Contact   Imprint   Advertising   Guidelines

New set: XR/GTS or Rebel/Dice

Forum for kitesurfers
Kerplow
Medium Poster
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2020 9:27 am
Kiting since: 2010
Weight: 67 Kg
Local Beach: EU
Style: Allrounder
Gear: Looking for a new quiver
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 23 times

New set: XR/GTS or Rebel/Dice

Postby Kerplow » Thu Nov 05, 2020 3:03 pm

Hi guys, I need your opinion on choosing new set for me and my gf. I have tested some of them, but I lack information on few touchpoints.

Me and my girlfriend are mid level riders, with 7-9 years of experience. We usually have 4-5 kites and two bars set. We had dice's for almost 5 years, but last season I decided to go more into big air on strong winds and unhook/freestyle on light winds (my gf's preference). So the 6-8-10 will be either Rebels or XR's and for 11-13 Dices or GTS's (70kg and 50kg).
I could go with Duotone again, but I have doubts on Rebels. I demoed 2019 13m and 11m rebels and I hated them - very slow, like tractor and not fun at all. Although, my friend let me test his 2017 or 2018 North Rebel 12m (the one without pulleys) and it was amazing - fast, responsive and does what rebel suppose to do.
Had a chance to demo 9m XR6 - it was instant love story, but can't really compare to all Rebels I tested, because it was smaller size.
Another thing that drew my attention - quality. It seems like Core is perfect on every single drop of glue. As a long term North/Duotone owner I newer really complained about Duotone's quality, but I can't see that perfectionism, as I can see on Core kites.

Did you guys have tested the new 2021 rebel? Is it similar to 2019 year or is it much more lively, responsive, like old North's? I know, that they "officially" say that new Rebel is more agile and responsive, but I still worried about them having those pulleys.

Another question - are GTS's similar to Dices? Or should I expect something different from them. Those would be more for light wind conditions for unhook sessions. We are not into looping yet, if I will consider one day to go for it, I just buy a 9/8m GTS/Dice on top.

I'm leaning to Core side, but there are other factors to consider like price, XR7 coming out on August (waiting times to be out), etc.

Please, everyone who tested these toys - drop me your opinion.

P.s.: All content on Youtube, Google, this forum is absorbed already :D

Thanks in advance!

Blackened
Frequent Poster
Posts: 325
Joined: Fri May 04, 2018 4:47 am
Kiting since: 2012
Style: Big Air, Airstyle
Gear: 2020 Rebels
2020 Orbits
Has thanked: 24 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: New set: XR/GTS or Rebel/Dice

Postby Blackened » Fri Nov 06, 2020 1:54 am

Kerplow wrote:
Thu Nov 05, 2020 3:03 pm
I could go with Duotone again, but I have doubts on Rebels. I demoed 2019 13m and 11m rebels and I hated them - very slow, like tractor and not fun at all. Although, my friend let me test his 2017 or 2018 North Rebel 12m (the one without pulleys) and it was amazing - fast, responsive and does what rebel suppose to do.

Did you guys have tested the new 2021 rebel? Is it similar to 2019 year or is it much more lively, responsive, like old North's? I know, that they "officially" say that new Rebel is more agile and responsive, but I still worried about them having those pulleys.
The big Rebels are very different than the smaller ones. For the use case you mentioned, you'll need to demo those to get a better idea on their qualities. But yes, the big Rebels are slow and tractorish. It's why my big kites are Rebels :). I suspect the Rebel you tested was a 5-line 2017. The 2018+ are 4 lines and have a completely different feel than the old 5-lines. I didn't like my 2019 8m, but that's because it stalled in loops and I don't like pain. Pure boosting was fun though. I haven't tried the 2021, but the 2020 is different than the 2019. In reality, they aren't pulleys as the slider just sits against the stopper all the time. While my old Evo bridles were quite worn from movement, my Rebels don't have much wear. For the small kites, I don't think they really need to be any quicker for boosting.

