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question for ex-Wainman kite riders

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jkrug
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question for ex-Wainman kite riders

Postby jkrug » Tue Sep 22, 2020 12:23 pm

i am an ex-Wainman kite rider myself, and have never found a kite i like as much as the old rabbits. the more i test different kites, the more i feel kites are getting worse, not better, over time. or maybe i'm just getting fussier in my old age. anyway, have any of you found a kite that you feel mimics the old rabbits pretty well? you know, delta shaped, great all-around kite, fast/turns very well, lighter bar pressure, good for surfing, foiling, and even jumping, never deforms in the air (a problem i find with most newer kites). yes, i know the rabbits didn't go upwind well. i did, and can, live with that. please, only reply if you were a Wainman kite rider at one time, i.e., i don't want this to be just another 'my current kite is the best' thread.

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Re: question for ex-Wainman kite riders

Postby PeaBody » Tue Sep 22, 2020 1:04 pm

Loved the Wainman, especially the smoke.. for me the boss didnt perform so well but they were a great upgrade at the time from Flexifoil atoms!

I had the Airush Wave 2014 but it wasn't quite the same feeling (although still a do it all kite,well the v1 certainly was), but I recently changed to the Airush Lithium (v11).... has very light bar pressure but enough to know where it is, I use them for TT, surfing and foiling cant fault them for an all-round kite.

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Re: question for ex-Wainman kite riders

Postby Gonzavala » Tue Sep 22, 2020 1:34 pm

Funny, I still use the Rabbits and since they are 10 years old was thinking it was time for a change. Guessing they might be lacking in jumping performance compared to newer/more specialized kites?

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Re: question for ex-Wainman kite riders

Postby nherbold » Tue Sep 22, 2020 1:49 pm

Love my Wainman kites and happy to still have a few.
When I have to buy a new kite I am going to try the ON kiteboarding, Lou's new brand. The kites look similar and pretty sure the quality will be good too.

I tried the Bandits and they are OK, but not nearly as good unhooked (in my opinion)

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Re: question for ex-Wainman kite riders

Postby salvino » Tue Sep 22, 2020 2:04 pm

I loved my rabbits and they’re flying. Did not like dark colors cause of heat issues. I moved to red religions next and loved those but lacked overhead lift to assist in moves. Then moved on to Neos and have been consistently impressed with they’re reliable precision. Seems to be the best of my experiences. And I did digress to clouds for past year, and now returned to Neos

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Re: question for ex-Wainman kite riders

Postby jkrug » Tue Sep 22, 2020 4:11 pm

i thought about ON kiteboarding kites, as they do seem to have that Wainman-look, though I'm not sure Lou is actually involved (not that that really matters). but you just never hear anything about them. not sure they're long for the world.

As for the NEO's, I don't understand why people like those kites. They feel like Switchblades to me...lots of grunt you cannot turn off, and miserably slow turning.

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Re: question for ex-Wainman kite riders

Postby Surfkiternew » Tue Sep 22, 2020 4:38 pm

9 and smaller was very good...bigger terrible....modern kite i likes more for sure...any brand i test last few years was Better than wainman...but u can still find used if u like more .and very cheap too

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Re: question for ex-Wainman kite riders

Postby Matteo V » Tue Sep 22, 2020 5:24 pm

jkrug wrote:
Tue Sep 22, 2020 12:23 pm
i am an ex-Wainman kite rider myself, and have never found a kite i like as much as the old rabbits. the more i test different kites, the more i feel kites are getting worse, not better, over time....
Many of us who have held on to older designs, long after they were surpassed in performance, are having the same problem that you are.

The short explanation of these issues is that no one really spends enough time on a kite that they demo, to get an actual feel for the kite. This is especially pronounced when coming from older kites that don't have the wide range of capabilities of newer kites.

At the same time, the full explanation is much more complicated. Newer kites can be somewhat seen as being dumbed down from the perspective of a vintage kite flyer. Many newer kites have quicker dbpower, and better turning without having to fully sheet the bar in. If you apply your old sheeting and turning methods to new kites, you often wind up ruining the potential for extra performance from those newer kites. And even knowing this, it is extremely difficult for me to apply that concept and just stop using the same inputs that I would have used on my vintage kites. When I finally purchased a modern kite, it took me some time before I started to understand it. And switching back and forth does throw me off a little bit too.

Of course you also have to add to the above, that when you're flying older gear, or at least when you get to the point that you have to buy newer gear because your old stuff is deteriorating, you're comparing an old style unrefined and blown out canopy kite, to a new crispy modern kite. That is comparing apples to oranges, and you can't expect that experience to be objective.



So when moving to another brand, do your research and take your best guess at what is a good replacement for what you have been flying. But don't get frustrated and bail out of that new model/brand! That frustration is mostly because of the above reasons, and you can with some adjustment, make newer modern kites do just as much as the old ones and likely even more.

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Re: question for ex-Wainman kite riders

Postby kobajagrande » Tue Sep 22, 2020 6:09 pm

Ex-wainman rider here mostly strapless on a surfboard, gypsy 6.25 favorite kite, had also mr green 7.5 and a smoke 9m when used the twin tip.
The closest I found to wainman are the North Carve and F-one Bandit. Try them if you can.
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jkrug
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Re: question for ex-Wainman kite riders

Postby jkrug » Tue Sep 22, 2020 7:34 pm

Matteo V wrote:
Tue Sep 22, 2020 5:24 pm
jkrug wrote:
Tue Sep 22, 2020 12:23 pm
i am an ex-Wainman kite rider myself, and have never found a kite i like as much as the old rabbits. the more i test different kites, the more i feel kites are getting worse, not better, over time....
Many of us who have held on to older designs, long after they were surpassed in performance, are having the same problem that you are.

The short explanation of these issues is that no one really spends enough time on a kite that they demo, to get an actual feel for the kite. This is especially pronounced when coming from older kites that don't have the wide range of capabilities of newer kites.

At the same time, the full explanation is much more complicated. Newer kites can be somewhat seen as being dumbed down from the perspective of a vintage kite flyer. Many newer kites have quicker dbpower, and better turning without having to fully sheet the bar in. If you apply your old sheeting and turning methods to new kites, you often wind up ruining the potential for extra performance from those newer kites. And even knowing this, it is extremely difficult for me to apply that concept and just stop using the same inputs that I would have used on my vintage kites. When I finally purchased a modern kite, it took me some time before I started to understand it. And switching back and forth does throw me off a little bit too.

Of course you also have to add to the above, that when you're flying older gear, or at least when you get to the point that you have to buy newer gear because your old stuff is deteriorating, you're comparing an old style unrefined and blown out canopy kite, to a new crispy modern kite. That is comparing apples to oranges, and you can't expect that experience to be objective.



So when moving to another brand, do your research and take your best guess at what is a good replacement for what you have been flying. But don't get frustrated and bail out of that new model/brand! That frustration is mostly because of the above reasons, and you can with some adjustment, make newer modern kites do just as much as the old ones and likely even more.
the last of my Wainman's hit the trash several years ago, so this is not me having trouble transitioning now. I've been on different kites for many years now. i just haven't found any i like as much since. when i rode Wainman's, that's all i rode. i was content and didn't look for other brands. it'd just be nice to find a replacement i felt so dedicated to. obviously, i haven't yet.


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