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What is with prices?

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Havre
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Re: What is with prices?

Postby Havre » Fri Apr 23, 2021 6:09 pm

Ozone Edge 9m V8 Kite only 1360,- Euro

That was from 2015. So has it really gotten more expensive?

Isn't that more or less what you pay for a kite only 9m Edge today brand new?

Only one example of course.

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Re: What is with prices?

Postby Eckhardt » Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:31 am

Havre wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 6:09 pm
Ozone Edge 9m V8 Kite only 1360,- Euro

That was from 2015. So has it really gotten more expensive?

Isn't that more or less what you pay for a kite only 9m Edge today brand new?

Only one example of course.

Less, gotta add 300 for a new one ;-)

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downunder
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Re: What is with prices?

Postby downunder » Sat Apr 24, 2021 1:33 pm

Anyone buying a brand new kites or gear in this current economy is ....

However, in AU, the prices we pay in dollars are in same figures in the EU, but in Euros.

Used Soul 10m is $1-1.2k here. Chrono v2 UL 13m paid 650 last year...

The 2nd hand prices in the EU are very high, even tho way bigger market. 19% VAT should be reduced for sport equipment over there.

That would make it more affordable. In AU it is 10%.

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Re: What is with prices?

Postby kitexpert » Sat Apr 24, 2021 2:50 pm

Worth noticing LEI kites have become cheaper for brands: less struts, less details, less materials, less work. It is crazy how some pay big money for strutless kites, such a very simple product. Aluula is an exception, it is indeed more expensive than old stuff but it is fully and even more taken care in its price. When kite is over $2k why not add $200-300 more - those who want it pay it anyway.

Premium brands ask ridiculous prices for quite similar kites than others have and how they were years ago. It is a fact LEI kites have not improved a lot in last 10 years, if at all. It is pretty much all marketing, new graphics and colors and that old tweaking kites back and forth year after year.

Foil kites have improved more (general level and top level), and there is more variety now. Foil kites have never been cheap but it is more understandable because there is so much more parts and details in them. Definitely LEI kites are better business than foil kites, strutless kites give biggest profits for sure.

However second hand market is better than ever, for buyer. Lots of good kites available for small prices. Of course you'd better know what you are buying and know how to do basic fixes.

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Re: What is with prices?

Postby Matteo V » Sat Apr 24, 2021 3:13 pm

downunder wrote:
Sat Apr 24, 2021 1:33 pm

19% VAT should be reduced for sport equipment over there.

That would make it more affordable. In AU it is 10%.
Wait? Almost 20% in VAT tax alone? Then income tax takes 30% of your income before you can spend it, and you also have to pay corporate taxes that are lumped into the sale price of the items you buy? Then tack on transportation taxes (fuel, import), maybe property taxes.....

Is the actual ammount of tax on every item you buy like 70% or something?

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Re: What is with prices?

Postby Havre » Sun Apr 25, 2021 10:03 am

Eckhardt wrote:
Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:31 am
Havre wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 6:09 pm
Ozone Edge 9m V8 Kite only 1360,- Euro

That was from 2015. So has it really gotten more expensive?

Isn't that more or less what you pay for a kite only 9m Edge today brand new?

Only one example of course.

Less, gotta add 300 for a new one ;-)
You are right. I was getting the prices ex VAT for the v10.

I can't say why prices have gone up with 20% or whatever the exact number would be, but I don't think that is crazy in 6 years.

I remember living in Shanghai. Prices went up like crazy. Taxi's just scribbled the new tariff over the old one every other month. Without knowing I could see something similar with kite production as well.

What I do find surprising is that we haven't seen a bigger change in distribution. It is just so ridiculously inefficient. As volume grows you would expect to see more consolidation. And if you can buy a Tesla direct online I'm not sure why you got to go through a shop for most kites. The last two kites I got I can imagine at least half of the money went to the shop. Gave me absolutely no value buying it through a shop rather than direct. Not that I mind the shop. They are friendly enough.

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Re: What is with prices?

Postby Kiterisland » Sun Apr 25, 2021 3:17 pm

Prices are high but somewhat understandable. I think the unfortunate part of our sport is the rapid decline in value of gear.

A new motocross dirt bike will run you $12000cad these days($9000 in 2004). But in 10 years you could still get $4500-6000 for it. So only 50% loss over 10 years.

Kites loose 50% value in one or two years if bought mrsp. That is very hard to sustain if you want 3-4 kite quiver and are a working family man. Not possible for someone like me to buy new ever.

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Re: What is with prices?

Postby GetHighOrDieTrying » Sun Apr 25, 2021 8:34 pm

wrt prices for foil kites and aluula i think manufacturers run much lower economies of scale. slower turning and smaller production batches of niche products can increase the cost per item by a lot (non-linear relationship).

i think the indirect distribution system through local dealers is inefficient and should change. from my pov, i know which product i want and would prefer to buy directly from the manufacturer without paying a dealer 30%+ for adding no value to me. Best kites tried to go direct but unfortunately failed...would be great to see another young brand reviving this approach. maybe the time is ripe again.

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Re: What is with prices?

Postby or6 » Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:08 am

from my pov, i know which product i want and would prefer to buy directly from the manufacturer without paying a dealer 30%+ for adding no value to me.
You can. Kauper XT does exactly that. It is run by Rainer Kauper and his wife. No ads, no middle dealers, all online. Price of the Maverick, a wave kite LEI, is significantly lower than any other brand.

I don't know of any others...there might be?
Last edited by or6 on Tue Apr 27, 2021 8:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What is with prices?

Postby Faxie » Mon Apr 26, 2021 12:54 pm

or6 wrote:
Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:08 am
from my pov, i know which product i want and would prefer to buy directly from the manufacturer without paying a dealer 30%+ for adding no value to me.
You can. Kauper XT does exactly that. It is run by Rainer Kauper and his wife. No ads, no middle dealers, all online. Price of the Maverick, a wave kite LE, is significantly lower than any other brand.

I don't know of any others...there might be?
Ventum comes to mind.


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