Overall, they're extremely similar kites. The XR probably has better feel and slightly quicker turning, while the Rebel has slightly more hangtime (although, in the smaller kites this equates to about 0.05s). If you love the XR, then go with the XR. Don't wait for next year to get the XR7. Get the XR6 now. I think the bars are interchangeable, so if you want to stick with the Dice and go XR, then the Duotone bar should work on the Core. If I'm wrong, someone will correct me very quickly... If you're looking to get into looping, these aren't the best kites to start with, but I'd definitely pick the XR over the Rebel for learning loops (pre-2020 anyway).

As for GTS/Dice, I don't have any experience with the GTS and don't unhook, so I'm no help whatsoever.




Lets see how long it takes for someone to pop in something about Eleveight/Naish/theirfavouritebrand that wasn't asked about.
These users thanked the author Blackened for the post (total 2):
Kerplow (Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:07 am) • Leon van Bergen (Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:19 am)
Rating: 13.33%

Leon van Bergen
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 683
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2018 8:25 am
Kiting since: 2016
Local Beach: Wijk aan Zee, Netherlands
Gear: Duotone 21' Rebel 7M, 9m & 11m, 15m Juice, on a Lieuwe Shotgun
Location: Netherlands
Has thanked: 497 times
Been thanked: 142 times

Re: New set: XR/GTS or Rebel/Dice

Postby Leon van Bergen » Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:19 am

'' Lets see how long it takes for someone to pop in something about Eleveight/Naish/theirfavouritebrand that wasn't asked about.''

:lol: :thumb: :lol: :thumb: :lol: :thumb: :lol:

Kerplow
Medium Poster
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2020 9:27 am
Kiting since: 2010
Weight: 67 Kg
Local Beach: EU
Style: Allrounder
Gear: Looking for a new quiver
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 23 times

Re: New set: XR/GTS or Rebel/Dice

Postby Kerplow » Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:36 am

Blackened wrote:
Fri Nov 06, 2020 1:54 am
Kerplow wrote:
Thu Nov 05, 2020 3:03 pm
I could go with Duotone again, but I have doubts on Rebels. I demoed 2019 13m and 11m rebels and I hated them - very slow, like tractor and not fun at all. Although, my friend let me test his 2017 or 2018 North Rebel 12m (the one without pulleys) and it was amazing - fast, responsive and does what rebel suppose to do.

Did you guys have tested the new 2021 rebel? Is it similar to 2019 year or is it much more lively, responsive, like old North's? I know, that they "officially" say that new Rebel is more agile and responsive, but I still worried about them having those pulleys.
The big Rebels are very different than the smaller ones. For the use case you mentioned, you'll need to demo those to get a better idea on their qualities. But yes, the big Rebels are slow and tractorish. It's why my big kites are Rebels :). I suspect the Rebel you tested was a 5-line 2017. The 2018+ are 4 lines and have a completely different feel than the old 5-lines. I didn't like my 2019 8m, but that's because it stalled in loops and I don't like pain. Pure boosting was fun though. I haven't tried the 2021, but the 2020 is different than the 2019. In reality, they aren't pulleys as the slider just sits against the stopper all the time. While my old Evo bridles were quite worn from movement, my Rebels don't have much wear. For the small kites, I don't think they really need to be any quicker for boosting.

Overall, they're extremely similar kites. The XR probably has better feel and slightly quicker turning, while the Rebel has slightly more hangtime (although, in the smaller kites this equates to about 0.05s). If you love the XR, then go with the XR. Don't wait for next year to get the XR7. Get the XR6 now. I think the bars are interchangeable, so if you want to stick with the Dice and go XR, then the Duotone bar should work on the Core. If I'm wrong, someone will correct me very quickly... If you're looking to get into looping, these aren't the best kites to start with, but I'd definitely pick the XR over the Rebel for learning loops (pre-2020 anyway).

As for GTS/Dice, I don't have any experience with the GTS and don't unhook, so I'm no help whatsoever.




Lets see how long it takes for someone to pop in something about Eleveight/Naish/theirfavouritebrand that wasn't asked about.
Thanks for you reply!

Yah, it was a 5-line and I really liked it. I have read about that stopper, but you know, there is so much BS on "what's new this year" that I stopped reading their official descriptions.
Actually my 2019 6m is a Rebel and its fine, but at this size probably all of the kites would be quick enough :)

On the XR's its exactly why I liked it - more turning speed and better bar feel.

