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Kite Release Fuse

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tweoistom
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Re: Kite Release Fuse

Postby tweoistom » Wed Nov 06, 2019 9:00 am

Format would be something like 110% when switched on - say for landing and launching and then overridden when normally riding.

I weigh 75kg so it wouldn't do anything unless I was being yanked along or upwards with 82.5kg

Agreed wouldn't be much use for megaloops etc as this is basically a controlled lofting.

Not saying it would be easy just thinking that there is still room for design to increase the safety in our sport, it happened with ski bindings, seat belts etc. All mechanisms that work all day long reliably and safely.

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Re: Kite Release Fuse

Postby evan » Wed Nov 06, 2019 9:22 am

I highly doubt that 110% figure.

Maybe for mowing the lawn underpowered, but anyone that does slightly more than that should easily exceed 2x body weight from now and then.
For riding overpowerd and jumping you can go to 2-4x bodyweight.

Have a racing testrider of 100kg that easily bends 4*25mm stainless steel rings that stay perfectly round up to 250kgf.


All forces that easily jank you up and around if you don't pay attention on land and impossible to make a fuse for. Unless you render the fuse into a non working state when riding and only switch it on when launching and landing.

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Re: Kite Release Fuse

Postby leeuwen » Wed Nov 06, 2019 11:29 am

I think the easiest implementation would not be a fuse but some way of doing an unhooked launch without the unhooking resulting in a fully powered bar.
I imagine a stopperball below the bar would easily do this for you.
Basically it will get yanked out of your hands it is to much.

tweoistom
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Re: Kite Release Fuse

Postby tweoistom » Wed Nov 06, 2019 2:12 pm

evan wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 9:22 am
I highly doubt that 110% figure.

Maybe for mowing the lawn underpowered, but anyone that does slightly more than that should easily exceed 2x body weight from now and then.
For riding overpowerd and jumping you can go to 2-4x bodyweight.

Have a racing testrider of 100kg that easily bends 4*25mm stainless steel rings that stay perfectly round up to 250kgf.


All forces that easily yank you up and around if you don't pay attention on land and impossible to make a fuse for. Unless you render the fuse into a non working state when riding and only switch it on when launching and landing.
That's my thinking exactly when coming in you could change the fuse to active meaning the kite would be able to pull you around but only a little until a large gust came in flagging the kite out. 110% was a figure just plucked from the air as it were. Just enough to allow for tolerances but not really enough to have the kite take over.

Agree that education on where to put the kite when on land is very important but at my local spot you have to take it overhead to walk between cars and vans etc down a boat ramp so don't have much freedom to do the safest practice.

I like the simplicity of the stopper ball idea, think that should work as long as the kite can flag all the way. It shouldn't affect the main flagging out process - Though I would want to look at my bar and see what is possible.

leeuwen
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Re: Kite Release Fuse

Postby leeuwen » Wed Nov 06, 2019 3:01 pm

Do note that the stopper ball idea will make front stalls more likely. Also steering might be problematic if the steering lines are to slack.

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Horst Sergio
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Re: Kite Release Fuse

Postby Horst Sergio » Wed Nov 06, 2019 4:35 pm

tweoistom wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 2:12 pm
Agree that education on where to put the kite when on land is very important but at my local spot you have to take it overhead to walk between cars and vans etc down a boat ramp so don't have much freedom to do the safest practice. ...
Sorry, but NO

I expect there is and there wont be any magic fuse toy you can build or buy to solve this problem.
The only solution for the problem to get lifted, out of control and crash is:

Experience, Education and Experience, which takes time you have to take to be safe.
- Try to go with experienced people, who are able to understand the weather conditions,
- go to spots with the distance to objects which your level of experience requires
- build the smaller kite and use the bigger board.

To give you just a few examples of gear I build to make kiting safer, but never with 100% success:
Kitehandle-active-QR.jpg
This is a kite handle with a self releasing system. In a time where not even any safety system existed, the idea was to not even have the need to active QR but having a system that releases by itself when the rider is unconscious for example. When holding the shown red handle with its lever you close in the small green string. In total you have a 1:40 force ratio, which alows also to jump hooked in. For having a safety as we have today the system worked perfect, for the idea to also release much faster when getting lifted, it did not!

When you get lifted in a gust it is to much harmonic starting from a little pull on one side but on the other side you reach too fast 2 m or more when its to late to release or in this case just open your hand. Just check the videos of guys getting lifted unhooked, they always miss the moment. Just one time I released in 1 m hight and conclusion was to never release again as I hurted more then ever, as body was just not prepaired for impact. I was happy with the system in the year 2000 when most where completely with out QR till the first casualties arrived kiteboarding, but it didn't solve your problem of lifting.

Another example why in my experience switiching a fuse on the beach wont work, as I use a similar system since about 5 years since I am foiling.

Image

It is pretty much the oposite of the old system. I use a kind of a full suicide leash that bridges most potential parts that can break in the harness and chickenloop. I would not recommend to anybody to use such a system, but most sessions when I do board offs with foils I hook in as more being affraid to face plant on my foil, when I hook of or something breaks ... ask Len10.
The problem is, that even after 5 years of usage in about 50% of the cases when coming back to beach I forget to hook of the system again ...

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Re: Kite Release Fuse

Postby edt » Wed Nov 06, 2019 5:00 pm

go take a look at some woo readings you can get 2-4g's just riding around. Some launches are just sketch as hell, I'm not sure there's any gear that will make your launch less risky.

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Re: Kite Release Fuse

Postby tweoistom » Tue Nov 12, 2019 11:35 am

Thanks everyone for your input. Interesting food for thought - any system would rely on the correct training just as correct kite technique would at any point. I'll let this one bubble away a little more as I am sure there are still ways to make kiting a safer sport - design oriented or not.

As for my launch and landing spot I will probably stick to flagging the kite out when landing where possible and drift launch to keep me as far away from hard objects as I can.

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purdyd
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Re: Kite Release Fuse

Postby purdyd » Tue Nov 12, 2019 2:30 pm

This was tried many years ago. Mike couldn’t get manufactured to the proper tolerances.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2328899&hilit=Kirnak

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2333342&hilit=Kirnak

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Re: Kite Release Fuse

Postby jakemoore » Tue Nov 12, 2019 2:42 pm

leeuwen wrote:
Wed Nov 06, 2019 11:29 am
I think the easiest implementation would not be a fuse but some way of doing an unhooked launch without the unhooking resulting in a fully powered bar.
I imagine a stopperball below the bar would easily do this for you.
Basically it will get yanked out of your hands it is to much.
Just hold the chicken loop in your hand. Hold the chicken loop and not the bar. The kite rests on its shoulder on the ground without need for bar input. It’s like a tethered ghost launch but rather than hooking the chicken loop to a hard object it is in your hand.


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