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11m faster kite vs 12m better low end

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yyusufoglu
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Re: 11m faster kite vs 12m better low end

Postby yyusufoglu » Thu Mar 25, 2021 10:02 pm

PabloQ wrote:
Thu Mar 25, 2021 12:53 pm
Estimated,
weight 70kg plus neoprene and harness. I use a TT 139 * 39 and I have a flysurfer soul as a headboard for winds between 10 and 28kn. In 10kn I go perfectly upwind. and in 28kn flying low. :-). I recently bought a soul 7m for winds over 20 and according to the manual it will take me up to 35 / 36kn. With that I have a very wide range for my 10/35 spot with two kites. Greetings
Thanks for your feedback Pablo! Sounds like you got your wind range covered! Never tried flying foil kites - always thought they look a bit too complicated :D

yyusufoglu
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Re: 11m faster kite vs 12m better low end

Postby yyusufoglu » Thu Mar 25, 2021 10:12 pm

Dirk wrote:
Thu Mar 25, 2021 3:38 pm
73 kg, for Twintip riding my go to kites are 11m/8m Naish Pivot. Riding all year at the North Sea/Germany, so similar conditions to yours. 15 knots and I am happy on my 11m with my standard twintip (41cm wide). I can go lower with my larger Twintip, but for low wind TT riding I also have a 14m (Boxer).

At your weight starting at 15 knots an 11m delta-ish freeride kite like the ones you mentioned should work really well.
Thanks Dirk! i always hear good feedback about Pivot kite :D I am curious at what point you start riding your 8m and when it becomes too overpowered?

I can see the attraction of adding a bigger light wind kite to the quiver or maybe just a foil board that can really increase the number of days you can be on the water but i am focusing on 15knot tt riding for now, both due to budget and time constraints :lol:

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Re: 11m faster kite vs 12m better low end

Postby yyusufoglu » Thu Mar 25, 2021 10:14 pm

Leon van Bergen wrote:
Thu Mar 25, 2021 4:02 pm
yyusufoglu wrote:
Thu Mar 25, 2021 12:44 pm
hey Leon, thanks vm for your feedback! That is good to hear especially coming from a rider in similar conditions. I am also leaning more towards the 11m actually! :D
You have a nice quiver - how are you liking the 21" Rebels?
And you won't regret it!
The 21 ones are mindblowing, way faster, more direct than my 2019's. way easier to loop them.
sounds good - maybe i should try to find out where I can test them!

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Re: 11m faster kite vs 12m better low end

Postby Havre » Thu Mar 25, 2021 10:44 pm

yyusufoglu wrote:
Thu Mar 25, 2021 9:52 pm
Havre wrote:
Thu Mar 25, 2021 12:45 pm
I can't really comment much when it comes to 11 or 12 being most suitable in 15 knots at 70kg - since I am around 100 myself. Only reflection would be I can jump with a Rebel 13m in 15knots+. So I would imagine 11 would do the trick for you.

For me it would come down to:

A) How much power do you like to ride with?
B) How much overlap do you want between kites?

A) is a given - if you like power go for 12 - if not then 11 makes more sense.

As for B). 12 and 9 I would argue overlaps each other very nicely. I got similar kind of setup with 7, 9, 12 and 17m. For me it would be pointless to go 9 and 11 as 9 and 12 already overlap enough. But if you are not interested in kiting when you need a 12 then that argument becomes mute. And if you like to have kites closer together then 9 and 11 obviously is better than 9 and 12.

Don't think you could go much wrong either way. You might even want to consider 8 - 11 with only two kites. Depends on B) and how much you are willing to spend.
Thanks for the feedback Havre. Yea going for 12/9 would have been the easier choice but with my weight this does mean i am riding bit too overpowered.
Of course the board technique also plays a role here as well. With your setup with 4 kites, i can understand that 9-11 wouldn really fill the wind ranges so well.

8/11 is quite tempting especially looking at cost aspect. On paper, could still cover me up to 35knots or so. 11m from 15-25 and 8m from 25-35knots.
The only thing that makes me doubt is whether there will be a small gap in the range when its blowing too much for the 11m, (probably somewhere between 22-25 knots) will the 8m feel too underpowered? Tend to think 9-11 overlaps better, especially when a 7m eventually added. Also an idea to improve my board technique to hold the 8m in higher winds as well :) 8m is definitely an attractive kite size!
I know 8 - 11 is quite common among girls (many probably some kg lighter than you, but still in terms of gap it is not uncommon). The gap in % is smaller for 11/8 than 17/12. Obviously not the same for all kites etc., but I rarely if ever feel that I have a problem with a gap between 17 and 12.

