Rigid frames actually sacrifice versatility, for efficiency within a narrow range.Trent hink wrote: ↑Sun Jun 20, 2021 9:38 pmProbably the main reason we don't use rigid wings is that they are fragile.
It's interesting that one of the very first commercial designs for kitesurfing was a rigid frame kite; Cory Roseler's Kiteski.
Do you mean that when one sheeting in, you are modifying the shape by increasing the depth to an extent that wouldn't be possible with a rigid kite? Is powering up the equivalent of deploying lift flaps on a wing? I suppose that is the "power mode" in the offshore video earlier. I always thought that sheeting in just changed the angle of attack.Matteo V wrote: ↑Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:19 pmRigid frames actually sacrifice versatility, for efficiency within a narrow range.
Aircraft designers would love to get rid of flaps, both leading edge and trailing edge. Much more effecient in increasing lift at lower speed and decreasing drag at higher speeds is to change the foil section itself. Soft sails can do this.
Do you know of any niche developments in wings/kites? I presume for the low-end a large leading edge is fine, but must cause pretty severe top end issues. Windsurf sails seem to have a much finer leading edge from the glances I've given them, and are in effect rigid.Matteo V wrote: ↑Mon Jun 21, 2021 4:19 pmThat said, the inflatable leading edge of a tube kite or wing is extremely oversized for the top end speeds that they operate at. Thus there is efficiency to be gained in many higher speed applications of rigid wings and kites. The origional "KiteWing" was much more effecient than the new inflatable versions, for example.
Windsurfing sails can drastically change thier shape with adjustable down hauls and out hauls. Effectively, you are inducing more camber to the cross section, and more "twist off" at the head of the sail.
I fly a Revolution kite, Power Blast. On the beach only. Great kites but very, very different. Try one and you’ll see that your proposal is no more than a mere fantasy.geron wrote: ↑Mon Jun 21, 2021 6:10 pmhttps://www.kiteworld.co.uk/acatalog/Re ... tml#SID=78
this kite; floats (carbon fiber frame is sealed) (or can be sealed), has about 3sq meter area (good for 25 knot large wing hidrofoiling), light weight and seems to have grate control for drifting and eficient upwind. 4 lines and no bridles that tangle. Has anybody tried this kites with a hidrofoil and a regular 4 line 24m bar?
no pump jaja
Fragility, cost, and the tiny potential market are definitely factors. But rigid wings attached to the end of kite lines, like the racing hang glider attached, are inevitable. They will have unbeatable lift and efficiency. The will to win will find a way.Trent hink wrote: ↑Sun Jun 20, 2021 9:38 pmProbably the main reason we don't use rigid wings is that they are fragile.
Sorry point was that they cannot adjust "on the fly", I'm very familiar with how much fine tuning they can do, and the caveat there is the longboard racing sails that have out/down-haul lines for on the fly adjustments, but kitesurfing has that fine control at the fingertips.
Interesting I'm guessing older kites (the last kite I owned was a Naish Torch bless her) didn't change camber when sheeting in, but more modern kites and especially foils would have engineered a way to increase the effective variability of camber.Matteo V wrote: ↑Mon Jun 21, 2021 11:12 pmFoil kites, with thier more rigidly supported structure (fron the bridle connection front to back), actually have more ability to adjust camber from sheeting.
Inflatables, with only thier leading edge supported, rely on canopy tension and can "cone" which can effectively change camber in a percentage of the sail.
There's way more to it than I could explain or even understand. But once again, an airplane with variable foil cross section would be the pinnacle of aeronautical engineering. And it's something we take for granted in sailing and kiting.
Totally. Why they don't exist yet at the top end I find interesting, "unbeatable lift and efficiency" would compel someone.Pump me up wrote: Fragility, cost, and the tiny potential market are definitely factors. But rigid wings attached to the end of kite lines, like the racing hang glider attached, are inevitable. They will have unbeatable lift and efficiency. The will to win will find a way.
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