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Adaption to smaller size kite

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vela99
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Adaption to smaller size kite

Postby vela99 » Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:26 am

Hi,


Fairly recently y bought a 2018 Noth Neo 6m, I already own a 11m and a 8m I have used for some time.

While I remember that I had to adapt somewhat to my 8m, mainly due to faster turning speed, I somehow have the impression that I need more to adapt to the 6m.

To be more precise, on one hand when trying to power up I seemed to oversheet and I also felt that the power on-off was extreme with being very powered at one point in time and none the next moment, particlarly when pointing upwind. The day was gusty but I am not sure that this explains everything.

I fixed the "problem" by pointing less upwind and by being more delicate on the bar letting the kite breath and fly.

Given I use the same bar I use for my 11m but with the narrow setting, I think the bar throw is too long.

How do you adapt to smaller sizes? Are you more careful on the bar or do you actually trim such that you cannot overseet? I know it is not a big issue but I am confined home due to Corona and have not much to do anyway.

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Peter_Frank
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Re: Adaption to smaller size kite

Postby Peter_Frank » Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:48 am

You get used to it over time :thumb:

Trimming so you can not oversheet is not alone difficult, but not good as you will get an odd sheeting distance, compared to your other kites, and you will not be able to use the kite fully if you "close" one end of the sheeting.

But if you only ride very rare with smallish kites, you might not get used to it, and it can be the only solution maybe... :roll:

Easy for me to say you will get used to it, as I ride 3.5 and 5 and 6 m2 very very often, also use same length of bar for these, as for my +12 m2 kites. .

My point is, you can easily get used to it, if you ride now and then.
If rarely, it will take a long time to get used to.

And what you experience is exactly right, as everybody experience first times with small kites.

8) Peter

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Re: Adaption to smaller size kite

Postby iriejohn » Sun Mar 22, 2020 11:00 am

You have to give smaller kites extra time to reach their much higher efficient flying speed.

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Re: Adaption to smaller size kite

Postby Herman » Sun Mar 22, 2020 11:28 am

I don't think there is much of a trick to it, it is just time on water. It is easier to use the full sheeting range of a small kite because it needs less bar throw. Personally I like to have a bit of backstall in the bar sheeting range because it allows you to slow the kite quickly and prevent overflying which generally happens quicker with smaller kites.

However if conditions are difficult, big lulls / washing machine sea state, you are left relying on the bar for balance backstall can become a liability imho. I then trim backstall out of the sheeting range but this is fairly rare.

Having access to backstall makes it easier to pivot loop many kites with little power or do big square loops with power when needed.

Trouble is once you are used to small kites, big kites feel slow and cumbersome. You will soon get used to the small kite, if you fly it enough, but I think it is worthwhile playing with the introduction of backstall once you have become comfortable with it. This is not gospel just my opinion.
Last edited by Herman on Sun Mar 22, 2020 11:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

vela99
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Re: Adaption to smaller size kite

Postby vela99 » Sun Mar 22, 2020 11:37 am

Thanks to you all.

I expect to use it frequently as I live in a windy area. It just has not been very windy this winter.

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Re: Adaption to smaller size kite

Postby Herman » Sun Mar 22, 2020 12:00 pm

Just updated my post regarding difficult conditions, certainly where I ride it tends to be the lulls rather the gusts that screw you up on a small kite. This winter our wind has been very all or nothing and a 6m has been by far my most used kite. It is the light Lully conditions with a messy seastate where I choose to trim out backstall.

You may well be surprised how light you can go with a 6m and bigger board, because the kite is so easy to work and loop. Plus as it is fast you don't need short lines for wave riding. Even at 210lbs I can ride on a 6 at 21knts with a big T T, and the foilers........

Get used to wanging it around as soon as you can, and try looping waterstarts when it's light and you have sea room.

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Re: Adaption to smaller size kite

Postby vela99 » Sun Mar 22, 2020 2:10 pm

Wow, I need to try it in low winds. (I am already quite surprised on how low I can go with my 8m.)

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Re: Adaption to smaller size kite

Postby Matteo V » Sun Mar 22, 2020 2:51 pm

I was always afraid of smaller and smaller kites as I was going down and gaining the experience required to utilize small and fast kites. The key there is the word "afraid". Confidence is everything with a kite, but you can't have the confidence until the instinctual control is there.

As Herman said, you need to get to the point where you can really work the kite. And that means sending it hard through the back of the window even in the gusts. Obviously don't do this right at the beginning, but you will need to eventually master that. And the key to mastery of aggressive kite movements in high wind speeds with small kites is to coordinate the direction you are moving with the movement of the kite. Moving toward the kite will help depower it when looping through the back of the window. Fine-tuning this technique will allow you to send the kite through the back of the window and Edge against it if there isn't as much wind in that gust as you thought.

But everything boils down to instinct turning into reaction time turning into the skill to combine both. So be aggressive, once you have mastered the basics of park-and-ride on small kites. One of the tricks to learning small kite skills is to use too small of a small kite. If it's blowing perfect 7-meter, then go out and try a 6-meter. Given the lower power, you will need to aggressively work that 6 meter. And you can be fairly confident that you won't get yanked too bad, as you are underpowered. This is also a great way to build light wind skill.

Your best practice for this while remaining completely safe, is simulation of small kite turning speed with a trainer kite.

And with the Coronavirus, those of us being responsible and not kiting, can still safely fly a trainer with no risk of injury.

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Re: Adaption to smaller size kite

Postby purdyd » Sun Mar 22, 2020 4:08 pm

You get used to it.

One problem is small kites can often mean gusty conditions, it depends on the location and season.

That’s why you feel the kite is on and off and that the sheeting is different.

But small kites can be flown faster and if you aren’t afraid to move them around can generate more power than you think.

This year I added a 5meter mostly for foiling and it took me about three sessions to get used to it and now my 6meter seems slow.

This is very normal for small kites,

Good luck!

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Re: Adaption to smaller size kite

Postby knotwindy » Sun Mar 22, 2020 4:53 pm

vela99 wrote:
Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:26 am

I fixed the "problem" by pointing less upwind and by being more delicate on the bar letting the kite breath and fly.
Yup, you got it. With a smaller kite there’s is, obviously, less cloth and torque or ‘grunt’ so it is much easier to oversheet. You just don’t feel it as well in the beginning so more delicate on the bar is the answer. Also, the faster you ride the more the apparent wind contributes and the gusts/holes don’t feel as bad so pointing less up is the answer.
Now, it just, as others have said, tow. The more you ride the more ways you will find to keep the kite moving at the right speed and place. A small kite sitting still in the window is just asking for trouble unless you really have a plan for what is next. Kite speed is your friend in the beginning. :thumb:


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