When I'm replacing my quiver I won't replace my 17. I was planning to buy 3xOrbits this winter with the biggest being a 14. With 11 and 8 as the two others. Obviously never made the final decision. I have never in my life been overpowered to the extent that I wanted to go down from my 9 - so I was also considering 9 - 11, but not because of the gap, but because I'm not sure how often an 8 would hit the sweet spot.

Just my 2 cents. I don't think anyone can take that decision for you. I got friends who doesn't like to be overpowered (much) and therefore prefer to have kites with smaller gaps. It would be unfortunate of course if you find yourself in a situation where you are using your 11 when you would rather be on a 9, but you only got an 8.
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Re: 11m faster kite vs 12m better low end

Postby PabloQ » Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:02 am

yyusufoglu wrote:
Thu Mar 25, 2021 10:02 pm
PabloQ wrote:
Thu Mar 25, 2021 12:53 pm

Thanks for your feedback Pablo! Sounds like you got your wind range covered! Never tried flying foil kites - always thought they look a bit too complicated :D
Dear, it always looks tricky when 97% of kites are inflatable, so you see that kite and you say ...
many lines
what happens if it falls into the water
it surely gets tangled when it falls.
Well, not only is all the above solved practically, but the upwind angle is more pronounced, the range is greater, the hang time is double, and the valves clearly do not detach. It is to try them and then you tell me

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Re: 11m faster kite vs 12m better low end

Postby longwhitecloud » Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:13 am

I had an 11.5m - I think takoon?! Was a really sensible size. I. Think 12m is starting to get big these days... well that is if companies use honest sizing which we know they often just make it up...

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Re: 11m faster kite vs 12m better low end

Postby zlatko23 » Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:58 pm

I am ~70kg weight, riding 9m&11m Ozone Enduros. Plus I have 13m Cabrinha Contra on the larger side of my quiver. I would say riding a faster, lighter kite like Enduro makes a for a lot more fun on the water. I am using the 11m Enduro instead of the 13m Contra always when I can stay upwind with it(about 13+ knots). But admittedly there have been days when my 13m Contra saved me from just sitting on the beach.
I can also compare 9m Enduro to my (sold)Switchblade 10m - again I caught myself preferring to ride underpowered on 9m than using the slower, gruntier 10m Switchblade.
So I would go for 9&11m combo instead of 9&12 - you barely will feel the difference in low end and will be having more fun in my opinion.

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Re: 11m faster kite vs 12m better low end

Postby Adventure Logs » Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:14 pm

IMO depends on the kite and what you do. Higher AR kites you can “spin up” and build the apparent wind which means more power(what foils are good at). So since a 11m is faster, you may be able to produce more power with it if you work it.

Also do you hydrofoil or want to in the future? With your weight the 12m will most likely be overkill.

Do you like to jump? Depending on the kite, larger size might give you better hang time.

If you are choosing a kite with a low A/R then maybe the 12m is a better choice.

Lastly depends on your kitespot and what are the typical winds.

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Re: 11m faster kite vs 12m better low end

Postby Dirk » Fri Mar 26, 2021 6:25 pm

Thanks Dirk! i always hear good feedback about Pivot kite :D I am curious at what point you start riding your 8m and when it becomes too overpowered?

[/quote]

20 knots, plus gusts I will pump up the 8m. I can get going with it around 18 knots. When it is 28-30 Knots gusting into 40 I am using my 7m Slash right now with the TT. The Slash has less power size for size compared to the Pivot

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Re: 11m faster kite vs 12m better low end

Postby grigorib » Fri Mar 26, 2021 7:48 pm

At your weight don’t even look at 12m size, 10m Rally/XR/Pivot should probably be your regular size. 15 knots wind is about at edge of white caps and considering waves/current you can add a meter, but 12m sizes are slow as hell.
6/8/11 quiver should be good or 7-10-13.5 depending on whether your rather want to cover lower end or higher end of winds.

My twintip quiver is 5/7/9/11 Rally (200 lbs) and while 9-11 gap is a bit out of proportion, the 9 is my main boosting size. Also 11 doesn’t cover 10-14 knot range for me - I can ride with a door but I should use 14m for my weight for “below whitecaps”.


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