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Risk of a knot v risk of knot removal

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artificialname
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Risk of a knot v risk of knot removal

Postby artificialname » Sat Jul 17, 2021 3:12 pm

I have a used 17m kite.

It has a knot in the bridle line just above where the bridle connects to the centre line.

The knot feels rock hard- like cement. I have no idea how long it’s been there for.

I’m a relatively new kiter- it’s not like i’m doing any extreme flying.

What has more chance of breaking:

1) the line with a knot in it
Or
2) the line after I attempt to remove the knot, using flat plyers or spoons or rocks or chewing it or whatever else works.

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cglazier
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Re: Risk of a knot v risk of knot removal

Postby cglazier » Sat Jul 17, 2021 3:39 pm

A simple knot reduces the line strength to maybe 60% of its original value. It also shortens the line,

Removing a knot is easy.. I am the expert around here. I have removed many knots and it never takes me longer than two minutes. The secret?.. small long nose pliers that I use to pull the knot apart.

Some people suggest hammering on and crushing the knot until the line is so deformed that the knot loosens. This works but is obviously damaging to the line.. it is definitely not advisable.

Pliers like these cost under $10. Be sure to get ones with serrations (grooves) on the gripping surface.

;-) CG
photo_of_5_inch_Steel_Needle_nose_pliers_with_spring_handle___serrated_teeth_for_grip_ROH46SVJBML0 (Small).png
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edt
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Re: Risk of a knot v risk of knot removal

Postby edt » Sat Jul 17, 2021 6:22 pm

Always remove knots in flying lines. It reduces strength by 50% and increases the chance of snapping a line by maybe 5 or 10 times. You may fray the line getting the knot out. Still worth it.

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Re: Risk of a knot v risk of knot removal

Postby iriejohn » Sat Jul 17, 2021 6:41 pm

Soak the knot in water, it will pull apart more easily. Take your time to avoid damaging the line.
Last edited by iriejohn on Sat Jul 17, 2021 6:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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BillyGoatGruff
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Re: Risk of a knot v risk of knot removal

Postby BillyGoatGruff » Sat Jul 17, 2021 6:41 pm

Also, soak the knot in soapy water or washing up liquid. This reduces the internal fricton and makes it much easier to unpick.
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Re: Risk of a knot v risk of knot removal

Postby purdyd » Sat Jul 17, 2021 6:50 pm

I drive a pin through the knot in the gap between the lines into a wood board and work the knot up and down,

and continue to drive pins and working the knot up and down the pins until here is enough gap to remove by hand

I saw this somewhere.

I have had no luck with soaking, soap, pliers etc. Especially if it is one of the front lines

It is best to catch it early and from what I can tell, it a knot on the front lines may actually saw the line in half.
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Re: Risk of a knot v risk of knot removal

Postby Jyoder » Sat Jul 17, 2021 6:56 pm

Does the kite fly badly? Does it have a turn when bar is level? If not, don’t, mess with it. Pun intended.

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Re: Risk of a knot v risk of knot removal

Postby Trent hink » Sat Jul 17, 2021 7:23 pm

cglazier wrote:
Sat Jul 17, 2021 3:39 pm
A simple knot reduces the line strength to maybe 60% of its original value. It also shortens the line,

Removing a knot is easy.. I am the expert around here. I have removed many knots and it never takes me longer than two minutes. The secret?.. small long nose pliers that I use to pull the knot apart.

Some people suggest hammering on and crushing the knot until the line is so deformed that the knot loosens. This works but is obviously damaging to the line.. it is definitely not advisable.

Pliers like these cost under $10. Be sure to get ones with serrations (grooves) on the gripping surface.

;-) CG
photo_of_5_inch_Steel_Needle_nose_pliers_with_spring_handle___serrated_teeth_for_grip_ROH46SVJBML0 (Small).png
The object of hammering on the knot is to deform the knot by pressing it flat. I always use a smooth hammer on a very smooth hard surface, such as the back of a vise; tap gently to flatten out the knot.

Needle-nose pliers usually have a flat spot in-between the wire cutter and the tip, which could maybe achieve the same effect as hammering on the knot... I'm gonna try that next time.

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Re: Risk of a knot v risk of knot removal

Postby GregK » Sat Jul 17, 2021 11:18 pm

Best way to release a knot in a line without damaging it ? Spike it twice with a gradually-tapered awl and it'll be easy to open.

This is a long-lost skill. Back in the days of wooden ships of sail, sailors working on the manila ropes carried marlinspikes for this purpose. Think a tight knot in Dyneema or Spectra line is tough, try opening up a tight knot in manila cordage.

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Re: Risk of a knot v risk of knot removal

Postby RedSky » Sat Jul 17, 2021 11:44 pm

Bridle lines often have knots for the purpose of tuning and have a breaking strain greater than control lines. I wouldn't worry unless you have knots in the control lines.


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