Contact   Imprint   Advertising   Guidelines

Considering suicide

Forum for kitesurfers
jonysan
Frequent Poster
Posts: 280
Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:11 pm
Kiting since: 1999
Local Beach: Saunton, Weston S Mare, Bournemouth
Favorite Beaches: La Morne Mauritius, anywhere warm
Style: Wave , hopefully smooth,
Gear: Naish Pivots and Slash, Duotone Whip 5'2, F-One Mito 5.8, old Naish 5'4 Quad (like a guided missile!),
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 46 times
Been thanked: 20 times

Re: Considering suicide

Postby jonysan » Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:00 pm

I considered it once, Stupid Title.
These users thanked the author jonysan for the post:
revhed (Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:40 am)
Rating: 6.67%

User avatar
downunder
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2308
Joined: Mon Jul 01, 2013 7:16 am
Gear: building my own
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Perth, Australia
Has thanked: 78 times
Been thanked: 84 times

Re: Considering suicide

Postby downunder » Sun Nov 15, 2020 3:11 am

Matteo V wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 3:32 pm
downunder wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 12:31 pm
All the way mate. Exactly what I do on FS bar above the release.

Cant be bothered with a safety line, since riding in a closed inlet 99%.

Even on the ocean, it was never an issue.

D.
I dont get it. Safe bay, no hazards like beach goers, or other kiters, no possibility of a sudden weather change??? What is the bother of a safety line? Do you accidentally release 1- 3 times a session or something? Sounds like a paradise beginners spot with no worries? Maybe you need a quick relaunch to avoid coming into rocks?

Mini 5th that I use is great for waves and quick relaunch. Main drawback is that I need clear space on either side of window, not just downwind slightly off to one side (as on a single front). So there are some trade offs, but I do not kite in either super safe, nor super sketch locations. Weather wise, I kite at only one spot with no chance of gnarly unpredicted wind coming up.
Here we go.

Nope, I do not release ever. EVER. And that is more true with a foil kites. Not a single rider uses a safety since the throw is huge. Plus, more risk the wing goes between the safety and depower line. Here is a bar many ppl are using, all foilers.

Yes, its a paradise. Kami well knows what Perth is.

Just reading this confirms my decision:

viewtopic.php?t=2408298&p=1118338

viewtopic.php?t=2408307&p=1118349

IMG_15112020_101044_(405_x_720_pixel).jpg
These users thanked the author downunder for the post:
Matteo V (Sun Nov 15, 2020 4:52 pm)
Rating: 6.67%

User avatar
Kamikuza
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 6611
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 4:49 am
Local Beach: Sabae Beach
Favorite Beaches: Ol' Stinky
Gear: This, that, the other
Has thanked: 130 times
Been thanked: 122 times

Re: Considering suicide

Postby Kamikuza » Sun Nov 15, 2020 7:11 am

Toby wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 5:13 pm
not sure Kami about what happens if you twist the lines?
Mini-5ths have a habit of twisting around the line they're attached to, when looping the kite more times one way than the other. The twist usually gets pushed up to the connection point on the front line.

So my stopper ball and ring would be up the front line at the mini-5th connection point. I'm guessing that the ring would let the mini-5th spin around the front line while riding, or at least easier to untwist when you've landing, rather then having to pull out the whole line and unwrap it...

Is that that you mean? Cos the connection point for the stock Cab lines is 8m above the bar...
Last edited by Kamikuza on Sun Nov 15, 2020 7:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Kamikuza
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 6611
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 4:49 am
Local Beach: Sabae Beach
Favorite Beaches: Ol' Stinky
Gear: This, that, the other
Has thanked: 130 times
Been thanked: 122 times

Re: Considering suicide

Postby Kamikuza » Sun Nov 15, 2020 7:15 am

RomeUtah wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 10:03 pm
If you ride suicide, I would make sure that you fully sheeted out almost fully kills all kite power. That way if the qr fails, or the chicken loop fails, your kite drops without power and you can have an easy reset instead of going for a swim.
That was my thinking: Cab (used to) talk about "QR1" being just letting the bar go and the kite depowering 90%.

Been so long that I don't remember what the kites do when I let go the bar, either. Something to try if we get any rideable wind :roll:

Matteo V
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2059
Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 3:42 pm
Local Beach: US, Iowa/Nebraska/Kansas/Utah/Oregon Coast
Favorite Beaches: Ft. Stevens, North coast of Oregon
Style: Just like school in summertime
Gear: Delta Kites and LF Kitefish QuadMod
Snowboard (Cambered and Rockered)
Foil kites on the snow
Brand Affiliation: NONE F--- the corporate world
Has thanked: 139 times
Been thanked: 166 times

Re: Considering suicide

Postby Matteo V » Sun Nov 15, 2020 4:59 pm

downunder wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 3:11 am
Here we go.

