Soul 6m vs UFO 9m low end

[Jyoder]

Can anyone with actual experience with the two compare the low end peak power? My suspicion is a 9m UFO wouldn’t get me going on kitefoil in less wind than my 6m Soul but I’m curious.

[jakemoore]

Soul beats UFO for absolute bottom end under ideal conditions. But the UFO sheds sand better, dries faster and is happier sitting deep in the window so there are some conditions that will favor the UFO.

[grigorib]

What is your weight and what foil do you ride? Being able to keep a kite in the air doesn’t mean one will be able to ride ot

[rnelias]

not exactly the comparison you're looking for but I have a Soul 8m and a Boxer 9m (1-struct). In the 8-10k range I find much easier to start foiling with my Boxer than with Soul on 16m lines on my local spot. In this range (or a little bit lighter) I can foil with Soul 12m.

For reference
F-One IC6 850 wing + IC6 400 stab
95cm mast
pocket board
73kg rider

[TritonFoils]

Having used both extensively the 9m SS (at 75kg on a 1200cm2 wing) likely would keep u up and riding in less wind than the 6m FS. But… the 6m FS as a higher aspect kite has a terrific pull when u loop on your water start. This can get u up in wind speeds as low as 9m SS. But… 6m FS is not going to keep you going, once u are riding, in as wind as light as the 9m SS. In sum, the 9m SS will beat the 6m FS on the low end with the caveat that u need to get up riding and the 9m SS is conspicuously gutless in its loops. Final thought: the 6m FS is a much funnier kite to fly. It turns fast for a ram air, water relaunches 87% of the time and flys much more forward in the wind window which is nice when u are foiling re being pulled forward as opposed to down wind as compared to the 9m SS which rides deep in the wind window especially in light conditions.

Hope this helps.

Rudy @TritonFoils

[TritonFoils]

Having used both extensively the 9m SS (at 75kg on a 1200cm2 wing) likely would keep u up and riding in less wind than the 6m FS. But… the 6m FS as a higher aspect kite has a terrific pull when u loop on your water start. This can get u up in wind speeds as low as 9m SS. But… 6m FS is not going to keep you going, once u are riding, in as wind as light as the 9m SS. In sum, the 9m SS will beat the 6m FS on the low end with the caveat that u need to get up riding and the 9m SS is conspicuously gutless in its loops. Final thought: the 6m FS is a much more fun kite to fly. It turns fast for a ram air, water relaunches 87% of the time , has way lighter bar pressure than the 9m SS and flys much more forward in the wind window which is nice when u are foiling re being pulled forward as opposed to down wind as compared to the 9m SS which rides deep in the wind window especially in light conditions.

Hope this helps.

Rudy @TritonFoils

[Jyoder]

What is your weight and what foil do you ride? Being able to keep a kite in the air doesn’t mean one will be able to ride ot

75kg, Sabfoil 637/420/111cm + strapless pocketboard (110cm)

Expert foiler, but mere mortal compared to Fred Hope, though I try to emulate his style/tricks. I can ride the 6m Soul if steady 11-12knots, especially if occasional higher gust to use for start and transitions.

I recently got a 5m UFO v1.1 and it’s really fun for 15knots+. Saw a 9m for sale and considered it, but sounds like I’m better off just keeping 6m Soul which I also like a lot, just takes some time to adjust timing, technique, and muscle memory if switching between 5m ufo and 6m soul.

My 11m foil kite is finally retired so now my quiver is:
18m race foilkite, 6m Soul, 5m UFO, and 4m SST. I ride the same hydrofoil for everything, and nothing else.

I need a kite for when 6m Soul is not enough but wind and location make using 18m a pain. Probably need another 10-11m foilkite.

[Trent hink]

Those two kites are extremely different.

I only briefly had a chance to try the 9 m UFO, but if you are looking for low-end, you might want to compare it to the 8m Soul.

UFO is a good kite, for sure .

But they are different, and what you need depends on what you really want to do

And, for example, the Soul wil most likely perform much better at the upper end of the usable wind-range...

[TritonFoils]

This is a good point. The 6m Soul FY has a much bigger wind range as ram air kites do vs LEI. 9m SS UFO doesn’t seem to like it’s low end wind range as the kite flys deeper back in the wind window (like all LEI but possibly more given no strut in canopy) and the bar pressure increases significantly if that matters to you. It shines when u get out of its low range but then starts to get very grunty and flappy as it approaches its higher wind limit (mid teens kts). In short it has about a wind range of about 5kts where it really shines vs the 6m FS Soul which is fun to ride from the low to low 20s or 9-11kts wind range. I agree the better head to head comparison would be the 8m FY Soul vs 9m UFO SS. Here the 8m FY would definitely outperform the SS with the exception of some possible low end performance on the UFO when u are up and riding - say 1/2kts max of lower wind range. But again I find in very light wind 9-10kts it’s hard to get a big power spike out of the UFO 9m and pull yourself up on to the foil. Personally the combo of the 6M Soul and 9m Sonic 3 FS is pretty much the perfect two kite quiver. It takes me at 75kg on a 1200cm2 equivalent wing from 9kts to the mid 20s. Add on top a 4 or 3m SS UFO and u are covered to the low 30s when foiling starts to get pretty Darwinian and best avoided.

Rudy @TritonFoils

[jakemoore]

637/420/111cm ...... try to emulate his style/tricks

...1200cm2 wing ....the 6m FS as a higher aspect kite has a terrific pull when u loop on your water start. ....9m SS is conspicuously gutless in its loops. ....

It probably depends also on line length and hydrofoil. That Triton mono-wing looks more out of this world than the UFO kite and maybe the two of them are a better match for a particular style of fun riding. I bet we can agree Triton is not a race wing just as the UFO is not a race kite.

For me the only determination of a kites low end is if it has enough power spike to get my body up onto the board and then bring the board to the surface. Once foiling, I can easily sail into a lull that is too light for me to start again by using the kites apparent wind and the foil efficiency. If a Soul has the power to give a water start, but not enough to keep riding that means it is getting to the edge of the wind window too fast.

The single- skins and zero-strut kites I have flow have all suffered this problem of diminishing returns over about a 6-7 meter size where loops are gutless and the kite only gives a tiny increase in low end power. If I were to add a UFO bigger than my 7 I would not add it to increase my low end range, but to add it to get more static pull in the wind-range where it is good. For OP a 9 UFO and a bigger front wing would probably be a fun addition for strapless progression.