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Upwind performance - Peak 4 4m, CA wave 4.5m, Hyperlink 5m

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PrfctChaos
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Upwind performance - Peak 4 4m, CA wave 4.5m, Hyperlink 5m

Postby PrfctChaos » Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:30 am

Looking for a small foil kite for 15+ knots hydrofoiling. Usually I switch over to 5.5 m drifter at this wind speed, but looking for a foil kite to take its place (Can't be bothered carrying a pump around these days).

Looking for better upwind performance than the LEI, I do long upwind/downwind missions and find the limited upwind angles on a LEI frustrating compared to the Chrono. (Guess that excludes the Peak 4 right off the back).

- Does anyone know if the CA wave goes upwind better than a LEI (I assume it goes upwind better than the Peak?).
- How would the CA waves upwind ability compare to a hyperlink?

Yes, I didn't mention the Soul, not a fan of how it feels/flies.

tomtom
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Re: Upwind performance - Peak 4 4m, CA wave 4.5m, Hyperlink 5m

Postby tomtom » Thu Mar 21, 2019 1:08 am

Chrono and Peak cannot be together in one sentence. :)

Anyway - the smaller the Peak is and the more wind there is - the more upwind it goes. I think Horst make his upwind gps track public here - and commented 3m Peak as better than LEI in upwind.
Also it will depends from your wing also - the slower the wing - the better upwind angle

About CA wave vs Peak I think Horst flyed Both and im also interested.

My own experience with Peak 5m /i have also 4m but did not flyed it yet on HF/ is that it requires quite more leg pressure /upwind course/ than my FSR foil kite - so upwind is less effortless. Peak strong side is on downwind leg where it shine. If i can describe it in number. Peak is about 20% worse in upwind and about 300% better in downwind than "average" kite.
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Regis-de-giens
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Re: Upwind performance - Peak 4 4m, CA wave 4.5m, Hyperlink 5m

Postby Regis-de-giens » Thu Mar 21, 2019 9:33 am

I would put this order in term of L/D ratio (i.e. upwind performance):
Peak->LEI->Wave-> Hyperlink->Chrono
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jakemoore
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Re: Upwind performance - Peak 4 4m, CA wave 4.5m, Hyperlink 5m

Postby jakemoore » Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:09 am

5 and 7 Hyperlink are sweet kites. Very light, great drift, upwind and relaunch. Good lift for transitions if you are powered. Fun to fly powered and underpowered. First generates speed when sheeting out the bar and depowers at the window edge. Fast forward flying but will sit deep if you want it too. You can goof up and sail down wind of it causing a bowtie if you let it get too far forward and turn downwind at the same time. 7 is my most used kite.

Peak4 is better in drift but worse in upwind. Trade relaunch for easy deep water packdown. Only goes in the water if you get disoriented. Dont ride out farther than you want to swim. Most fun in the bottom part of the windrange. Depower is most immediate. Price is right. Accumulates less sand. Least drama for self launch and land of any kite. The 3 is hilarious when it works.

7 is definitely hyperlink. 5 is a tossup. I think hyperlink suits more riders based on relaunch alone. 4 or smaller peak. Stunt kite downwind riding and wave foil wing riding is great with both but favors the peak and a smaller kite. Upwind and deep downwind angles at speed and a race foil favors the hyperlink and a bigger kite.


I would love to fly a CA wave very much but have not seen in person.
Last edited by jakemoore on Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:34 am, edited 2 times in total.
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elguapo
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Re: Upwind performance - Peak 4 4m, CA wave 4.5m, Hyperlink 5m

Postby elguapo » Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:33 am

i have 4.5 and 8.5 CA waves...
short wide kites (like the CA waves...and BRM clouds) turn fast and have great depower...and good drift.
if you want upwind performace then you are looking at the wrong type of kites.(CA waves are very low aspect)

imo, you use these type of kites to take you to a wave.. then provide power as needed..and then get you out (basically replaces having to paddle a surfboard)
(CA waves also tend to want to launch themselves...which isnt always a good thing)


imo a medium aspect freeride kite like a kitech (and yes a soul) might be ideal for what you are looking for
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Regis-de-giens
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Re: Upwind performance - Peak 4 4m, CA wave 4.5m, Hyperlink 5m

