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Neo 2018 5m back stalling badly

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ichabod
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Neo 2018 5m back stalling badly

Postby ichabod » Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:19 am

This is a strange one but wondering if anyone else had noticed a problem with this kite (or any older models), it may be limited to the smaller sizes. We have two of these kites and both exhibit the same problem. We have tried multiple bars and all of the various front and back line settings with no luck. Basically the kite back stalls horrendously if sheeted more than about half way in. Strangely even with a lot of depower trim it still occurs at about 2/3 full sheeted in. The obvious answer would be that the line lengths need adjusting but this would need to be a huge adjustment to correct this. It also feels like the sweet spot between being undersheeted and oversheeted is very small so I'm not sure that shortening the front lines is the solution. We've tried the kite on 4 line bars from 2016 and a newer one with the same split point as the click bar. We've checked the line lengths on the bars and they are correct. The bars also work fine on all other kites including a newer 4m Neo.

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Re: Neo 2018 5m back stalling badly

Postby Herman » Thu Oct 29, 2020 10:47 am

Please forgive me if I have got this wrong but your post just sounds like an inexperienced guy describing a small kite. What you describe as a problem is in fact the joy of flying a small kite. You have quick access to there full sheeting range because it is small, you can quickly check there speed or reposition with backstall and because they are small their recovery from backstall is almost immediate whooopeee if you know how to use it. This all assumes they are property powered.

If underpowered you can still use the same characteristics but you have to be much more delicate and if the sea state is awkward and you are underpowered it may be better to use a longer rear pig to eradicate most of the backstall.

In 30knts you would need a lot of muscle to access the backstall and accidental oversteering is not a problem. I don't know the neo but I would expect a small wave kite to backstall.

Regards Herman

PS Try thinking of feeling rear line tension rather than just pulling the bar in for sheeting control. If underpowered you will need a lot of active flying and looping. If you want park and ride consider higher aspect kites.
Last edited by Herman on Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ichabod
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Re: Neo 2018 5m back stalling badly

Postby ichabod » Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:03 am

We are experienced kiters and as noted the 4m Neo 2019 does not seem to exhibit this issue. Likewise various other small kites I have flown. I'd assume that the kite is designed not to oversheet - at least not too badly - on an out of the box North bar. We've tried in under and over powered conditions with similar results.

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Re: Neo 2018 5m back stalling badly

Postby Herman » Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:25 am

Apologies, I did not pick up on the comparison with the 4m. If you can readily make the 5m backstall in overpowered conditions that would be disconcerting to say the least.

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Re: Neo 2018 5m back stalling badly

Postby omg » Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:39 am

I have 2018 6m Neo, and no bad habits at all. If the lines are ok with your bar (back line versus front lines) then what your 5m kite does sounds really weird :/

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Re: Neo 2018 5m back stalling badly

Postby ichabod » Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:32 pm

Yeah I can't get my head around it - it is the same on two identical kites and on multiple bars

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Re: Neo 2018 5m back stalling badly

Postby Pierrot » Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:36 pm

I have Neo 5m 2018. It flies just fine.
For sure you can’t fly it like a 10m... but i have used it In strong wind where it is pretty much plug and play... and on foil in « light wind » (~20knt) where you need to fly it more carefully not to backstall it.

Check the bridles maybe...

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Re: Neo 2018 5m back stalling badly

Postby ichabod » Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:42 pm

Pierrot wrote:
Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:36 pm
I have Neo 5m 2018. It flies just fine.
For sure you can’t fly it like a 10m... but i have used it In strong wind where it is pretty much plug and play... and on foil in « light wind » (~20knt) where you need to fly it more carefully not to backstall it.

Check the bridles maybe...
That's really interesting, so you've noticed no backstall even at full sheet? Both kites are barely used so unlikely to be stretched or damaged.. a systematic manufacturing defect also seems unlikely. We've tried them on both front bridle settings - i.e the yellow/black/blue adjustment. I'm not sure what else to check on the bridles other than to try and measure all parts of them accurately and compare to another kite.

Out of interest, what bar are you using? The only other variable that comes to mind is the split point. hard to believe it would have such a drastic effect on a small kite though.

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Re: Neo 2018 5m back stalling badly

Postby Exal » Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:46 pm

Might sound stupid but did you connect it to the correct knot where it says 4 line or 5 line? I remember when I started kiting and connected to the 5 line knot with a 4 line bar the kite was dropping on me like crazy, was a 6m 2018 neo, the wind was relatively light tho.

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Re: Neo 2018 5m back stalling badly

Postby ichabod » Thu Oct 29, 2020 1:01 pm

Exal wrote:
Thu Oct 29, 2020 12:46 pm
Might sound stupid but did you connect it to the correct knot where it says 4 line or 5 line? I remember when I started kiting and connected to the 5 line knot with a 4 line bar the kite was dropping on me like crazy, was a 6m 2018 neo, the wind was relatively light tho.
I've tried it on both, the knots are only a few cm apart though so it should only account for a small amount of oversheet - I'm seeing more like 20 or 30cm


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