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Ram air first session damage

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airsail
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Re: Ram air first session damage

Postby airsail » Thu Jul 23, 2020 8:53 am

With the huge uptake of light wind foiling, pumpy will have his work cut out for him 😀, welcome back
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Re: Ram air first session damage

Postby cor » Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:42 am

Kitetwin-1 wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:47 am
We missed you pumpy
"we"? Speak for yourself. It was fun a few times he copy-pasted that nonsense. Now it´s just annoying.

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Re: Ram air first session damage

Postby Janus » Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:58 am

cor wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:42 am
Kitetwin-1 wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:47 am
We missed you pumpy
"we"? Speak for yourself. It was fun a few times he copy-pasted that nonsense. Now it´s just annoying.
I agree it gets very annoying, posting the same shit all over again, copy pasting misery.. isn’t there a forum rule or etiquette Toby?..

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Re: Ram air first session damage

Postby Bille » Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:19 pm

At nayy :

Go ask Pump me up , WHY is it, that he is NOT allowed
on the , (Foil Kites) forum, here on KF !! Go ahead ; Ask him!! :lol:

Next time you have a question regarding a kite that doesn't
have a bladder , and doesn't need a pump to use ; ask it on
the kiteforum sub forum section here :

viewforum.php?f=197

Adventure Logs wrote:
Wed Jul 22, 2020 10:58 pm
...

...(please don’t call them ram airs). ...
nayy may not be familiar with the terminology ; so a bit of background :

Foil kites are soft kites based on the design of the parafoil ; it's the valve
on the front or Leading Edge where the air goes in ; that is called the ram-air
inlets :
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arc_kite

I learned to kiteboard, on a Peter Lynn Gorilla , in 2003 ; even
back then, they were referred to as Foil-kites :

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foil_kite

Bille
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Re: Ram air first session damage

Postby Peter_Frank » Fri Jul 24, 2020 12:54 am

If your lines was tangled, as you said (kite was, same thing), and you pull the bar, or roll the bar up and pull even a few meters, when water inside, it seems ALL load was on this very connection point, so it ripped apart.

Bad luck, as usually load is spread over many connection points yes, but if tangled "unlucky" so stress is on one single point, load from either the wind when pulling and trying to relaunch, or from packing up where you roll and pull the lines, can be the cause.

Bugger, but get it fixed, will most likely never happen again, for many reasons :naughty:

8) Peter
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Re: Ram air first session damage

Postby Carlos_C » Fri Jul 24, 2020 8:55 am

the beauty of foil kites is that even in the most isolated of places - a needle and thread and some spinnaker tape can fix most damage and get you going again quickly

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Re: Ram air first session damage

Postby TheRussian » Fri Jul 24, 2020 9:22 am

My first foil session did not result in any damage, but wind dropped, forcing a swim in and an ungodly tangled bridle.

I vowed never to use a foil kite again & swapped it over for a one-strut Alpha - which has similar performance (not quite) in light winds, but no tangles and it doesn't partially sink !
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Re: Ram air first session damage

Postby mgs » Fri Jul 24, 2020 9:49 am

Agree with that analysis.(@Peter_Frank) This is an unfortunate incident that wouldn’t be covered under this particular manufacturer’s warranty.
I have witnessed a tube kite explode on impact when flown into the water where the kitesurfer in my opinion had ample time to steer the kite out of the dive but didn’t.
Over the years I have wiped out many times, but I do my absolute best to think about the kite and keep it in the air despite it being water re-launchable.
Last edited by mgs on Fri Jul 24, 2020 10:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Ram air first session damage

Postby Foil » Fri Jul 24, 2020 10:48 am

TheRussian wrote:
Fri Jul 24, 2020 9:22 am
My first foil session did not result in any damage, but wind dropped, forcing a swim in and an ungodly tangled bridle.

