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Big Air with Slingshot

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Lolomolo
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Style: Big Air
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Big Air with Slingshot

Postby Lolomolo » Mon Mar 01, 2021 7:59 am

So I got the Slingshot 10M Raptor a few months back, and the 9M a few days ago. I absolutely love the kite so far, but I am also aiming to take my kiting to competitions.
I learned on the Rally and have a full quiver of RPMs that I regularly ride. The RPM has been a wonderful kite that has forced me to perfect my technique but I feel like I have pretty much maxed out the jumping capabilities. I can consistently jump 12M on the 8 and 9M RPMs but never higher. I broke 15M the first day I took the 10M raptor out in 25-30Knots.

Now; I want to keep pushing the height, keep working on loops, and in general work to get into some big air competitions.

I'd like the community opinion here; am I holding myself back by sticking with Slingshot? Do you think the raptor is a competitive kite, if not, what kite do you think I should look at to keep progressing.

Any other tips for moving forward are appreciated! :)

P.S. Iv tried the 2021 Rebel, It is a boosting machine, and I could consistently hit 13M jumps on the 9m in 25-30knots. But it has no bar pressure and feel very flimsy.
I really like the dice, and was even able to loop the 12M and have it full catch me. If I was to just work on loops id love to invest in this kite. But, it just doesnt feel very powerful.
I really like the Naish Pivot, it loops alright, and has good height, but again, controls just feel too flimsy and I cant feel where it is in the sky if im doing backroll loops.

Blackened
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Re: Big Air with Slingshot

Postby Blackened » Tue Mar 02, 2021 1:04 am

The best kite to use is the one you feel the most comfortable.

Every kite/brand is different in how it feels/reacts. Sometimes it does take a while to get used to a kite. It took me probably 20-30hrs before I finally felt comfortable on the Orbit.

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Lolomolo
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Weight: 180
Local Beach: Waddell, Santa Cruz
Favorite Beaches: Favorites so far are Isla Vista in Santa Barbara, Virginia Key in Florida, and Ocean Beach in San Francisco.
Style: Big Air
Gear: SS 7-11M 2019 RPM, 9-10M Raptor V1, 2017 134cm Asylum.
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Re: Big Air with Slingshot

Postby Lolomolo » Tue Mar 02, 2021 2:40 am

I guess what I am saying is there are clear differences between the RPM and Raptor in terms of big air performance, If I am planning to squeeze out everything I can from a kite. Which kite am I better off with.

A concern on mine with the raptor is that it feels like it has less depower then other big air kites. Im still testing, but I think it limits the conditions you can take it out in. IE; if the depower was better on the 10M I might be able to take it out in 30+knots. As it stands stable 33 knot conditions is the upper limit for the 10M any more and I cant hold it down without seriously yanking the trim.

Based on my experience with the Core XR 10M I think I would still be able to hang onto it at 33Knots.

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Lolomolo
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Style: Big Air
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Re: Big Air with Slingshot

Postby Lolomolo » Tue Mar 02, 2021 5:49 am

I guess my question is more specific; I am trying to squeeze as much as I can out of the kites I ride and I have obviously hit a dead end with the RPMs (in terms of height). The Raptor is a good step forward and I saw immediate 25-50% gains on my height, the question is; am I still holding myself back with this kite. How much worse is it than something like the Orbit/XR/Rebel.

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Re: Big Air with Slingshot

Postby NotsoShort » Tue Mar 02, 2021 9:13 am

I agree , it’s the kite you feel connected to and have the most confidence with. Which I love and helps me to progress further.

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Re: Big Air with Slingshot

Postby Baptiste_FR » Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:07 pm

In my opinion, if you want to focus on height, you should ride a kite with Delta shape and a fairly high aspect ratio. It gives the ability to ride upwind better and jump higher.
Then, regarding the number of struts, I'd go with a 3 struts kite for 10m size and bigger and a 5 struts kites for 8m and smaller.

Each brand offer at least one of those two option (EVO and Rebel for Duotone, XR for Core, The Raptor for SS, Orbit for North, the Sculp and Hyper for CrazyFly, RS and XS for Eleveight.....).

Blackened
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Re: Big Air with Slingshot

Postby Blackened » Tue Mar 02, 2021 10:55 pm

Lolomolo wrote:
Tue Mar 02, 2021 5:49 am
I guess my question is more specific; I am trying to squeeze as much as I can out of the kites I ride and I have obviously hit a dead end with the RPMs (in terms of height). The Raptor is a good step forward and I saw immediate 25-50% gains on my height, the question is; am I still holding myself back with this kite. How much worse is it than something like the Orbit/XR/Rebel.
I don't think you would be holding yourself back on the Raptor. I believe Sam Light moved to it for big air stuff from the RPM this year. I haven't ridden any Slingshot kites since a 2017 Turbine 17m, so sorry I'm not much help here.

As for the comparison to the Rebel/XR, it looks to be a similar canopy shape in the 5-strut format. I imagine the performance would be similar in performance for those two - ie jump similarly, similar upwind, and similar turning. Also similar grunt and high end.

