Duotone Rebel SLS 2022

[Matty V]

I appreciate Dan replying on this thread with justification for sls only

But given the shortage of standard cloth and the demographic tfst buys the rebel it’s a straight business case.

They will buy what we put out and it’s the only material
Available to build from.

Just like the shift to SLS slick wings only in SLS now.

The advanced customer that often referenced, are they genuinely maxing out the performance of the rebel? If they are then cool
Updgrade it but we all know damn well they aren’t

[purdyd]

I appreciate Dan replying on this thread with justification for sls only

But given the shortage of standard cloth and the demographic tfst buys the rebel it’s a straight business case.

They will buy what we put out and it’s the only material
Available to build from.

Just like the shift to SLS slick wings only in SLS now.

The advanced customer that often referenced, are they genuinely maxing out the performance of the rebel? If they are then cool
Updgrade it but we all know damn well they aren’t

I guess based on my experience with the evo and sls and looking at who flies the rebels, it is the right decision.

If you aren’t maxing out a rebel in Dacron or wouldn’t gain from the sls material, I’d say an evo or dice in Dacron would be a better fit.

[Kitemenn]

Yeah I told my local shop to keep one for me when they arrive but they didn't give me a price yet, I expect them to be more expensive but I don't know how much, I hope not more than 10% which would put them more or less at the same price as XRs.
If it's too much it's going to be my last rebel except if the improvements are really worth the increase it, but somehow I doubt it

In the Netherlands:

7M normal Rebel €1459 - SLS €1799
9M normal Rebel €1609 - SLS €1959
11M normal Rebel €1759 - SLS €2119
13m normal Rebel €1919 - SLS €2279

WHHHAAATTTT.... price of the 11m Rebel SLS got me a full quiver of Ventum Xcites V2 brand new as well! these prices are really through the roof, although some of the price will also be due to the increased shipping and raw material costs. A quite significant increase in price was about to be expected anyways so it will be hard to compare last years prices with 2022 prices anyway, but an increase of €350 per kite on average seems outrages

[cor]

People keep complaining about "ridiculous" prices on the internet while Duotone can barely deliver because order volumes increase every year .

You all think that the Rebel is special in that case. I rather think that the Rebel is just the first. I bet that Duotone will do the same to the Dice next year until all the normal versions are gone and it´s only SLS and DLAB for all kites. A well placed strategy to significantly increase prices and "premiumize" the Duotone brand in the next couple years.

[Dan-at-Duotone]

I'm not disagreeing with ANYONE on this thread. I don't blame anyone for choosing to not purchase the new Rebel SLS for whatever reason. The price jump from original to SLS construction is about 15%. I feel there is a significant jump in performance that justifies this extra cost, but others will obviously have their own thoughts on this, and obviously if you're already maxing out your budget for an original then you will not feel that any increase in performance is worth any increase in cost. That's totally fair and I respect your opinion. From our point of view, however, we have another model that specifically matches the customer looking for a solid freeride kite at a slightly lower price point, the Evo. Again, if you disagree with this that's totally fair and again I respect your opinion.

Remember that the design parameters for the Rebel are to make the best advanced freeride, highest jumping kite possible. No compromises to make the kite more beginner friendly, or work for waves or freestyle etc. We make another model that is a more all-around freeride kite, the Evo. It's cheaper because it's 3-struts, it still jumps REALLY well, and it is a generally more 'commercial' kite because it's easier to fly and will make a wider range of riders happy. The Rebel is made for people who want to sacrifice nothing for the highest performing freeride kite they can get. Given that design goal and given the fact that SLS construction generally increases performance in all the ways that the Rebel wants, it makes sense to me to release the Rebel only in SLS. I can see the logic, whether you agree with it or not, that anyone who does NOT want to pay an extra 15% for more performance would probably be better off with an Evo, it's even cheaper than the Rebel original and still has similar design parameters in that it's a big-jumping freeride kite.

Also remember that each additional model requires lots of time and cost to design. We're lucky to have two full-time design teams working on our kites, it allows us to offer a full lineup of models and constructions, but there is still a limited bandwidth and we have to cut it off somewhere. Plus it's a slippery slope and it's very easy to have a too-large lineup which can cause confusion, difficulties in construction, forecasting, and stocking. As a business we need to limit the number of models we offer and we do the best we can.

I understand that some people may disagree with some of my points above, like I mentioned, you're welcome to your own opinion and I respect it, but the feedback I've gotten from retailers and the few consumers I've discussed it with seem to understand our logic and the Rebel SLS has been very well received so far.

If anyone has any real-life feedback on these kites feel free to chime in. Again, I have less time at real-life demo events so would love to hear more consumer reviews.

[Dan-at-Duotone]

@cor-
I won't claim to know everything about where we're heading with our lineup in the future but I don't think what you're implying is true. Our original construction is a well established way to build a solid kite, and a kite that is softer/more commercial than the stiffer SLS construction. I do not see us eliminating this construction just in the name of creating more turnover. It makes sense to build certain models, like the Evo, Neo, and Mono, in this construction... The construction matches the commerciality of these designs. We just don't feel that it makes sense to build a kite whose design parameter is 'best jumping kite possible with no sacrifices EXCEPT the entire construction'. Again, I understand the objections, just letting you know our logic on this one.

-Dan

[SolarSet]

it would interesting to hear if DT did anything for 2022 to improve their kite quality, just came back from Soma Bay and kite school there who uses DT kites every year has confirmed what being said here, DT 2021 are worst quality yet they ever had in their school. Maybe kite school is not best place to use DT but after few months of extensive use of students it might be good indicator how these kite will last regular ride for 2-3 years?
Its is planned obsolescence so people who can afford should buy their gear every year? Some of trainer there had DT/North kites from 2015/16 and they think that their personal kites have better condition of canopy than school 2021 kites.

[Havre]

Retail the increase is more like 23% than 15%. And that is an increase on an already expensive kite.

Obviously Duotone are free to do whatever. And I'm sure prices will drop if they are not selling. If they are selling it would be odd for them commercially to lower their prices. At least short term.

Feel sorry for riders who have been long time Rebel users though. If a 3 kite quiver sets you back €1500 more than a same sized XR-quiver you really would have to be quite addicted to the Rebel.

[Kemperman]

I really like my 2021 Rebel. But with those prices I think I will look at other brands.

[McLovin]

LOL - if you are reading this thread you are most likely a DT Rebel fan - kites are pretty inelastic since we gotta have 'em. If you are lucky enough to be a kiter and further fortunate enough to be considering NEW gear price really isn't a factor, and since there are many brands you have choices.

Good job DUOTONE making the best kites you can for all the styles. Given the supply chain issues its a WIN they are getting the job done in this market even if they have to use the off color materials to do it. (pretty sure the grey and pinks were the ones still around). Kudos to DAN from DT for his several replies and additions in a perfect voice as the company guy.

Hope to try them maybe next summer - as I have been a Rebel fan myself at least I was thru 2017 - was primed to buy a new Rebel quiver last year but without SLS had to make a switch over to a friendly monochromatic German, but alas I now have my eye on a cute new Canadian. Variety as they say, IS THE SPICE OF LIFE... be glad to be facing a small price bump for your kite gear, it's WORTH IT...

my .02

MC