Postby Regis-de-giens » Sat Mar 23, 2019 7:18 am

indeed if you want a bit more upwind but still freeride; then Soul, Kitech FRS, Pansh A15 , and my preferred Pulsion ; I have the Pulsion in 3.69 m2 (that I close vs Wave for its size and a but more upwind kite) and can hydrofoil from 12 to + 40 knots) and upwind is very good above 14knots (for 60kg).

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Re: Upwind performance - Peak 4 4m, CA wave 4.5m, Hyperlink 5m

Postby jatem » Sat Mar 23, 2019 9:04 am

Regis-de-giens wrote:
Thu Mar 21, 2019 9:33 am
I would put this order in term of L/D ratio (i.e. upwind performance):
Peak->LEI->Wave-> Hyperlink->Chrono
Have you flown the Peak4 yet?
My 4m Peak4 doesn't seem any worse than my drifter 5.5 at going upwind. Not that I use my drifter any more, because the peak is so much better behaved.

Regis-de-giens
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Re: Upwind performance - Peak 4 4m, CA wave 4.5m, Hyperlink 5m

Postby Regis-de-giens » Sat Mar 23, 2019 1:55 pm

I did not test the drifter and maybe its LD ratio is worse than average LEI.
I know other versions of peak but has the LD ratio improved a lot at the last revision? I would bet no. Is peak better than a rebel , rally or switchblade for exemple ? I Do not think so but I may be wrong.

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Re: Upwind performance - Peak 4 4m, CA wave 4.5m, Hyperlink 5m

Postby tomtom » Sat Mar 23, 2019 3:46 pm

Peak4 is completely different kite than Peak3. 1,2,3 difference was cosmetical - 4 is different and much better kite and better upwind /flyed 3 and 4 back to back/ . Still upwind performance of 5m Peak4 is nowhere near kitech FRS and little worse /almost same/ as North NEO wave LEI. More high aspect LEI like rebel is definitely better upwind than Peak4. Peak4 5m is imo biggest size which you want to use on HF. If CA wave is same or better than wave LEI than is better in upwind performance than Peak4. Anyway on HF i found upwind performance OK and downwind is much better than any kites i know. If CA wave is as good as peak on downwind and better upwind and still relaunchable - maybe it is best. But peak shine in ground handling /self land lauch/ easy of use pack, unpack /pack size/... and not unimportant its about 1/2 price of closed cell kite of comparable power.
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jatem
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Re: Upwind performance - Peak 4 4m, CA wave 4.5m, Hyperlink 5m

Postby jatem » Sat Mar 23, 2019 9:13 pm

The drifter sits back in the wind window a lot compared to other LEIs. I liked it for foiling because it drifts and steers well compared to other LEIs, and upwind is fast on a hf anyway.

The soul goes upwind significantly better, but I don't enjoy it for downwind riding, way too much care required. Hyperlinks seem to require similar skillful handling, based on riders in my area. Perhaps in a small size they are a lot easier to handle. Loops are seriously committed on a soul, with power that just keeps pulling similar to a Chrono. The peak is nothing like any of these closed cell kites.

I've been satisfied with the 4m peak going upwind when I'm highly powered with the foil leaned upwind, in 20-25 knots. It's not fast upwind when less powered.

In terms of downwind swell riding, the peak4 is next level. You can turn all power off and let it float along as you head straight downwind. Loops are gentle, the steering is a delight, it repositions itself at will. It doesn't threaten to front stall. Vastly different to my soul 10m. The Peak4 completely outdrifts the drifter, the kite becomes the last thing on your mind when riding swell.

I'd like to try a CA Wave one day. Regis, you should try to get your hands on a 4m Peak4 demo, see what you think.
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