As for the Orbit, there is nothing to compare against on the market at the moment. It jumps like a Rebel/XR but turning speed like a Dice/GTS. It also has the best high end of any kite I've ridden. What are the downsides you ask?
1. You need to be lit to get the best out of it. There is no low end. (2021 better)
2. It's finicky as f*** and easy to either front or back stall it out of the sky, especially in lighter winds.(2021 better)
3. It is made for Big Air. That's what it does. That's all it does. It doesn't even freeride well. (2021 better)

Ignoring the above, it's by far the best kite of the three alternatives you listed for looping. I swapped my 9/10 Evos for 9/10 Orbits and within 1-2 months went from 13-15m days to 18-20m days. I also sold my 8m as 40-45kn gusts can be held by the 9m.

Summary, stick with the Raptor for now until you can try more kites. If you're struggling with being overpowered, get a smaller board. I'm highly enjoying my 132x40 (?) on OP days from the normal 138.

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Re: Big Air with Slingshot

Postby dracop » Wed Mar 03, 2021 1:38 am

Raptor and the Orbit are the two hardest kites to find on the beach and demo atm.

The Raptor was a V1 so I would def wat for the V2 as every kite goes through major changes in the early years.

RPMs have an awesome high end, my 2014 11m RPM was my daily driver for personal riding in Cape Town when I taught there in 2015-216. They do not boost anywhere near modern Big Air kites - they are sweeter if you are mixing it up with Unhooked tricks.

Rebel goes head to head with the XR6 and Dice goes head to head with the GTS. XR6 is more nimble than the Rebel and can do a lower Loop, Rebel is more supported and smoother than the XR6 under heavy load. Rebel is extremely difficult to megaloop but does a smooth heliloop and Powered Kiteloop.

If you just want loops the Reedin Supermodel is fantastic at a smooth gentle yanking kiteloop. Mediocre elsewhere but great for kiteloops.

One day I would love to do a proper review on all the Big Air kites on the market nowadays, so hard to demo now.
The GTS is an Open C targeting Big Air and Kiteloops but fails under Extreme Loads, so heavyweight riders in Cape Town are forced elsewhere. In Jan 2020, I was in an 8m GTS and it was warping badly at 50kts - both a 9m Rebel and XR6 held up better that same session. The Dice is more of an all around Open C, have not tested it myself in nuking conditions (40kts+ for a 115kg rider). I am really eager for an SLS or Aluula version of a Dice in 9m or 10m for Day of Days conditions (50kts+).

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Re: Big Air with Slingshot

Postby Eduardo » Wed Mar 03, 2021 2:52 am

Lolomolo wrote:
Mon Mar 01, 2021 7:59 am
So I got the Slingshot 10M Raptor a few months back, and the 9M a few days ago. I absolutely love the kite so far, but I am also aiming to take my kiting to competitions.
I learned on the Rally and have a full quiver of RPMs that I regularly ride. The RPM has been a wonderful kite that has forced me to perfect my technique but I feel like I have pretty much maxed out the jumping capabilities. I can consistently jump 12M on the 8 and 9M RPMs but never higher. I broke 15M the first day I took the 10M raptor out in 25-30Knots.

Now; I want to keep pushing the height, keep working on loops, and in general work to get into some big air competitions.

I'd like the community opinion here; am I holding myself back by sticking with Slingshot? Do you think the raptor is a competitive kite, if not, what kite do you think I should look at to keep progressing.

Any other tips for moving forward are appreciated! :)

P.S. Iv tried the 2021 Rebel, It is a boosting machine, and I could consistently hit 13M jumps on the 9m in 25-30knots. But it has no bar pressure and feel very flimsy.
I really like the dice, and was even able to loop the 12M and have it full catch me. If I was to just work on loops id love to invest in this kite. But, it just doesnt feel very powerful.
I really like the Naish Pivot, it loops alright, and has good height, but again, controls just feel too flimsy and I cant feel where it is in the sky if im doing backroll loops.
I often post answers that it is skill not equipment holding people back and don't rush to buy (usually people jumping a few meters wanting to buy a new kite to go higher). But in your case, you have very nice heights already & you've on top of that found a difference - a 25% boost in height switching kites. But as you've already found, it is one thing to find a difference among styles within a brand vs. going across brands. I think most most big brands have nailed each pure category (wave, height, looping, ...) and the differences are subtle and more about design tradeoffs, style preference, your personal strengths and weaknesses, and how and where you ride.

I see two options:
1) keep demo'ing until you find that one kite that matches your dream load/pop/height/loop/catch style
2) slightly adjust your style to a slightly non-dream kite and squeeze almost the same performance out of it

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Re: Big Air with Slingshot

Postby Adek » Wed Mar 03, 2021 5:44 pm

Power of kites is depend from model to model, but installing adjusting pigtails and short line extensions on front or rear lines are equalize all kites to appropriate parameters. I never use factory adjustments of my kites. I made my kites flying as I want them to fly. More/less powered, faster or slow in turns. It's easy and very effective as well as much cheaper.


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