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Simple short line extensions - is a figure-8 knot ok?

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merl
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Re: Simple short line extensions - is a figure-8 knot ok?

Postby merl » Fri Sep 25, 2020 1:15 pm

Generally the idea is fine. The specific line you bought is 1.8mm sleeved line, so the actual load bearing dyneema core is maybe 1mm which is going to be much weaker than the lines on either side. It might be fine, but as mentioned it would have been better to get unsleeved dyneema.
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mister-z (Fri Sep 25, 2020 3:57 pm)
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Re: Simple short line extensions - is a figure-8 knot ok?

Postby wavy navy » Fri Sep 25, 2020 5:34 pm

We are foiling not megalooping. No problem sir.

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edt
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Re: Simple short line extensions - is a figure-8 knot ok?

Postby edt » Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:06 pm

That's west marine spider line 350 pound strength doubled it's 700 pounds but because it's sleeved it should loose less than 10 percent on a figure 8 knot so take takes it to around 600 pounds or 275 kg or so. I take back what I said about it being above spec 600 pound line is fine but it's not over spec. Should still be fine I think because the sleeving means the knots don't reduce breaking strength too much. You have to make perfect knots tho you probably already know that don't make sloppy knots

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Re: Simple short line extensions -- is a figure-8 knot ok?

Postby mister-z » Sat Sep 26, 2020 3:26 am

Trent hink wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 12:56 am
I'd just slide the metal ring up the rear bridle to double it up and and then tie a fiqure 8 in it.
Tried this just now but the line is spliced and stitched, so it's pretty stiff. Feels cleaner to just use extensions

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Re: Simple short line extensions - is a figure-8 knot ok?

Postby knot_moving » Sat Sep 26, 2020 5:30 am

edt wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:06 pm
That's west marine spider line 350 pound strength doubled it's 700 pounds but because it's sleeved it should loose less than 10 percent on a figure 8 knot so take takes it to around 600 pounds or 275 kg or so. I take back what I said about it being above spec 600 pound line is fine but it's not over spec. Should still be fine I think because the sleeving means the knots don't reduce breaking strength too much. You have to make perfect knots tho you probably already know that don't make sloppy knots
Spyderline I used to make bridal replacement parts has a braided core. Probably doesn’t change your conclusion tho. Knot is past the larks head too, so that likely takes some more load off the knot

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Re: Simple short line extensions - is a figure-8 knot ok?

Postby mrandrewandrade » Sat Sep 26, 2020 7:48 pm

I have done this before with a simple looped overhand hand knot and it's been working fine. I have done this on bridles and as short line extensions.

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Re: Simple short line extensions - is a figure-8 knot ok?

Postby Trent hink » Sat Sep 26, 2020 7:59 pm

Are you sure that your bar and lines are tuned correctly? It seems strange to me that it would work properly on other kites but not provide enough backstall on the peak 4.

Also, the normal tendency is for the front lines to stretch over time relative to the back lines. Is everything brand new?

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Re: Simple short line extensions - is a figure-8 knot ok?

Postby evan » Sat Sep 26, 2020 8:25 pm

Trent hink wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 7:59 pm
Also, the normal tendency is for the front lines to stretch over time relative to the back lines. Is everything brand new?
Correction: All 4 lines shrink over time, but the unloaded back lines shrink more.

This gives the same effect, but the cause is fundamentally different.


A simple solution to add more backstall: tie some more knot into the leader lines of your bar or into the pigtails of the kite. Much safer than fiddling with the power lines as backlines are barely loaded and it doesn't add extra stuff to your setup.

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Re: Simple short line extensions - is a figure-8 knot ok?

Postby Trent hink » Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:32 pm

Double post
Last edited by Trent hink on Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Trent hink
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Re: Simple short line extensions - is a figure-8 knot ok?

Postby Trent hink » Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:38 pm

I tried to make it simple which is why I used the word "relative"

I am pretty sure that the leader lines on the peak 4 are oversized to the point where a simple figure 8 on the rear lines should work just fine, the only question is if the resulting knot would be large enough to keep the lark's head from slipping off.

Of course you could add some sleeving to bulk up the knot, but the metal ring might make that difficult.

If you have any spare line left over from your extensions, take a short bit and pull out the core, then see if it is possible to compress the outer braid enough to slip it on over the metal ring... It might work.


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