I vowed never to use a foil kite again & swapped it over for a one-strut Alpha - which has similar performance (not quite) in light winds, but no tangles and it doesn't partially sink !
wow! that made me think, and post back my thoughts,
Yes the foil kite experience can at first be very scary, and disasters can happen in many ways to the new foil kite user, that's just the way it is, however you can mitigate the early days of foil kite ownership, and this should be done to understand the many downsides of foil ownership and how to manage them to get the rewards on offer when more confident, more skilled, more knowledgeable, and more at one with your foil kite.
the rewards are definitely there, and well worth harnessing if your willing to take the early knocks in confidence,
I am of course referring to foil kite use on a foil board, as for use on a Ttip,well then this becomes more questionable, and not the choice of kite i would go for for general use on a Ttip,
I have done, but only as a light wind anti frustration tool to get me on the water, but it never really worked well enough, and the cost was off the scale as the supersize foils were needed for the ttip,
and then these monsters were next to useless as the wind picked up, and in no way fun, (well not for me at anyways) just try to loop one of those monsters.
however for foiling then the little foil kites(9mtr and under) are simply amazing, the little low aspect ones relaunch so easily, and if you do have to roll one up in the water then they are easy, ok the big ones are less easy, and less fun, but "kite down" time after learning how to relaunch is hardly ever a problem,
and in super light wind a foil kite is the only kite able to easily relaunch, the Alpha mentioned above is very good if not the best lei at light water relaunch but it stays down in winds most modern foil kites will find easy to get flying in again,
The Alpha will not jump, I know I owned 3 of them, and small foils are much more fun to use, amazingly quick, snappy pivot tuns, minimal slack line situations, so so easy to body drag out in onshore winds and against shore break that "slack line" any LEI, light wind boosting that is really unbelievable,remembering of course that a foil kite made from ULight material will resist falling from the sky, my Hl foils hover, in steady winds will hover for ages without bar input,just stays up there, I do need to either just steer it into the water or end up doing something very silly to get one of these super light low aspect kites to fall.
as an example i was using my 7mtr foil yesterday in rain of biblical intensity, all the windsurfers and ttips went ashore and took cover, I opted to stay out as landing on wet sand was not a great option, it rained heavily non stop for an hour, the kite just kept looping, and having as much fun as me, so that dispelled rumours that foil kites are useless in rain, a tiny tad slower due to added weight but still great to use,
so no, for me the alpha will never get back onto my christmas list,
get the right foils and get a bit of user practice in easy conditions, and you would never say the Alpha is a better kite for a user with fairly good foil kite skills,
however the foil kite is not a great tool to use when learning foil boarding, that fact I would say is a point worth making,newbies crash in so many weird and wonderful ways all the time, spending more time splashing around than up and blasting around.

On a side note- the tangled bridle situation can be a big put off, however there are now bridals that resist that sticky awful rats nest of tangled mess, they are the bridle lines with the smooth slippy feeling outer braiding, not the very thin hairy type which are commonly found on older design kites, or lower price point kites, or budget kites, and if this type of kite has the super long and complicated bridle system then the frustration of a tangle can be much worse than just bad.

good (more expensive) "slippy" bridal lines of the smooth surface variety generally just shake free, with a little teasing if needed.
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Re: Ram air first session damage

Postby Peter_Frank » Sat Jul 25, 2020 9:45 pm

It is always extremely individual.

Agree with Foil, that the first time experiences can be "hard", if you get some bad experiences.

I ride with "everything", but have a different view.

For kitefoiling in waves, when wind is above 12 knots, I use solely single skin foil kites 5 and 4 and 3 m2, nothing beats these in terms of drift and instant depower and turning on a dime.
And WAY faster to rig and pack down, and you save a lot of unnecessary walks with the pump :thumb:

In lighter winds I definitely prefer tube kites (light ones), as for me, they are simply better in every way.
They turn so much faster than any similar powered foil kite, and got a good smooth pull when carving in really light winds.

Only when truly marginal winds, under 7 knots, I need and use a UL foilkite.

Not liking it, but loving it because I can go out in 5-7 knots now.

Some love the aspects of foil kites, others dont.

Relaunch and handling and tangles etc. are not something to worry about, you will learn to manage (with foil kites).

It is simply how they behave in the air, that is an individual choice - and for most it takes forever to find out what they like the most.

Just a slightly opposite view than some :wink:

8) Peter
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