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Inflatable race kites

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tilmann
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Re: Inflatable race kites

Postby tilmann » Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:31 am

To be fast the most important thing is to be stable in gusty conditions. Only a thin profile can cut through the gusts like a knife. When you watch racing today there is a permanent working on the bar: depower ... power ... depower ... power and so on. That´s wrong. In future racing you just pull the bar once for acceleration and then lock this position. No movement of the bar anymore. Similar to slalom windsurfing where there is no movement of the boom either.
So control and an absolutely stable unit of board, rider and kite is the key for speed. That´s way more important than theoretical performance (high aspect)
Maybe in the future kites eat gusts so well that you don´t need any depower anymore. So you can use kites with only two lines. That means less drag = more speed.
Clickbar without frontlines
Last edited by tilmann on Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:42 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Inflatable race kites

Postby james » Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:37 am

While there is minimal movement on the boom, the top third of the mast and the leech of the sail are constantly adjusting would you agree?

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Re: Inflatable race kites

Postby tilmann » Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:40 am

james wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:37 am
While there is minimal movement on the boom, the top third of the mast and the leech of the sail are constantly adjusting would you agree?
yes, but as a kiter you don´t need this

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Re: Inflatable race kites

Postby tilmann » Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:55 am

there is only one disadvantage: With a thin profile you you need a bigger kite. (like in windsurfing)

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Re: Inflatable race kites

Postby Matteo V » Tue Jun 18, 2019 2:39 pm

tilmann wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:31 am
When you watch racing today there is a permanent working on the bar: depower ... power ... depower ... power and so on. That´s wrong.....
This statement is wrong in 3 ways

1. If the kite is in one position, not sining, then yes, you are correct (so long as you are not changing course or encountering turbulence). If you are sining the kite even a tiny bit, you are changing it's position in the wind window and you must sheet for maxim lift from the foil section.

2. If you change course, even small upwind or downing changes to go above or under a racer in front of you (or to yield right of way), you DYNAMICALLY change the position of the kite in the wind window. This also requires sheeting. Since kites need a bit more room (not as much as you think) than windsurfers, more movement results in more sheeting.

3. Hydrofoils (if we are talking about racing), are sensitive to sideways pull and often times the kite must be depowered on a gust or turbulence in the wind. This, again, effectively changes the wind window and sheeting is necessary. While a rider can compensate for this with inputs to the hydrofoil, they can also compensate for this with inputs to the kite. Thus some approaches rely on sheeting the kite.


These factors can be reduced in higher winds as power (difference in velocity of water media vs air media) increases with wind speed. Apparent wind is typically referenced more in this situation since the wind is smoothed out by the forward motion of kiter.

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Re: Inflatable race kites

Postby tilmann » Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:01 pm

ok, we shall see when vantage kites and Bruno have their high pressure kite ready: https://www.vantagekites.com/news/bruno ... s-vantage/ :cool2:

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Re: Inflatable race kites

Postby Matteo V » Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:02 pm

tilmann wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:40 am
james wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:37 am
While there is minimal movement on the boom, the top third of the mast and the leech of the sail are constantly adjusting would you agree?
yes, but as a kiter you don´t need this
While inflatable kites do have a similar property to windsurfing sails "head twist", foil kites do not.

The ability of an inflatable to "cone" changes the shape slightly and makes the foil section somewhat more inefficient (typically, as a particular design could shape to a more efficient foil section if it. This is somewhat synonymous to the twist at the top of the windsurfing sail.

But because of the fully supported (bridle attachment points) underside of a foil kite, a foil kite is more rigid and does not "cone" as an inflatable will. Given this rigidity, trim is essential with foil kites for all of my previously mentioned points in the above post.

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Re: Inflatable race kites

Postby Matteo V » Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:04 pm

tilmann wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:01 pm
ok, we shall see when vantage kites and Bruno have their high pressure kite ready: https://www.vantagekites.com/news/bruno ... s-vantage/ :cool2:
And pretty cool! That could finally eliminate the increased drag of a foil kite section with its additional surface area without additional lifting area. Is it fully supoorted from front to back of the foil section? - I did not see the bridle connections clearly.


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