (and 17m for summer seabreezes). 82kg/1.8m. Frontal winds. Lieuwe Shotgun TT and Mitu 5'8". Mostly onshore(ish), 3-5m tides, flat to waves 1-3m, strong current when spring tides, mostly kite on sand beach 50.7752° N, 0.9077° W
So I’d say 9/12/17m, door and twintip for those conditions.

badgb21
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Re: Looking for advice on first quiver

Postby badgb21 » Tue Jan 08, 2019 8:30 pm

Hi Lee,
Your question always provokes a stream of different opinions here and usually a little pedantic infighting too! Which is always fun to read!
Everyone has their own take on a first quiver, rightly so, it would be a boring world if we all thought the same.

As a beginner it takes a while to build your skill and align your thoughts with those whose opinions you dial into.
Some of my thoughts;
Great you have some board skills, this side will become instinctive, the focus will be the kite and where’s it at!

Lessons are number one importance.

I’ve never been a fan of trainer kites, far rather fly the real thing in the shallows to dial in feel.

Go for LEI’s. I’ve only ever owned land foils (Flexifoil Blades) and rescued water foils from the surf– they are not for me on water. This is something you can maybe decide on later.

(The 15m Contra happens to be a favourite of mine.)

Get a big TT, this will be a great help with learning and may serve as a light wind board later.
If not sell it in the summer.

Kite power is your friend when learning, so get the bigger sizes first.

Ask others at your kite spot, who are around the same weight for sizing.
My guess would be a 9/12/15m would cover you.

Depending on budget a 9 & 12 cabrinha switchblade and a 15 Contra works well and could be used on one Cab adjustable bar.
Once you are up and running, then look for a smaller TT, try as many as you can before buying.

Good luck and enjoy the ride!




apparantlee wrote:
Mon Jan 07, 2019 2:05 pm
Hi, I'm looking to put together my first quiver this year and I was hoping to get some advice on kite choices if possible.

My weight: 95kg looking to drop to 85
Local spots: Burnham on Sea, Exmouth
Current gear: 139CM liquid force wakeboard
Previous experience in wakeboarding, snowboarding and mountain boarding.

With a view to maximising the number of potential sessions following a lesson I'll be taking in the spring I'm looking to buy a light wind kite with good low end first followed by a smaller kite as a later addition towards autumn.

I have two questions I'm hoping for some help with:

1. In the provision that I'll be getting a large 'door' twintip/directional board initially, would I realistically see considerably more light wind use out of a foil kite as opposed to a light wind LEI such as a 15m contra/envy? I've heard foils tend to have smaller wind ranges than light LEIs.

2. Depending on the ideal choice for the first kite, (foil/LEI, 15M/17M etc) what would be the most complementary choice for the second kite to cover as much of the higher wind ranges?

Any help/advice very much appreciated.

Lee

iriejohn
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Re: Looking for advice on first quiver

Postby iriejohn » Tue Jan 08, 2019 8:56 pm

grigorib wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:38 pm
iriejohn wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:22 am
grigorib wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 6:08 am


So 6-13 and 13-25 MPH? Waves? Currents?
6/8/10/12m for 15-35 knots (and 17m for summer seabreezes). 82kg/1.8m. Frontal winds. Lieuwe Shotgun TT and Mitu 5'8". Mostly onshore(ish), 3-5m tides, flat to waves 1-3m, strong current when spring tides, mostly kite on sand beach 50.7752° N, 0.9077° W
So I’d say 9/12/17m, door and twintip for those conditions.
Many thanks for offering me your unsolicited advice.

Ever heard the expression "Teaching your grand ..."? :lol:

alexglebov
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Re: Looking for advice on first quiver

Postby alexglebov » Wed Jan 09, 2019 1:58 am

Get a trainer kite, but try to find a 4-line trainer LEI that works with standard bar. I bought Best Guroo, 3m trainer kite. I used my harness and Slingshot bar, 21m lines with that kite. I had a lot of fun and you can use this kite for landboarding too. By the way, landboarding is the great way to learn kite flying. If you fly trainer kite on the beach it is called static flying, if you use the mountain board with the kite, then you can dynamically fly the kite and experiment with the apparent wind. Your kite handling will be so much better if you can do it while landboarding - you will learn to be careful with kite movements.

grigorib
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Re: Looking for advice on first quiver

Postby grigorib » Wed Jan 09, 2019 7:20 am

iriejohn wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 8:56 pm
grigorib wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:38 pm
iriejohn wrote:
Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:22 am


6/8/10/12m for 15-35 knots (and 17m for summer seabreezes). 82kg/1.8m. Frontal winds. Lieuwe Shotgun TT and Mitu 5'8". Mostly onshore(ish), 3-5m tides, flat to waves 1-3m, strong current when spring tides, mostly kite on sand beach 50.7752° N, 0.9077° W
So I’d say 9/12/17m, door and twintip for those conditions.
Many thanks for offering me your unsolicited advice.

Ever heard the expression "Teaching your grand ..."? :lol:
The advice is for the OP at his weight, not for you :)
If I got it right, you said your wind conditions are the same as his, so I was curious what are those conditions.

apparantlee
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Re: Looking for advice on first quiver

Postby apparantlee » Wed Jan 09, 2019 11:11 am

Loads of good advice here, very much appreciated all.

Alex I'm actually looking to find a used mountain board to practice with my trainer kite now, sold my old one years ago sadly. It's a 2 line trainer that I bought but I'm hoping it should give at least some feel for it...

Hadn't thought about trying to match whichever bar I get to the different kites in the quiver either, thanks all. :thumb:


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