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Surfr. New kitesurf jump app?

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herbertv123
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Re: Surfr. New kitesurf jump app?

Postby herbertv123 » Sat May 16, 2020 5:45 pm

HALF wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 4:19 pm
Woo may not have a "purpose built accelerometer", they are selling very small amount of devices compared to phones so I am pretty sure they use the same components as a mobile phone (and probably an older generation compared to the new phones). The difference is how you use the data you get from it, are you doing a simple low pass filtering or are you implementing some sort of sensor fusion by mixing data from gyroscope, barometer, accelerometer and magnetometer (if available) and later using Kalman filtering to reduce the mean error in the data that you got.

If this app is getting very small variations in the measurements(in different devices) and is also close to the PIQ i suspect both are doing the same type of measurements. And because of that i would trust them much more than WOO.
Indeed. To be clear, I don't use GPS for height, that wouldn't work. We're doing exactly something like described above by HALF, we're fusing accelerometer and gyroscope and use filtering indeed. We have some very interesting test results from comparing Surfr. vs PIQ vs WOO. But I feel it's not up to me to publish about that, maybe later on. The good news is that I already have commitment from independent testers that they will test and publish about Surfr.

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Re: Surfr. New kitesurf jump app?

Postby Matt_TYRCZ » Sat May 16, 2020 6:03 pm

how about Apple Watch or Samsung instead phone ? way smaller

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Re: Surfr. New kitesurf jump app?

Postby aleks » Sat May 16, 2020 6:28 pm

Looks cool! Would be interesting to test if it works on foils too.

The main problem with using phones on water is the readability of the screen, particularly after adding multiple protection layers (waterproof pouch plus board mount). The screen is only visible in direct sight, anything at an angle is next to impossible to read because of the added reflection. For TT it is probably OK, but on hydrofoil you would have to mount your phone outside of the front strap. I tested my app (Woo Screen) with phones - on hydrofoil it is practically impossible to read the screen when it is mounted up front. That is why majority of the people using the app (including myself) prefer a watch. I even tried using both (phone and watch) at the same time - a watch was by far more convenient.

That said, it would be very easy to add watch display functionality to the Surfr app. Hopefully we will see it at some point :thumb:

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Re: Surfr. New kitesurf jump app?

Postby HALF » Sat May 16, 2020 6:32 pm

If it is an open source project i can help with the development of an smartwatch app or other functions.

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Re: Surfr. New kitesurf jump app?

Postby dewwy » Sun May 17, 2020 11:38 am

HALF wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 6:32 pm
If it is an open source project i can help with the development of an smartwatch app or other functions.
Imho there should be something open source, i guess there is a good amount of developers that are kiting and would gladly help make this happen.

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Re: Surfr. New kitesurf jump app?

Postby herbertv123 » Sun May 17, 2020 4:40 pm

HALF wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 6:32 pm
If it is an open source project i can help with the development of an smartwatch app or other functions.
Thanks! Once we have a stable first version out, up & running we definitely would appreciate any help as long as it fit's the vision for the app. And a smartwatch app is sure part of that vision.

I don't think I will publish the sources though, I consider the sensor fusion algorithm Surfr.s main IP. But that doesn't mean that you won't be able to help. It would only take a small NDA then and everybody who is willing to help could potentially join.

I won't forget about your offer, and will definitely come back to you, once everything is up and running.

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Re: Surfr. New kitesurf jump app?

Postby kjorn » Sun May 17, 2020 7:46 pm

we wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 3:59 pm
It will be interesting how accurate this is for jumps. A WOO with a purpose built accelerometer should be a lot more accurate than the built in accelerometer in a phone. My experience is the GPS in a phone (both Apple and Samsung) is very inaccurate versus a specialized GPS. With that said, this should be really cool if it works and I could see a lot of benefits having a phone with you for safety.
New phones will have GOS and GNSS which is cm level accuracy.
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Re: Surfr. New kitesurf jump app?

Postby kjorn » Sun May 17, 2020 7:54 pm

herbertv123 wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 4:40 pm
HALF wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 6:32 pm
If it is an open source project i can help with the development of an smartwatch app or other functions.
Thanks! Once we have a stable first version out, up & running we definitely would appreciate any help as long as it fit's the vision for the app. And a smartwatch app is sure part of that vision.

I don't think I will publish the sources though, I consider the sensor fusion algorithm Surfr.s main IP. But that doesn't mean that you won't be able to help. It would only take a small NDA then and everybody who is willing to help could potentially join.

I won't forget about your offer, and will definitely come back to you, once everything is up and running.
Maybe open source the app. Have coders agree to not change where the data is sent. Then we all pay to have access to leaderboards and emails etc. You control the data and back end. I'd be super happy to pay a monthly subscription to access leaderboards :D

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Re: Surfr. New kitesurf jump app?

Postby mkNY » Mon May 18, 2020 12:37 am

Social aspect should not be underestimated here. All my friends are already on WOO. Unless you find a way to merge leaderboards with WOO it will be very lonely to be the only person on your local leaderboards.

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Re: Surfr. New kitesurf jump app?

Postby Blackened » Mon May 18, 2020 1:24 am

mkNY wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 12:37 am
Social aspect should not be underestimated here. All my friends are already on WOO. Unless you find a way to merge leaderboards with WOO it will be very lonely to be the only person on your local leaderboards.
I doubt merging leaderboards is something that either party would be interested as it's against their separate interests. However, I do agree that having a social aspect is the way going forward. People seem to like that sort of carry-on.

As long as the case is relatively cheap and foolproof, most people have a smartphone they can use. I can even get a brand new craptastic one for about $80 (in case I was paranoid about water escapades) where a new Woo here is $400. It would even auto-update rather than needing to connect/load after even session. And think of the live aspect and GPS usage this could give for KOTA or other comps.

This would also be the perfect fit as I've wanted to take my phone out for ages. I could call someone if I got stranded, bring out some bluetooth headphones, take basic video, record GPS, etc. People will eventually gravitate towards this platform over a Woo because of the sheer functionality a phone offers. Unless Woo brings out another device with more/connected functionality, this app (or another app) will dominate it. And people will replace one social media with another if works. If I were Woo, I would've been working on this ages ago or already looking at buying it out to incorporate it into their model.


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