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King of the Air 2021 - all info here (Marc Jacobs wins!)

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Kitemenn
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Re: King of the Air 2021 - all info here (Marc Jacobs wins!)

Postby Kitemenn » Thu Nov 25, 2021 4:19 pm

lindseym wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 2:41 pm
metrox wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:16 pm
Did only I saw this :o :(
Everything can happen etc, but this is not good move IMHO ...
Yes, I saw this too and it caught my attention. I think this was honestly done in good fun and joking around. Yes, this is a serious competition but many of these guys (and gal) know each other well and have alot of history together. Its not uncommon for some to show affection through crass remarks and gestures...kind of funny really. Yes, its probably not the wisest thing to do in a competition like this but after looking at the footage I genuinely believe that it was not really malicious and Kevin was just joking around. Yes, Kevin is super competitive but I definitely don't think he's one one to do something like that in anger.
I doubt that. What was the use of it if he were joking...he would have handled it after...think this was emotions taking over

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Re: King of the Air 2021 - all info here (Marc Jacobs wins!)

Postby McLovin » Thu Nov 25, 2021 7:44 pm

Havre wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:57 am
It might not be that KOTA is the right competition for it, but I would love to see a competition where what is considered the "best" "big air" kites for "normal" kiters actually shine. Then again I wouldn't know if they actually had jumped higher in the final if they had all been on Rebels?
Finally, an argument for the NASCAR of kiting - everyone gets the same RED kite and they can only pick from 8, 9, 10 based on rider weights - same boards too.

Now just need a sponsor????

Mc

:dance:

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Re: King of the Air 2021 - all info here (Marc Jacobs wins!)

Postby a99 » Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:34 pm

What is clear that we need HydroFoiling king of the air competition type:) Huge jumps with hydrofoils and with megaloops. That would be much more spectaculat as foils adds much more nicer view than tt in tricks. This will be next level of Kota definitely. But i think this will apprear in best way just after 5-10 years, but it will apprear definitely. That is good that they don’t need a lot of wind and no waves in general, so such competition is much easier to do. Even with no foil (board) offs such huge jumps are very impressive. I saw live 12 m hydrofoil jumps it is something totally amazing for eyes.
All kiter who foiling knows how after some time TT looks draggy and not elegant comparing with hydrofoils, and all who knows this feeling looks to TT as lower level of kiteboarding in general.

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Re: King of the Air 2021 - all info here (Marc Jacobs wins!)

Postby POACHER » Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:29 pm

Ummm..... No.
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Re: King of the Air 2021 - all info here (Marc Jacobs wins!)

Postby bragnouff » Thu Nov 25, 2021 9:59 pm

a99 wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:34 pm
What is clear that we need HydroFoiling king of the air competition type:) Huge jumps with hydrofoils and with megaloops. That would be much more spectaculat as foils adds much more nicer view than tt in tricks. This will be next level of Kota definitely. But i think this will apprear in best way just after 5-10 years, but it will apprear definitely. That is good that they don’t need a lot of wind and no waves in general, so such competition is much easier to do. Even with no foil (board) offs such huge jumps are very impressive. I saw live 12 m hydrofoil jumps it is something totally amazing for eyes.
All kiter who foiling knows how after some time TT looks draggy and not elegant comparing with hydrofoils, and all who knows this feeling looks to TT as lower level of kiteboarding in general.
There's actually nothing preventing anyone to enter the KOTA with a foil board if they wanted to.
Maybe that will become more common in various big air comps, but the KOTA is really specific, no fixed date, a window over a couple of weeks to allow the luxury of waiting for the right conditions, at least 25-30kts+ and good kickers, for which all the foil jumping advantages over a TT become pretty much irrelevant.

No one cares about big air comps in 15kts

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Re: King of the Air 2021 - all info here (Marc Jacobs wins!)

Postby Toby » Thu Nov 25, 2021 10:37 pm

the freestyle hydrofoil comps are fun to much...a lot of diversity of tricks. I hope they keep it...and stay hooked ;-)

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Re: King of the Air 2021 - all info here (Marc Jacobs wins!)

Postby Blackened » Fri Nov 26, 2021 3:25 am

Havre wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:57 am
Share many of Kim's views.

To me it almost sounds like they could split the current KOTA in two - one more focusing on extreme height and another competition focusing on more "tricks".

Not sure how much it matters, but as previously mentioned, I'm not convinced that what I perceive as the current direction is good for kite development for basically all riders not at Marc's level. Will Core now change their XR, which clearly goes high enough, but loop differently? Will kites be designed to yank you more brutally in loops because it looks more dramatic in competitions - even if most "normal" riders would rather have a smooth looping kite?

It might not be that KOTA is the right competition for it, but I would love to see a competition where what is considered the "best" "big air" kites for "normal" kiters actually shine. Then again I wouldn't know if they actually had jumped higher in the final if they had all been on Rebels?
Just need to make an Airstyle event.

Interesting idea. Hadlow was riding a weird 5-strut prototype this year that didn't look like a Rebel. I don't know how many brands would move away from their established kites to compete in this very narrow window though. The modern lofty 5-struts recover decently from loops these days and tons of people use them. If you pull early enough, you can get them low - just make sure you're at least 10m up before you go for a horizontal loop. They're still not rapid. They don't have the brutal acceleration of a GTS style kite, but they pull for longer to still get a decent distance traveled. I have no doubt Janek can win KOTA on his XR. Just needs to stop waiting until he's almost at the top of his jump before pulling. That's what us noobs do :)

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Re: King of the Air 2021 - all info here (Marc Jacobs wins!)