Not sure about looping with XR's. My friend, she is a Core rider (1st female in WOO big air rankings overall), told me that if you want to loop XR you need to go really big, as kite does not catch you so fast as GTS does. But again, the power of yank you get from GTS during the loop is much greater than XRs, so its less comfortable to learn it.

Yah about other brands - go ahead, I don't mind. Although, I probably will stay on these two, because of availability, discounts, etc.

Did demoed North Orbit 2020 12m. Fun kite, but what I did not like it's bar pressure. It was so light (even on medium settings), that few times I needed to doublecheck with my eyes, where the kite was :D
Missed a demo day on Eleveights, but as it' s (and other new brands) newish brand on the market, it's value wont last so much in second hand market as those two above. I know its funny to consider that, but cmon, i'm taking about ~9k eur set.

User avatar
McLovin
Rare Poster
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2020 10:52 pm
Kiting since: 2017
Weight: 275
Local Beach: The Columbia River Gorge
Favorite Beaches: Rufus & Rooster
Style: Mostly TT and some SB not FOILING YET
Gear: 2017 N Rebels, 2021 OR Flite 14.5 ALUULA - North Trust Bars SK99 Lines, CARVE Imperator 5 151cm TT and Crazy Fly Raptor 140cm Neon TT
Brand Affiliation: Just stuff I like...
Has thanked: 15 times
Been thanked: 19 times

Re: New set: XR/GTS or Rebel/Dice

Postby McLovin » Fri Nov 06, 2020 9:37 am

'hey Kerplow,

3rd party info but for what it's worth... As a Rebel user still currently on the 2017's which are awesome - I'm always following the buzz.

According to a DT team rider - he reports that the 2021 Rebel rides and feels like the old - (aka 2017 and prior) years more so than the intervening years. It may be true or it's just smart marketing talk - but it was an unfiltered comment.

That said, 2022 might be a better vintage if the Rebel gets an SLS face lift and one more year to get it right...if you can wait.

Otherwise, there is nothing wrong with the XR's from it's many fans...

Try then BUY if you can...

Mc

:dance:
These users thanked the author McLovin for the post:
Kerplow (Fri Nov 06, 2020 9:48 am)
Rating: 6.67%

Kerplow
Medium Poster
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2020 9:27 am
Kiting since: 2010
Weight: 67 Kg
Local Beach: EU
Style: Allrounder
Gear: Looking for a new quiver
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 45 times
Been thanked: 23 times

Re: New set: XR/GTS or Rebel/Dice

Postby Kerplow » Fri Nov 06, 2020 9:51 am

McLovin wrote:
Fri Nov 06, 2020 9:37 am
'hey Kerplow,

3rd party info but for what it's worth... As a Rebel user still currently on the 2017's which are awesome - I'm always following the buzz.

According to a DT team rider - he reports that the 2021 Rebel rides and feels like the old - (aka 2017 and prior) years more so than the intervening years. It may be true or it's just smart marketing talk - but it was an unfiltered comment.

That said, 2022 might be a better vintage if the Rebel gets an SLS face lift and one more year to get it right...if you can wait.

Otherwise, there is nothing wrong with the XR's from it's many fans...

Try then BUY if you can...

Mc

:dance:
Thanks,

And one of the additional reasons I'm leaning towards Core is exactly this - Next year they will announce both Dice's and Rebel's as SLS. I can't wait a year, as I already sold our old set :)

Cheers

User avatar
TheRussian
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2140
Joined: Fri Dec 27, 2002 1:00 am
Kiting since: 1999
Local Beach: Hayling Island
Favorite Beaches: One eye, Sidi Kaouki, Big Bay, Gwithian & Hayling
Style: Powered
Gear: Reedins & Surfboards (Cabrinha's & Naish), Nomad/TAD Mutants, Flash 4'10 & Naish Pro 4'10, & Moses Hydrofoil
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 25 times
Been thanked: 45 times

Re: New set: XR/GTS or Rebel/Dice

Postby TheRussian » Fri Nov 06, 2020 10:02 am

+1 There’s little substitute to try before you buy - ps a new XR is due in June.
These users thanked the author TheRussian for the post:
Kerplow (Fri Nov 06, 2020 10:24 am)
Rating: 6.67%

