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Pump me up wrote: ↑

Thu Jan 07, 2021 9:50 pm

....Another major weakness of the soft structure of ram airs is a lack of tactile feedback. Ram air kites are soft so the feedback is soft, sloppy, and imprecise. The more rigid a kite is, the more nuanced is the feedback to the rider, e.g. kite position, speed of turn, and gradations of power delivery.
Cheers,
........... Pumpy

Ram air kites are actually more rigid than and have always had better feedback as well as "more controls" over the various flight charastericts of the kite, than SLE tubies. The extra rigidity of foil kites comes from the fully supported underside resulting from the le to te bridle attachments.

But yes, maybe the Legaignoux brothers are onto something with their high pressure kites.

And thanks for trolling up the discussion. With Aluula, it has become relevant once again.

Ram airs are only just starting to show you the advantages actually since the invention of the soul. The soul is easier to launch than a lei. The soul is easier to relaunch than an lei off water and quicker most of the time. The soul has more hang time than the vast majority of lei kites. The soul can boost from stand still, an lei needs movement momentum and speed to be able to boost. The soul boosts if it flies. An lei will only mo grass when it just flies. The soul can be flown in lighter winds. The days of sloppy feed back are gone with ram airs. They now control very good and loop as well.
The ram air has now evolved. Nearly every company has tried to copy the souls characteristics as they know is is the beginning of something awesome and since it’s invention which has only been 3 years the ram air market has increased considerably. once some more time has been put into perfecting this new addition to the kite world in the next generations you will see even more positives beyond with the lei. Aluula has obviously improved the lei significantly but When the first aluula rams are built well we will see then!

Ice101 wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 09, 2021 7:02 am

Ram airs are only just starting to show you the advantages actually since the invention of the soul. The soul ... BLA BLA BLA lies and exaggerations

It's the same old, tired tune. Every year ram lovers make ridiculous claims about how the latest ram air kite will "dominate." Their kites then go on to get blown out of the water. For example, ram lovers claimed that various kites from Flysurfer (Psycho, Silver Arrow, Warrior, Voodoo, Titan, Soul, Insert Name Here..... etc) would beat inflatable kites on X, Y, or Z parameters. It never happens.

Ignore the lies. Ignore the propaganda. Ram air kites are aerodynamically inferior cf inflatables and nothing can change this.

Pumpy ...............

I don't care which kite is better, faster or whatever.. sometimes the feeling gets important too..
I like ramairs, singe skin foils and tubes.
Enjoy whatever you fly and grow up Pumpy..

And ram airs win every race going and have done for a long time!

Pump me up wrote: ↑

Tue Jan 12, 2021 10:06 am

It's the same old, tired tune.

You got that right!

Pumpy, you can at least take solace in the fact that less responses every year is a clear indication that your efforts have been successful!

And the bit about this all being old and tired... I'm only joking.

I see it more as timeless tradition, sort of like Santa Claus.

Best wishes to you, sir.

Oh here we go again - foils vs tubes

Just one view: bladders pop.

Pump me up wrote: ↑

Tue Jan 12, 2021 10:06 am

Ice101 wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 09, 2021 7:02 am

Ram airs are only just starting to show you the advantages actually since the invention of the soul. The soul ... BLA BLA BLA lies and exaggerations

It's the same old, tired tune. Every year ram lovers make ridiculous claims about how the latest ram air kite will "dominate." Their kites then go on to get blown out of the water. For example, ram lovers claimed that various kites from Flysurfer (Psycho, Silver Arrow, Warrior, Voodoo, Titan, Soul, Insert Name Here..... etc) would beat inflatable kites on X, Y, or Z parameters. It never happens.

Ignore the lies. Ignore the propaganda. Ram air kites are aerodynamically inferior cf inflatables and nothing can change this.

Pumpy ...............

Ice 101 wasn't around for most of depower foils history, apparently.

Ozone had decent foils back in the 05's. And decent is an understatement as they were better than any inflatable at the time. HQ dominated with better designs than Ozone with the Montana (v5, v6, v7), and the Matrixx (v1 15m only) around 2010.

Then Elf and Ozone finally surpassed HQ with the entry of depower race kites to the market in the 2015's. Eventually giving us the Chrono 2. And that is where we are at right now



But up until a few years ago, Flysurfer was busy making everyone think big foilkites sucked. There was really no way to sell a Speed Series (2-5) to someone who actually tried one against another manufacture's big kite. Even Pansh kites caught up with Flysurfer Speed series in 2018 with the Pansh A-15. But lots of kiters ordered Speeds "sight unseen" back in the day and learned to hate light wind. So giving Flysurfer credit for finally catching up to 2010 in 2018, is a bit of a stretch. Maybe focus on the success of the "Peak". That is Flysurfer's only real claim to fame.

Ram air kites should be only used with boat support, the lines, bridles, and kites sewing of the kite are fragile and break all the time. You can not self rescue, they create quit a burden on the local rescue services were I kite.

My Flysurfer 19m Speed3 Deluxe was pretty awesome with a large door, but I liked the 15m Sonic better