Postby Toby » Fri Nov 26, 2021 4:21 am

Kitemenn wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 4:19 pm
lindseym wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 2:41 pm
metrox wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 11:16 pm
Did only I saw this :o :(
Everything can happen etc, but this is not good move IMHO ...
Yes, I saw this too and it caught my attention. I think this was honestly done in good fun and joking around. Yes, this is a serious competition but many of these guys (and gal) know each other well and have alot of history together. Its not uncommon for some to show affection through crass remarks and gestures...kind of funny really. Yes, its probably not the wisest thing to do in a competition like this but after looking at the footage I genuinely believe that it was not really malicious and Kevin was just joking around. Yes, Kevin is super competitive but I definitely don't think he's one one to do something like that in anger.
I doubt that. What was the use of it if he were joking...he would have handled it after...think this was emotions taking over
Stig was going slow, while Kevin wanted to pass quickly to do more jumps.
Clearly this wasn’t friendly.

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Re: King of the Air 2021 - all info here (Marc Jacobs wins!)

Postby Kitemenn » Fri Nov 26, 2021 8:02 am

a99 wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 8:34 pm
What is clear that we need HydroFoiling king of the air competition type:) Huge jumps with hydrofoils and with megaloops. That would be much more spectaculat as foils adds much more nicer view than tt in tricks. This will be next level of Kota definitely. But i think this will apprear in best way just after 5-10 years, but it will apprear definitely. That is good that they don’t need a lot of wind and no waves in general, so such competition is much easier to do. Even with no foil (board) offs such huge jumps are very impressive. I saw live 12 m hydrofoil jumps it is something totally amazing for eyes.
All kiter who foiling knows how after some time TT looks draggy and not elegant comparing with hydrofoils, and all who knows this feeling looks to TT as lower level of kiteboarding in general.
Ever seen a hydrofoiler doing tricks big air...it looks very clumpie! It's a big thing to carry around mid air and def limits your ability to do rotations or other tricks. It's cool to see them going big but I think you get bored quite soon.

Not even talking about the big risk having 3 ninja's with blades in the air (these things can be sharp :O )

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Re: King of the Air 2021 - all info here (Marc Jacobs wins!)

Postby Havre » Fri Nov 26, 2021 11:10 am

Blackened wrote:
Fri Nov 26, 2021 3:25 am
Havre wrote:
Thu Nov 25, 2021 11:57 am
Share many of Kim's views.

To me it almost sounds like they could split the current KOTA in two - one more focusing on extreme height and another competition focusing on more "tricks".

Not sure how much it matters, but as previously mentioned, I'm not convinced that what I perceive as the current direction is good for kite development for basically all riders not at Marc's level. Will Core now change their XR, which clearly goes high enough, but loop differently? Will kites be designed to yank you more brutally in loops because it looks more dramatic in competitions - even if most "normal" riders would rather have a smooth looping kite?

It might not be that KOTA is the right competition for it, but I would love to see a competition where what is considered the "best" "big air" kites for "normal" kiters actually shine. Then again I wouldn't know if they actually had jumped higher in the final if they had all been on Rebels?
Just need to make an Airstyle event.

Interesting idea. Hadlow was riding a weird 5-strut prototype this year that didn't look like a Rebel. I don't know how many brands would move away from their established kites to compete in this very narrow window though. The modern lofty 5-struts recover decently from loops these days and tons of people use them. If you pull early enough, you can get them low - just make sure you're at least 10m up before you go for a horizontal loop. They're still not rapid. They don't have the brutal acceleration of a GTS style kite, but they pull for longer to still get a decent distance traveled. I have no doubt Janek can win KOTA on his XR. Just needs to stop waiting until he's almost at the top of his jump before pulling. That's what us noobs do :)
So far I guess none have, but if the Orbit keeps on winning I'm sure brands will start to ask themselves if they should modify their "big air" kites to be less "big air". Doesn't mean they will, but if that happens it would be negative for the average "big air" kiter in my opinion.

I'm often surprised how little even many experienced kiters know about the characteristics of their kites. I don't mean people on here (which is probably not a good representation of the average kiter), but people I talk to at spots. I guess I could include my earlier self in that category. I don't really regret buying my Enduros (excellent kite), but quite frankly, I had no idea what I was buying when I bought them. I guess the point being is that one might now see people getting an Orbit because it again won the KOTA - even if it might not be the best kite for someone slightly less skilled than Marc just wanting to go high. I'm not worried yet. And I don't mind if they make the Rebel slightly more "nimble" (as an example), but it would be sad (I think) if the traditional big air kites turned into Pivots (which they should, it seems, to compete in the KOTA).

Brands might also completely change. I have no idea if Ozone have decided not to participate for those reasons outlined, or if they just don't have a good enough kite/rider to do so, but you could reach a point where the KOTA becomes for such specialized kites for professionals that it is better to not be there. At least this year Ozone didn't prove they can't win - the XR7 and others kind of did (exaggerating a bit).


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