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Bar/lines check

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Floating around
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Bar/lines check

Postby Floating around » Mon May 17, 2021 6:56 am

Hi all,

Well I have just put together my first bar/line set. Have always had pre made commercial ones but decided I wanted a project! It is intended only for hydrofoiling with an emphasis on light weight for traveling.
As I haven’t done anything like this before I thought I would ask for the collective to have a look at it, just to make sure there are no gross safety issues I have overlooked. Or any improvements to suggest.

Specs,
Groove carbon v2 bar, 52cm
Center lines, Liros dc-401
Steering lines, Liros dc-301
Depower rope, SL-99 4mm
Bar throw, 60cm
Trim range, 30cm
Steering leaders, 2.5mm SK-78. (Couldn’t fit anything bigger through the holes, will change for coloured when I find some)
Quick release, infection seatbelt. (Never used this type before) I have added a mini wichard clip to the safety release line to make attachment easer, a little concerned that this could catch the main ring.

I will add some pu tube to the steering leaders when I can find it.

All up weight at the moment is a little under 400g with 15M lines.
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Re: Bar/lines check

Postby Breze » Mon May 17, 2021 8:07 am

Nice work! I did basically the same, works good since 1.5 years.
Image
For fixing the QR, i used a softshakle.I trimmed the length for most ergonomic elbow position when foiling.
For untwisting the QR, a triangle fixline to the harness bar would be nice, then the fixline does not get twisted if you twist the QR with too much force on the frontlines.
Image
Here is a vid with an easy overhand knot


I had the same solution as you ,down at the QR -ring with the safetyline. With the guiding ring of the safetyline fixed with a short 3-4 cm line at the depowerline, the safetyline is running much better through the ring and does not get blocked against the ball. Here you can see the short red lines with the ring.
Image

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Re: Bar/lines check

Postby Herman » Mon May 17, 2021 8:47 am

Nice looking job, I would definitely use it. Minor observations for consideration:

1. Looks like just a whipping for centre line pigs to friction ring. I prefer ~20mm of splice and stitching or whipping, maybe just my eyes or photo. Maybe a low friction ring is not required, could use an SS thimble, cheaper and sits better with a splice?

2. Personally I would prefer an Opti eye trigger shackle to the Wichard hook for the leash.

3. The sleeving on the bottom of the centre flaggable flying line may ruck and catch when pulling back through for re-ride.

For point 3 if I did not intend to do a lot of flagging I would actually get rid of the small ring and go dyneema on dyneema. There is info on this on another thread but I don’t have any personal experience on that but I did do some heat/wear testing. Keep an eye out for wear at the bar dugout.

Emphasis on the nice looking job!
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Floating around (Mon May 17, 2021 9:21 am)
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Floating around
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Re: Bar/lines check

Postby Floating around » Mon May 17, 2021 9:20 am

Hi Breeze,

Thanks for the tips on the QR mounting. Good point about the twisting, will be annoying to untwist and have it spring back a turn each time.... I have made and re made the loop that attaches it to the spreader several times and expect I will do it several more until I’m happy! At the moment it slides in between the little pins left over from the hook, this will probably be annoying as well. Time to get the splicing gear out again.

Will look in to the safety ring location. I kind of like that it is a bit locked in position now, don’t like things flapping around.

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Re: Bar/lines check

Postby Floating around » Mon May 17, 2021 9:32 am

Hi Herman,

Thanks for the compliments! I do try and make things look nice as well as functional.

To reply to your points,

1.
Both ends are spliced loops with the tails overlapping in the middle of the line. Don’t remember the exact bury length but I didn’t do any splices with les than 65x. The line is only whipped on to the low friction ring. Not 100% happy with this but didn’t come up with a tidy option.

2.
What is an opti eye shackle? Can you provide a link or picture? Picked up the baby wichard from a local chandelier, to cute not to buy! Had to find something to do with it.

3.
Yes it dose! It is not a proper sleeve. Just slipped over the line after splicing to give a little protection from the SS ring. I will try and tidy/taper the top so it can be reset without issues. Generally a flag out for me is a swim home and beach reset. I did look a lot at the pure spectra loop without the ring. Still on the fence about it. Thought to go with the ring to start and when I’m confident with the whole setup start to bring in items like that. I prefer to get rid of as much metal as possible!
First bit that has to go is the SS ring retaining the re power line. Might do a hole through a stopper ball for it.

