2023 Naish Pivot S27

[Luffe]

I guess I'll just go with the s27 12m Pivot. Seems like people are happy with it, and it seems to be pretty fast turning for the type of kite it is. Will it work with my 2020 Naish bar?

[Dirk]

Yes.

[Aleza]

I have a 9m and 12m S27. I had the 9m S26 and before the S25.
I tried the 9m s27 only once, in 30+kn. It seems to preserve the S26 improvements against the S25 (better drift, more stable, easier to use) but looping is more aggressive (even landing loop requires a bit more attention..). Moreover seems to be easier to time for jumping in choppy condition.
The 12m i had it out twice, in medium-low wind (gusting at 20kn). It is a nice kite, it does not pull like a tractor (it is actually maybe a bit too light, but the wind was light) and it has good lift even if not lit. BUT, pumped ad 7.5 psi, the tip flare out when jumping a bit (below 8m). Pumped at 8.5 it does not flare out, but must be tested when lit… In general, the tips seems to be not so rigid.

[Hugh2]

In light of various comments about the 12m Pivots in the past I have avoided them. I have an 11m from 2018 that is fine. But for a 12m I decided to go to Duotone Dice and that is a nice all round kite with the same kook-proof system for the bridle to lines, so is easy to just use one bar, a North Navigator, on all my kites. If you can afford it, the SLS version is even better, I rode a friend's in Cape Town when he finished a foil session on it and I took a surfboard and it flew amazingly well in those light conditions and I was able to stay upwind. Can't speak to strong conditions, but it certainly is a popular kite in the smaller sizes in Cape Town.

[southernskip]

Me and a mate sold are selling all our s26s 12/11/9/7 after trying the s27 10m and an s25 10. S26s were prone to shuddering when loading up or in gusts so jumps were very inconsistent and never got close to what I'd jumped on orbits or edges. 12 the tips got very flappy in the gusts. S26 11 had horrid bar pressure and barely any more lowend than the 9. 9 was the fav of the lot but got into bad habits throwing my kite loops early in the jump as it was safer than having the kite shudder and accidently throwing a hospital loop on the way down of a 6m jump when it should have been near the peak of a 10

Fav kite was actually the s25 10. Man that thing loops well and consistently handled everything I could throw at it. S27 was much improved on the S26 but it feels like a different kite to me. Loops and helis = more yankage as Aleza mentioned above.

Also avoid the torque 2 with I3 bar. The I3 can barely twist by hand and after 5 sessions the leash line knot gets caught in the quick release. I got thrashed when kite deathlooped into the waves at 50 knots. The new one uses the classic naish chicken loop with dual PU lines for auto untwist. Is a far better product than the third party one they borrowed for the I3.

Yet another bar is in design phase to replace the newer one too apparently. Man they have put out a lot of bars in the last couple of years haha

[Kitedicted]

Me and a mate sold are selling all our s26s 12/11/9/7 after trying the s27 10m and an s25 10. S26s were prone to shuddering when loading up or in gusts so jumps were very inconsistent and never got close to what I'd jumped on orbits or edges. 12 the tips got very flappy in the gusts. S26 11 had horrid bar pressure and barely any more lowend than the 9. 9 was the fav of the lot but got into bad habits throwing my kite loops early in the jump as it was safer than having the kite shudder and accidently throwing a hospital loop on the way down of a 6m jump when it should have been near the peak of a 10

Fav kite was actually the s25 10. Man that thing loops well and consistently handled everything I could throw at it. S27 was much improved on the S26 but it feels like a different kite to me. Loops and helis = more yankage as Aleza mentioned above.

Are you a heavy rider? I haven't noticed any stability issues on the S26 9m even when properly powered (was out in 35 knot gust) at 70kg. I have sometimes noticed slight wingtip bending on my 12 but only once I think, maybe not fully pumped.

Also was out on the 12 again it feels playful, elegant and nimble no "truck" feelings on it to whomever was asking.

[southernskip]

12 is very nimble and not like the older trucky versions for sure. I am 80kg. But we have very gusty conditions here and lads are pushing those 12s mid to late 20knots.9 to gusting 40. Happens more on the high wind mode but pivot kite helis / loops much better in that mode IMO

[Kitedicted]

12 is very nimble and not like the older trucky versions for sure. I am 80kg. But we have very gusty conditions here and lads are pushing those 12s mid to late 20knots.9 to gusting 40. Happens more on the high wind mode but pivot kite helis / loops much better in that mode IMO

How did you like looping the 9 pivot vs the orbit?

[southernskip]

@kitedicted As mentioned above I got into bad habits due to inconsistent jumping in the gusts and I may have even preferred the loop on the 11m sizes but comparing say the sweet spot 9m sizes Pivot S26 vs Orbit 2022...


Both loop fast. Pivot possibly faster turning. But there's a specific technique for the Pivot whereas Orbit you can mess up and it still catches you.
Note: I put the Pivots in high wind mode which closes the kite a bit. Kite loops far better in this mode but getting jump height is harder. I confirmed this with a Naish pro rider who was here recently.

With the Pivot you have to let the bar out a bit (say halfway). Loop too tight and it stalls before returning to 12. You also have to hold the bar in a bit during the catch which can slow it a bit but it prevents a full depower canopy flap situation (which stalls the catch halfway up and you eat it). Orbit is far faster in a straight line so and can fly on front lines only so you can let the bar all the way out (or spin it and let go) during the catch.

Note: S27 has a far more stable wingtips and frame, smoother bar pressure but i haven't tested it enough to know whether the catch is faster. Jumps are definitely easier / more consistent and that's a huge plus for looping

Comparing what ive tried recently:
S26 Pivot - Loops took me a long time to figure out. Most forgiving kite to heli and land here. Hangtime great if you can get up there with its quirks. Sold.
Orbit - Easiest looper by far. Can do at any height. Jumps high but hangtime probably the least out of kites listed here though and helis are mandatory. Ordered.
Edge V10 - Have to use the same technique as above but catch is fast with a huge teeth clenching yank. Jumps are consistently mental and helis are super easy and required - likes to stay moving. Want.
XR7. Loops are smooth and pull hard but wouldn't advise learning them on a 9m as jumping over 7m is a must. Found helis strangely scary on this one. Is a cheat code for jumping big no matter how you send it. Don't want - Feel detached from the kite. (have a teeny XR6 for the missus)
XS - Yanks hard in loops with its long wingtips but catches like the orbit. Jumps massive with big hangtime if you find the sweet spot. Own 8m.

Want to get my hands on a Rebel next. Casati and Principi are ridiculous

[Aleza]

I agree with @southernskip analysis.
I tried the 11 s26 a couple of times and I also got the impression that has similar lowend of the 9…
However, concerning the 9m S26/26/27:
The S25 frame was full of dacron, resulting in a stiff but heavy frame. Light bar pressure, yank in jumping BUT take care in landing loop, easy to stall in drift, really reactive in gust (jumping forward in the wind window).
In the S26 the dacron is much less, resulting in a lightweight kite probably with a not so stiff frame. Bar pressure is much higher than S25, less yank, less consistency in jumping, easier to land loop easier to drift.
The S27 is lightweight probably as the S26, but the new bridle make it again stiff. So is aggressive as the S25 but it drift good as the S26.

This is for the 9, the 12 is another kite in my opinion.