User avatar
MattyM
Medium Poster
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Apr 07, 2014 5:29 pm
Gear: Core, F-One, Moses
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 8 times
Been thanked: 17 times
Contact:

Re: New set: XR/GTS or Rebel/Dice

Postby MattyM » Fri Nov 06, 2020 10:10 am

My wife and I used to have XRs in smaller sizes and GTSs in larger. Since we tried the Nexus we've switched over to them completely. Sooooooooo nice! You instantly feel like a better kiter with it. I foil as well now though, and the Nexus is lovely for foiling. (XR is lousy for foiling - too heavy and grunty.)

The GTS 4 was a more all round 3 strutter, the GTS is now (5, 6) very much a hard core looping machine. The Nexus has taken it's place in the all round 3 strut category.

Personally, I've jumped higher with the Nexus than I ever did with the XR when really lit, but of course they lack the hangtime/glide of a 5 strut kite.

If you're set on the XR, waiting for August is largely pointless unless you simply want the latest version, as the XR is so refined now it's hard to see how they could improve it noticeably. You get to a certain point with kite refinement when series changes are more about 'balance of characteristics' rather than 'overall improvement', and you never know if that change is going to suit your style of riding or not.
These users thanked the author MattyM for the post:
Kerplow (Fri Nov 06, 2020 11:32 am)
Rating: 6.67%

Blackened
Frequent Poster
Posts: 325
Joined: Fri May 04, 2018 4:47 am
Kiting since: 2012
Style: Big Air, Airstyle
Gear: 2020 Rebels
2020 Orbits
Has thanked: 24 times
Been thanked: 82 times

Re: New set: XR/GTS or Rebel/Dice

Postby Blackened » Fri Nov 06, 2020 11:38 am

Kerplow wrote:
Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:36 am

Not sure about looping with XR's. My friend, she is a Core rider (1st female in WOO big air rankings overall), told me that if you want to loop XR you need to go really big, as kite does not catch you so fast as GTS does. But again, the power of yank you get from GTS during the loop is much greater than XRs, so its less comfortable to learn it.

Yah about other brands - go ahead, I don't mind. Although, I probably will stay on these two, because of availability, discounts, etc.

Did demoed North Orbit 2020 12m. Fun kite, but what I did not like it's bar pressure. It was so light (even on medium settings), that few times I needed to doublecheck with my eyes, where the kite was :D
Missed a demo day on Eleveights, but as it' s (and other new brands) newish brand on the market, it's value wont last so much in second hand market as those two above. I know its funny to consider that, but cmon, i'm taking about ~9k eur set.
I wouldn't want to learn to loop on an XR/Rebel either :P. Staying with Core/Duotone, the Nexus and Evo are great loopers to learn on. They won't jump quite as high as easily though. For your weights, the 3v5 struts won't matter as much and they won't spank you badly. I'd definitely go with the Evo over the Nexus though.

The Orbit is a different kite. It's really hard to describe. But you're right, it takes a while to learn how it flies. The main positives are that it boosts like a D and turns like a C. It would be a great kite to learn to loop on as the catch is pretty automatic. However, it's super quirky and it's a bit of frustration for a while. The 2021 toned down some of the quirks, but thankfully didn't really change the lift/loop.

Baptiste_FR
Frequent Poster
Posts: 231
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2020 10:20 am
Kiting since: 2015
Local Beach: Normandy
Style: Freeride
Gear: Slingshot Rally (12-9-7m²)
Location: France
Has thanked: 17 times
Been thanked: 78 times

Re: New set: XR/GTS or Rebel/Dice

Postby Baptiste_FR » Fri Nov 06, 2020 12:24 pm

When I was younger, I was a bit of a geek. I had the same problem with computers.
I could not choose between different parts as every tests said it was wonderful (for example CPU AMD/Intel or GPU ATI/NVidia ...). And just like in kiteboarding, there was always a new model coming in the next few weeks. But I wanted to be sure to buy the right componant so I also had to wait for the reviews and benchmarks. So instead of playing and enjoying my computer, I spent most of the time comparing and reading test and waiting for the new model :greenlaugh:


Return to “Kitesurfing”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 26 guests