Regards,

Herman
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Re: Bar/lines check

Postby Herman » Mon May 17, 2021 10:27 am

The opti swivel eye snap was a standard Optimist dinghy part, not sure whether this is still the case. They are tiny, but I have not had any failures. Jaws will open if pulled on both sides but this is not an issue for the way I use them with a leash. Easy to use with one hand. I use the next size up for TT. Photo of just googled search attached.

Personally I am ok with dyneema/dyneema flag but as said this is based on judgement rather than experience. If I were building a test model I would even go with dyneema/dyneema for the trim bracket and only modify with a thimble if it were needed for ergonomics or getting hot through a need to trim a lot, [like old race bar riding on the trim line rather than bar sheeting].

With regard to low friction ring/whipping. Not talking bury length, just instead of whipping, pass one line through the other, probably better as two alternate passes through as a weave rather than insertion, bit like a Brummell lock. There will be less load on the whipping, if you still feel the need to use a whipping.
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Floating around
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Re: Bar/lines check

Postby Floating around » Mon May 24, 2021 5:48 pm

Hi All,

Well I have had a couple of plays with the bar, not enough wind to actually get going.... but had a nice swim!
So, in general I love the bar but. Leader lines all the same colour nearly got me in trouble once already and managed to get a wrap around the end of the bar as well!
Have found som coloured but low strength lines to replace the steering leaders and will get some PU tube soon. That should take care of those issues.
The trim system using the rope going through the centre as a jammer seems to hold fine. The release is not smooth and released the trim completely most times. It is very sensitive. Pulling trim on was a little sticky but went in the end. I may have to try different lengths of bury to see if there is any improvement. Not really a problem for those who don’t use the trim allot.
And lastly my pretty whipping is coming undone.... I didn’t finish all the ends properly so will have to do again.
What do people think about a drop of superglue to lock them in place?

Thanks.

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Re: Bar/lines check

Postby Herman » Mon May 24, 2021 7:22 pm

Thanks for the update, will be interesting to see what length of bury you settle on for the running splice trim.

For the whipping superglue may work but I just sow the ends into the line. If you were making the mk2 I suspect you might not want to use this type of low friction ring as your trim bracket slider. An orbit block or something like the ozone trim bracket would obviate the need for a whipping and allow for a neater handshake attachment of the front lines/pigs. The problem with the ring is it is not thimble shaped so a splice would have an awkward orthogonal entry putting the fibres through an undesirabley tight radius.

As you say colour coding is very useful. I even like to have the front lines colour coded for opposite front/back line pulling even though I know which side is attached to the front flag, I try to avoid having to think. I just use coloured tape on the pigs, it does not have to be muchimho. Thanks again for passing on your experience........ Regards Herman.

Floating around
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Re: Bar/lines check

Postby Floating around » Mon May 24, 2021 8:48 pm

Hi Herman,

Thanks for your comments. I actually bought an ozone trimmer bracket for this bar. I’m suspicious if it is an original as it is a little roughly made, the part where the depower line turns around was so rough that it started to pull fibres out of the rope. It is also very heavy! This was bought from a large online sports store. So this is when I went to the low friction ring. I may well try the cross splice you mentioned to retain the ring, I did initially look at doing that but couldn’t find any info on what it dose to the strength of the rope. I expect the whipping will give some warning before parting company so not to worried at the moment.
Completely agree on the colour coding, sometimes you don’t have time to think about things they just need to be obvious.

Herman
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Re: Bar/lines check

Postby Herman » Mon May 24, 2021 11:16 pm

I bought an Ozone bracket a few months ago from Kitemare UK which I presume to be genuine and have yet to use it and so just had a look at it. The fairlead area you mentioned is not a mirror finish on mine either but looks good enough to use and of course as it is SS it will have more weight than a alloy ring of similar volume. One thing I will say, dyneema will polish SS in use and so your unit might come in useful for a jumping bar. I know this because I have worn through a number of thin SS bar inserts. ( I liked the Ozone stopper ball that came with the bracket.)

If you wanted to go minimalist you could look at the alloy Ronstan shock blocks, if you have not already done so. I have been using these as single pulley bridle runner for at least a couple of years on kites used for reasonably aggressive TT riding. Cab SS style equivalent sliders also appears on EBay occasionally. Unfortunately you would lose the redundancy of a dyneema wrap which is a great feature of your set up.

One day I might get round to trying just a dyneema loop, versus a loop covered with PU or Nylon pneumatic tube, but don’t hold your breath as it is going to be a while before I wear through that Ozone bracket :lol:

PS Just an after thought to make sure you are running the depower line around the eye not through it on the Ozone bracket.


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