Nope, I do not release ever. EVER. And that is more true with a foil kites. Not a single rider uses a safety since the throw is huge. Plus, more risk the wing goes between the safety and depower line. Here is a bar many ppl are using, all foilers.

Yes, its a paradise. Kami well knows what Perth is.

Just reading this confirms my decision.
Maybe elaborate a bit more? What in those links confirms your decision? Seems there are many times when things went very badly, and a safety release was a life saver. After some experience, I can see it's value lessened, but never zero. And what is the value of something that 9 out of 10 people never use, but it saves that 10th person's life?

And most curiously, if you never release, what hiderance is a safety release?

User avatar
edt
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 5875
Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2010 6:27 am
Kiting since: 2010
Local Beach: Michigan
Gear: slingshot liquid force wainman pansh naish duotone cwb burton ronix ozone cabrinha north flysurfer
Has thanked: 118 times
Been thanked: 159 times

Re: Considering suicide

Postby edt » Sun Nov 15, 2020 5:42 pm

You definitely want the QR itself on the control bar. If you get in a tangle with another kite, you can die because you won't have the arm strength to pull off the chicken loop when the two kites death loop. It took a few high profile deaths before kiteboard manufacturers started using the QR instead of the chicken loop without a QR. As for how you set it up, that's up to you. I'm sure some places you just want full release, especially in big wave locations where flagging the kite doesn't help. I don't think it's up for me to decide how you want to rig.

For new kiters, though the most sensible way to rig is with a modern control bar, safety leash rigged front or side, single front line attached to your flag out line. I always rig half suicide so if I let go of the bar or the donkey stick comes out, the kite doesn't flag out but if I push the QR the kite flags to a single line like normal. But rig the kite how you like. For new kiters reading this post though I recommend rig normal, and attach the leash to the front or side (never the back).
These users thanked the author edt for the post:
Matteo V (Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:21 am)
Rating: 6.67%

User avatar
downunder
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 2308
Joined: Mon Jul 01, 2013 7:16 am
Gear: building my own
Brand Affiliation: None
Location: Perth, Australia
Has thanked: 78 times
Been thanked: 84 times

Re: Considering suicide

Postby downunder » Mon Nov 16, 2020 4:43 am

Matteo V wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 4:59 pm
downunder wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 3:11 am
Here we go.

Nope, I do not release ever. EVER. And that is more true with a foil kites. Not a single rider uses a safety since the throw is huge. Plus, more risk the wing goes between the safety and depower line. Here is a bar many ppl are using, all foilers.

Yes, its a paradise. Kami well knows what Perth is.

Just reading this confirms my decision.
Maybe elaborate a bit more? What in those links confirms your decision? Seems there are many times when things went very badly, and a safety release was a life saver. After some experience, I can see it's value lessened, but never zero. And what is the value of something that 9 out of 10 people never use, but it saves that 10th person's life?

And most curiously, if you never release, what hiderance is a safety release?
As said, here we go....

You obviously did not understand the issue with the front wing, so what to discuss?

What we are discussing here is between very experienced riders. If you can't take the risk, than don't. No one is asking you to do that. I really do not need to put a "Disclaimer" for noobs either, this is a Yanks way of doing it, no one else does it on this forum.

~

I see no relevance of QR in this thread...For God sake, do you realise who Kamikuza is, and how many years of experience we talking here? Sorry Kami, this thread went sideways...

User avatar
Kamikuza
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 6611
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 4:49 am
Local Beach: Sabae Beach
Favorite Beaches: Ol' Stinky
Gear: This, that, the other
Has thanked: 130 times
Been thanked: 122 times

Re: Considering suicide

Postby Kamikuza » Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:31 am

downunder wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 4:43 am
I see no relevance of QR in this thread...For God sake, do you realise who Kamikuza is, and how many years of experience we talking here? Sorry Kami, this thread went sideways...
I'm always happy to let threads go sideways, far more interesting :D

I think the relevance of QR is that I still want to be able to QR and completely shed the kite ... I just want to be rid of the unsafe POS that is the FLS; ie. lark's head both front lines to the bracket, ditch the "safety" line, leash to the depower line...

revhed
Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 1329
Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 6:15 pm
Local Beach: france
Gear: kites
Location: France
Has thanked: 79 times
Been thanked: 23 times

Re: Considering suicide

Postby revhed » Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:43 am


:idea:
R H


Return to “Kitesurfing”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Majestic-12 [Bot] and 65 guests