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Pros and Cons of learning strapless

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Flag53
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Re: Pros and Cons of learning strapless

Postby Flag53 » Sun Sep 18, 2016 2:20 pm

Thanks Peter, I will persevere unless my progression stalls, maybe then I will reconsider.

Thanks everyone for taking the time to reply

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Re: Pros and Cons of learning strapless

Postby Regis-de-giens » Sun Sep 18, 2016 8:41 pm

I removed the front strap right after being able to foil-up 100 meters, with no actual problem and the good pleasur to fall safely : -).

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Re: Pros and Cons of learning strapless

Postby Bradford » Sun Sep 18, 2016 11:45 pm

Forgot to mention potential downside. The board can get away from you. If it goes downwind and you drop your kite it can get tangled in the lines. It has happened to me twice. Both times were jibes with a big kite. I couldn't complete the turns, went too fast downwind and slacked the lines. Kite hindenburged on my foil. Very scary situations and I was very lucky it didn't end badly. I don't know how frequently this happens to others, I might have been doing things others don't. I am now much more aware of where my board might end up when I fall. I'm also prepared to start wrapping a line if does happen again to avoid a potential death loop situation.

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Re: Pros and Cons of learning strapless

Postby paulOz » Mon Sep 19, 2016 1:57 am

Another Con I think would be:

If the is kite down in light weather and you are struggling to re-launch, it can assist greatly to have some extra resistance provided by having the board on your feet and in the water start position.
You can't do this strapless I suspect, and also, you will have to hang on to that board whilst trying to re-launch the kite.
I also imagine if you are pushing the low wind limits, where you need to work that kite like crazy, it will take longer than the board will stay in position for you.

ps, I like the idea of strapless but haven't been there yet. I only have from straps and they are very loose.
pps. with my first foil board I manged to push heel dents through being bent over backwards in crashes a couple of times, so I do appreciate the issue.

cheers

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Re: Pros and Cons of learning strapless

Postby dksurfer » Mon Sep 19, 2016 2:10 am

In marginal conditions I find it really hard or impossible to get on a strapless board. Having the front straps it is way easier to get on the board in light (marginal) conditions. For me marginal conditions is around 7 knts. Kite still flies well but with very little power. When well powered strapless works well.

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Re: Pros and Cons of learning strapless

Postby geopeck » Mon Sep 19, 2016 5:54 am

I learned strapless, I think my progression was about normal speed - feels super slow and then it clicks bit by bit. Me and a friend got foils at the same time, him a strapped LF and me a MHL. We both learned at the same rate. He still goes into the water to switch stance though.

One thing I didn't deal with that I saw other learners doing was that I never humped the foil back into the beach, landed the kite and moved the straps or foil mount around. There was definitely some gear blaming going on at my beach. I had my questions too, they just weren't about straps.

99% of my crashes would not have been prevented by straps. I was mostly happy to be able to get away from the board when going down. I also, after a while, started making some crazy recoveries involving submarining the entire board and kicking a foot out for balance and worming my way through without having to waterstart again. That isn't really a pro I guess but testament to the foil having some kind of weird stability that you can get figured out way past what you would think, and straps maybe hurting that process.

I think that strapless helped waterstarts as well. Lots and lots of learning is going to happen as you are getting beaten up, feeling underpowered and having your internal wind sock confused by the new angles to the wind you are making. I found pretty quick that lots of my starts were super dodgy, especially by the end of a session, and I was dancing all over the board to keep my weight up and speed in check. Pretty soon it turns into riding every time you can get enough tug to get your weight over the board.

Sounds like you're on the strapless track anyway, so have fun and report back.

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Re: Pros and Cons of learning strapless

Postby Peter_Frank » Mon Sep 19, 2016 6:59 am

dksurfer wrote:In marginal conditions I find it really hard or impossible to get on a strapless board. Having the front straps it is way easier to get on the board in light (marginal) conditions. For me marginal conditions is around 7 knts. Kite still flies well but with very little power. When well powered strapless works well.
When you get more experience, it does not matter :thumb:

I was so convinced that straps would help in marginal conditions, so had straps on when I was out the very first time on my new marginal wind setup (5-6 knots wind) with a bigger and floatier board.

But to my surprise it appeared quickly, that you could go just as low without straps - no problems.

Of course you have to fly the big kite back and fourth (no matter if a light LEI or a foilkite) on long lines, and then when you slowly start to turn and dive the kite, everything goes in slowmotion - so you have to time everything right, meaning you actually turn the board on its side while you have pulled the kite to dive/loop it - so being "ahead" with your kite control, and knowing you can time the rest eventhough these big kites on long lines in marginal wind takes forever till they pull, is the key :-)

Maybe you can start even earlier without straps, as you can put your front foot even further forward thus avoid the tail from sinking once up ?

Anyways - I was surprised that I had absolutely no gain in marginal wind waterstarting, with straps :naughty:

8) PF

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Re: Pros and Cons of learning strapless

Postby Regis-de-giens » Mon Sep 19, 2016 8:06 am

Peter_Frank wrote:But to my surprise it appeared quickly, that you could go just as low without straps - no problems.

Of course you have to fly the big kite back and fourth (no matter if a light LEI or a foilkite) on long lines, and then when you slowly start to turn and dive the kite, everything goes in slowmotion - so you have to time everything right, meaning you actually turn the board on its side while you have pulled the kite to dive/loop it - so being "ahead" with your kite control, and knowing you can time the rest eventhough these big kites on long lines in marginal wind takes forever till they pull, is the key :-)
Same for me, and this is also why a loop or a double loop is efficient when waterstarting strapless in low wind. First 1/2 loop to tension the line and put pressure on the foot to adhere to the board, then get both hands on the bar for the second 1/2 or 1.5 loop.

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Re: Pros and Cons of learning strapless

Postby Flag53 » Mon Sep 19, 2016 9:31 am

Thanks for all the great replies guys !

I'm not really going out in super light winds just yet as I'm still trying to cope with the basics , but I could see how straps would be advantageous in really light winds for relaunching.

Hey " Bradford " I've had the same thing happen once already but not whilst Gybing, as the whole foil flipped through the lines and looped the kite down onto the water.
Luckily I sorted it before the kite relaunched.

I've been learning on a Shinn El Stubbo set up but have had some " issues" so traded it in for a Moses setup .
Hopefully Going to get out today on the new board and foil so I'll let you know how I get on.

Thanks Again ;-)

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Re: Pros and Cons of learning strapless

Postby omg » Mon Sep 19, 2016 12:31 pm

Definitely go with strapless.

I have now 4 or 5 sessions behind me and on the last sessions I have been able to ride both directions as long as I want and on the last session I was able to do S-turns (going heel to toeside and back) on foil. I have ridden a long time strapless surfboards so that helps I believe. First session I mostly focused on riding the board flat and only at the end of the session (all have been 1hour/each session) I tried to get on foil. I think this one key to get up and running quickly. And then, only very controllably get on foil, but keeping it low height wise, ie. don't get greedy. Step by step, get yourself higher on foil. That's pretty much it, I believe.

Good luck!


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